“Put anyone in that car and they will win”

ChexOrWrex

Ya gotta wanna
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We’ve heard this “car vs driver” argument with the likes of Jimmie Johnson, Jeff Gordon, Kyle Busch, Kevin Harvick, etc... but it remained theoretical because those teams are not rotating drivers.

Now take the Xfinity #42. In 3 seasons, 5 drivers have gotten their first career Xfinity win in that car - not to mention Larson winning in that car as well.

Does this add merit to the argument that in the modern era there is more reliance on the car’s set up than the driver’s skill?
 
Hell yea it’s the damn car .. we watch something that’s based on a car not the person driving it lol.. I like Kyle Busch because his attitude.. but it be the cars not these drivers lol.. the guys up front just got the chance to be on s bigger team that’s all .
 
Yeah, the car has everything to do with it, and I love it. Manufacturers (and teams) need to step up before NASCAR takes the car out of the equation, and we have a spec series which will be the death blow for NASCAR. Right now, Ford has the package (handed to them by NASCAR). I love it. This is absolutely their championship to lose on the driver's and manufacturer's side. I love MY Toyotas as the underdogs, and take huge joy in the listening to the crickets as the Fords tend to be 1-2 tenths better especially on the 1.5's. Remember Kez's "rude awakening" bull****? Seems like a long time ago. Anyway, it boggles my mind that NASCAR went to a package next year to "level the playing field." What separates this sport from others is the car, and we do everything we can to take it out of the equation. ****** why? WHY? Take that element away, and we are left to compare our athletes to the likes of Lebron. There is no comparison.
 
We’ve heard this “car vs driver” argument with the likes of Jimmie Johnson, Jeff Gordon, Kyle Busch, Kevin Harvick, etc... but it remained theoretical because those teams are not rotating drivers.

Now take the Xfinity #42. In 3 seasons, 5 drivers have gotten their first career Xfinity win in that car - not to mention Larson winning in that car as well.

Does this add merit to the argument that in the modern era there is more reliance on the car’s set up than the driver’s skill?

It is pretty evident It is the car now days, most of the time when one of the top few gets out front it is almost impossible to pass them even when they are a slower car than the one behind. Sure some drivers can get more out of a car then others but there are only a few seats available where it really shows up. BTW if Nascar went basketballing, there would be hidden lasers guiding the balls with sensors steering it into the hoop.
 
It is pretty evident It is the car now days, most of the time when one of the top few gets out front it is almost impossible to pass them even when they are a slower car than the one behind. Sure some drivers can get more out of a car then others but there are only a few seats available where it really shows up. BTW if Nascar went basketballing, there would be hidden lasers guiding the balls with sensors steering it into the hoop.

I agree, but we can't let this get so far out of hand that we actually start to hate what makes this sport different--the damn car. Damn, give me Brewer and the tech garage back! Please! I am begging!
 
It is impossible to make the cars the same. Very similar if the same company built all of them, but they don't.
 
It is impossible to make the cars the same. Very similar if the same company built all of them, but they don't.

Of course it's impossible, and there is nothing wrong with that. Part of the awesomeness of this sport is to watch Kyle Busch take a car clearly 1-2 tenths slower than the SHR Fords, and watch him wheel it to get close. If you are spec, that aspect is gone, and it is simply driver v. driver in a sport which is more than that. It is a shame that when a manufacturer gets an edge, the obsession of this fan base is to take it away......I should have said when MY Toyotas get an edge. Love the sound of those crickets. Chirp, chirp, chirp, chirp.....
 
Of course it's impossible, and there is nothing wrong with that. Part of the awesomeness of this sport is to watch Kyle Busch take a car clearly 1-2 tenths slower than the SHR Fords, and watch him wheel it to get close. If you are spec, that aspect is gone, and it is simply driver v. driver in a sport which is more than that. It is a shame that when a manufacturer gets an edge, the obsession of this fan base is to take it away......I should have said when MY Toyotas get an edge. Love the sound of those crickets. Chirp, chirp, chirp, chirp.....

figured it would get down to a TRD KDB commercial.
 
Another example is watching the three or four young Xfinity drivers rotate around from the 22 Penske car to the 60 Ford to occasionally the SHR affiliate car Beagi or something like that.. Although I don't think any of them are going to be standouts, the 22 car hands down has the lopsided win record over all of the others, same drivers different cars.
 
You need good equipment to compete with good equipment but you also need skill to get it done.

Right. But this current package allows some teams to absolutely runaway with it F1 style. At the last Michigan race it was incredible to see how much faster Harvick was through the corner than everyone else.

Right now our biggest problem is the engineers are taking the driving skill somewhat out of it. Just look at Almirola, he’s went from a mid pack guy no one cares about to a title contender. IMO it’s amazing what Kyle Busch has done this season considering how bad his team has been
 
Right. But this current package allows some teams to absolutely runaway with it F1 style. At the last Michigan race it was incredible to see how much faster Harvick was through the corner than everyone else.

Right now our biggest problem is the engineers are taking the driving skill somewhat out of it. Just look at Almirola, he’s went from a mid pack guy no one cares about to a title contender. IMO it’s amazing what Kyle Busch has done this season considering how bad his team has been
Explain how the majority of wins this year are by the same drivers. Seems the same drivers win no matter what package is offered. The car every time? No. The driver every time.
 
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Explain how the majority of wins this year are by the same drivers. Seems the same drivers win no matter what package is offered. The car every time? No. The driver every time.
huh?
Another example is watching the three or four young Xfinity drivers rotate around from the 22 Penske car to the 60 Ford to occasionally the SHR affiliate car Beagi or something like that.. Although I don't think any of them are going to be standouts, the 22 car hands down has the lopsided win record over all of the others, same drivers different cars.
 
huh?
Another example is watching the three or four young Xfinity drivers rotate around from the 22 Penske car to the 60 Ford to occasionally the SHR affiliate car Beagi or something like that.. Although I don't think any of them are going to be standouts, the 22 car hands down has the lopsided win record over all of the others, same drivers different cars.
Because the rest of the drivers suck?
 
Explain how the majority of wins this year are by the same drivers. Seems the same drivers win no matter what package is offered. The car every time? No. The driver every time.
Then why didn't Kyle Busch win the championship last year?

It takes both, but Homestead proved car beats driver.
 
Kevin won with Connie and Wayne when nobody else could do it. Then he won in an RCR pile after Dale died. Then he won in a new team car...
Then why didn't Kyle Busch win the championship last year?
It takes both, but Homestead proved car beats driver.
Playoff bull****t.
Danica would lap the field in the 42. After all, it’s all car.
@AndyMarquisLive could win in the 42 Xfin ride. Amirite?
 
Kevin won with Connie and Wayne when nobody else could do it. Then he won in an RCR pile after Dale died. Then he won in a new team car...

Playoff bull****t.
I always felt Harvick would win a championship in his first season with a new team if he left Childress, and he did.

A better car was the difference between winning a handful of races and winning the championship. Plus the playoff **** hurts him more than anyone. Guy reminds me of Mark Martin, he might not always get the wins but he'll get you consistently in the top 5 or top 10.

It's a total combination. But in the end, if you have a race between a a great driver in a good car and a good driver in a great car, the good driver is increasingly more likely to win.

If driver won races, Kyle Busch would be a 7 time champion and have over 100 Cup wins.
 
I always felt Harvick would win a championship in his first season with a new team if he left Childress, and he did.

A better car was the difference between winning a handful of races and winning the championship. Plus the playoff sh!t hurts him more than anyone. Guy reminds me of Mark Martin, he might not always get the wins but he'll get you consistently in the top 5 or top 10.
Like with Mark, consistency is all driver, not car. Get on a radio and listen to Kyle when he’s driving junk and still beating half of the field. A good driver can wheel a bad car. A bad driver can struggle with a good car.
Anyone think Cope would win in the 4,18, 2, 22, 41?
 
Chemistry matters too. A great driver, Crew Chef, and great equipment may not guarantee great results.
 
There's good cars with bad drivers and bad cars with good drivers. It takes both to do things like Truex last year, Harvick this year, Johnson in his prime, Gordon, Busch, Keselowski etc.
 
I always felt Harvick would win a championship in his first season with a new team if he left Childress, and he did.

A better car was the difference between winning a handful of races and winning the championship. Plus the playoff sh!t hurts him more than anyone. Guy reminds me of Mark Martin, he might not always get the wins but he'll get you consistently in the top 5 or top 10.

It's a total combination. But in the end, if you have a race between a a great driver in a good car and a good driver in a great car, the good driver is increasingly more likely to win.

If driver won races, Kyle Busch would be a 7 time champion and have over 100 Cup wins.
Not a chance. Lol

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I just find it funny how its, "car wins", for everyone except Kyle Busch, as if he's the only one who can makeup a tenth or two on the best cars all year.

Despite other drivers doing it year after year.

Someone holds off Kyle, or finds an extra tenth or two on a final run? Car. 18 does it? Its all Kyle. 5

But yeah, its Kyle who wins on skill, and would be a 7x champion if it was all skill. Despite there being a 7x champion who has won 30+ races on clutch driving, and has a better resume when it comes to winning with non dominant cars.

Fact of the matter is that prime JJ won more races with non-dominant cars than Kyle has, so whats the difference?


Its a fair balance between driver and car. Today, just a tad more than car.

But lets not pretend Kyle is the Only driver who can find an extra tenth or two. Its ignorant and disrespectful to other good drivers

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