Jeff Gordon bemoans mileage

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TonyB

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The Full Story At That's Racin'

When Jeff Gordon won last year's race at Kansas Speedway, his second win in the two years this track has hosted Winston Cup events, it was his second straight win. Since that race, however, Gordon has only one other victory, a win at Martinsville on April 13.
One big concern for Gordon is the fuel mileage his team has been getting in the No. 24 Chevrolets in a year where that has played a major role in determining the outcome of several races.

"We didn't risk it a couple of times and came in and lost track position, couldn't make it up and didn't win," Gordon said. "Other guys risked it and won the race. The next time around, we risked it and ran out. It's a frustrating thing."

Gordon also admitted to being a little curious at how some other teams - particularly Ryan Newman's team - have been getting so many more miles on a load of fuel.

"I can tell you our motors are running very well," Gordon said. "We're probably turning as much RPM as anybody ... and so we're going to eat up more fuel mileage.

"The thing that definitely raises an eyebrow to me is that the No. 12 car (Newman's Dodge) has one of the best engines out there and yet gets some of the best fuel milage, too. And I don't know how that happens. ...As far as making a lot of power and getting to it to go farther, you must have more fuel in the tank.

"Obviously, if it's a concern to us then certainly NASCAR has an eye on it also. I feel confident in them that if there is something going on that they're going to go after it. ...They've focused on the fuel cells and the size of the fuel cells and how anybody could possibly get more fuel in. ...I'm confident NASCAR is looking into that and trying to figure out it.

"Meanwhile, it's our job to get the best fuel mileage and get as much fuel in our tank as we possibly can and go from there."
 
Newman is getting ~4.8 mpg. I can't figure out why everyone thinks this is impossible? Gordon himself was the beneficiary of some very good engineering a few years ago when he could run away from the field with old or 2 new tires. If his engineering edge was possible, he and his team (and everyone else for the matter), needs to start warming up their slide rules.
 
DOH! I think you're right!...just being a little extra dense tonight...
 
Originally posted by Windsor377@Oct 4 2003, 09:37 PM
Newman is getting ~4.8 mpg. I can't figure out why everyone thinks this is impossible? Gordon himself was the beneficiary of some very good engineering a few years ago when he could run away from the field with old or 2 new tires. If his engineering edge was possible, he and his team (and everyone else for the matter), needs to start warming up their slide rules.
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Windsor your the grru here. Is 4.8 gal posible at 800 HP? I hate being a doubter, but I can't make this work in my computer (brain). I'm more in the 4gpm and that pushin it. Oh bye the way more power to him if he can. Just hope nascar don't change rules , on account of he can.
 
GORDON bemoans someone else running off and hiding due to a mysterious 'advantage'??????? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
 
Originally posted by 97forever@Oct 4 2003, 11:32 PM
GORDON bemoans someone else running off and hiding due to a mysterious 'advantage'??????? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Did you find that amusing 97? ;)
 
Originally posted by EJL+Oct 4 2003, 10:21 PM--></span><table border='0' align='center' width='95%' cellpadding='3' cellspacing='1'><tr><td>QUOTE (EJL @ Oct 4 2003, 10:21 PM)</td></tr><tr><td id='QUOTE'> <!--QuoteBegin--Windsor377@Oct 4 2003, 09:37 PM
Newman is getting ~4.8 mpg.  I can't figure out why everyone thinks this is impossible?  Gordon himself was the beneficiary of some very good engineering a few years ago when he could run away from the field with old or 2 new tires.  If his engineering edge was possible, he and his team (and everyone else for the matter), needs to start warming up their slide rules.
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Windsor your the grru here. Is 4.8 gal posible at 800 HP? I hate being a doubter, but I can't make this work in my computer (brain). I'm more in the 4gpm and that pushin it. Oh bye the way more power to him if he can. Just hope nascar don't change rules , on account of he can. [/b][/quote]
Fair enough question. I guess to start we need to understand the hp ratings/claims. In my world hp is a result of 600 rpm/sec pulls. Many Cup/BGN/CTS ratings are from either steady state of 100 rpm/sec pulls. The differences when compared can be anywhere from 45-60hp in these ranges.

The basic difference in the rating methods has to do with the dynamics of the racing environments. Drag Race engines may cycle upi to 5 times in less than 7 seconds over a distance of 1/4 mile. A Circle Track engine will cycle much slower while staying in 1 (sometimes 2) tranny gears for the distance of the track. It's important for the Circle Track engine guys to know what the engine is doing in these slow cycles.

That being said, a Cup engine is now really a 750~770 hp engine. Can an engine designed for torque instead of RPM do that? I'm convinced it can. The entire car/chassis needs to be set up to work with it though.
 
Little more to think about and somewhat related to an earlier topic that covered valve timing and overlap somewhat.

I heard a pretty interesting piece of info related to valve timing from a very successful NHRA, IHRA and NMRA competitor/engine "guy" type. It backs up my own personnal algorithms, but it was still good to hear.

One a piece of paper, draw a 2" x 2" square. No next to it, draw a 1" (length) x 4" (height) rectangle.

Imagine both of those shapes represent the valve lift area of 2 different engines. Each has an area of 4 sq". Each has the ability to support the same rpm for engines of the same displacement. One will produce more torque over a greater rpm range and as a result will also produce more hp IFF the valve train is stabilized at the higher rpm ranges. Additionally, the same engine will get better fuel milage because less raw fuel is sent flying out the exhaust side during the overlap period (because there is a much short overlap event).

Any guesses, which valve timing does all these good things?
 
Any guesses, which valve timing does all these good things?

Nope. :D

Funny is that my old English sports cars used to have chock wheels on the distributers for micro adjustments. I always thought about putting a flexible extension like a choke cable on one them so I could adjust from inside the car. With the new in-car computers I guess the F1 guys can retune the car to just about any deal they want now.

And no, it does not surprise me that an engineer has figured out how to stretch the mileage while retaining power.

As for Jeff doing the Miss Peach impersonation....oh wah oh wah oh wah....it's not like he's the first and I'm sure he won't be the last. I might not think the kid is "all that" but I sure ain't gonna blast him for doing what most all the others do also.
 
Originally posted by 71Fan@Oct 5 2003, 09:22 AM
Any guesses, which valve timing does all these good things?

Nope. :D
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That's actually a pretty good answer...because, just like all things, there's always another "if, and, or but" just around the corner.

Camshafts producing each of the above valve lift area "curves", can make excellent HP in an engine with cylinder head flow curves to match. That is, one will make good HP with very strong low to mid lift flow rates, the other will make good HP with weak low lift flow rates but very strong high lift flow rates. Swap the two camshaft/cylinder head combinations and you will have to very expensive turds.
 
Just sounds to me like jeff can't stand someone else winning so many races. he didn't complain back in the 90's when he was the one with the mysterious advantage and was winning 7 to 13 races a year. but that just my opinion.
 
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