2017 Supercross Championship

KTMLew01

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Tomac won 9 races but lost championship while being a douche'. Never liked seeing people use "the bumper" to pass. Dungey should have put him in the cheap seats after the second take-out attempt by Tomac. I hate that ****. Didn't like what Osborne did either in the 250 race. Guess i just don't have a competitive spirit.
 

gnomesayin

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A couple of separate issues here.

1) I agree with what @LewTheShoe posted regarding the points scale being too flat and not properly rewarding wins. Unfortunately this is a common problem throughout many forms of motorsports.

2) I do not have a beef with how Tomac chose to race. It was by definition not 'dirty' because none of the love taps he gave Dungey were enough to wreck him or even come that close to doing so. Tomac did what he had to do have a chance in his situation, and backed Dungey up to try to force a mistake. I also had no problem with Lewis Hamilton's tactics last year in the F1 finale, though in that case he was trying to sabotage his teammate, which obviously adds another wrinkle.

To me though, no matter. I have no idea why racing fans put so much stock in championships, but expect the top racers in the world competing for them to give up so easily and attempt nothing but an orderly procession toward the finish. I also have no idea how anyone can believe that the race leader doesn't have the right to control the pace as he sees fit.

Tomac could have put Dungey on the ground if he wanted to, and he did not. I give him credit for trying everything.he could within the bounds of fair play, but not sinking to the level of crashing Dungey out. I give Dungey a lot of credit for surviving. It was a great race and suspenseful to the end, yet somehow wasn't even the best race of the night. The 250 main was even better, and congrats to Zach Osborne for his awesome comeback ride.

That was the best Vegas SX final I have seen.
 

LewTheShoe

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^ I agree with *almost* everything Gnomesayin wrote. I have no problem with Tomac backing the pace down to engage the slower riders in the fight, if he did that. I don't object to rough, physical block passes... whatever it takes to get by.

However, I do think Tomac crossed over the line into cheap shot racing. When a rider is able to pass cleanly, but instead elects to crash his opponent or run him off the track so he'll lose more positions, that is over the line to me. And that is what Eli did, IMO, three times in this race. I think Dungey handled it well in his post race comments, initially referring to the cheap shots one time, but then taking the high road.

I hate to see nine wins losing to three wins. Winning is worth 3 points versus running second, and the other relevant spots are worth 2 points per position, so there is very little reward to the winner... like Nascar used to be.

Las Vegas was by far the best, most racy track of the year. The bikes touched 60 mph, and several spots went into the 40's, with some quick corners too. At most tracks, the riders are 15 to 25 mph the whole lap, maybe reaching 30-32 mph for a brief instant. I liked Las Vegas a lot more.
 

kyle18fan

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Congrats to Ryan Dungey and Roger Decoster !!! three in a row
 

DUN24

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I'm a big Tomac fan but yeah I didn't care much for the racecraft... his only chance was to get dungey dumped though so, what do ya do?



How about that 250 east championship though?!? Ciancirulo almost stole it! What an epic comeback from Osbourne and fade from Savatgy. Crazy racing.
 

KTMLew01

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If I was Dungey, after second round of being taken high, i would have done a Reed move and cleaned out Tomac's front wheel next corner. If all is fair, then all is fair. All Dungey had to do to win Championship was prevent Tomac from winning. So if what Osborne did it ligit then it works both ways. Knock him out!:boxing:
 

gnomesayin

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However, I do think Tomac crossed over the line into cheap shot racing. When a rider is able to pass cleanly, but instead elects to crash his opponent or run him off the track so he'll lose more positions, that is over the line to me. And that is what Eli did, IMO, three times in this race. I think Dungey handled it well in his post race comments, initially referring to the cheap shots one time, but then taking the high road.
I agree Dungey handled it well, given his perspective. He held his composure very well during and after the race. Of the three times Tomac passed Dungey, the first one was just a mildly aggressive box out type pass. He “stood him up“ in the corner, no contact. If it had just been that, nobody even remembers it. The second and third passes were definitely more aggressive and rougher. The second time he creatively forced Dungey off the track in what was his best chance to put Dungey behind several other riders. The third time he made real contact. I saw him throw an elbow toward Dungey and didn't particularly like that, thought it was a bit much for my taste. But it was nothing compared to what Osborne did to Savagty in the 250 main, or Anderson torpedoing Reed. Here are some other things I didn't like that swung in Dungey's favor, and are all part of the larger context:

1. The big obvious one, Musquin pulling over for Dungey last week and gifting him a win and three points. I believe this made Tomac more willing to engage in some edgy tactics.

2. Jason Anderson, not even officially Dungey's teammate, but his training partner and rider for a team who receives considerable KTM support, acting as Dungey's personal escort and enforcer for much of the race. He had the pace to pass Dungey throughout given what Tomac was doing, but wasn't going to do it unless he knew he could pass Tomac too. He dive-bombed Chad Reed when it appeared Reed was set to catch Dungey and mix it up.

I sometimes don't like it when racers try too hard and get too aggressive and in trying to win or get the best finish. Sometimes it goes too far. I really don't like it when racers purposely don't do their best to aid another competitor in the field. How many 'allies', as the broadcast team termed it, did Dungey have out there holding up for him as necessary? Musquin had a bad race and wasn't up there, but there was still Anderson and Baggett for a while who were willing to be loyal lieutenants and never were going to put themselves between Tomac and Dungey. I don't care for that.

Las Vegas was by far the best, most racy track of the year. The bikes touched 60 mph, and several spots went into the 40's, with some quick corners too. At most tracks, the riders are 15 to 25 mph the whole lap, maybe reaching 30-32 mph for a brief instant. I liked Las Vegas a lot more.
Agreed, most of the track designs throughout the season are poor and do not aid competitiveness. If I remember correctly, I really liked the Glendale track, which also featured longer straights, wide corners, etc.

The announcers were pretty poor last night. I like Ralph Shaheen and appreciate his enthusiasm, which comes off as natural to me. Emig is knowledgeable, but so laid back and safe as an analyst. They sounded like idiots by avoiding the obvious and never mentioning what Tomac was actually doing, and instead describing Tomac's litany of 'little mistakes' that kept allowing Dungey and the entire top 6 or 7 to catch up to him. If I recall, NBC's American F1 broadcasters were quite upfront about Lewis Hamilton backing up Rosberg last year. These guys needed to drop the PR and admit what was happening, as that was what was making the race exciting.
 

gnomesayin

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Here is the post-race press conference that shows mutual respect between the two.

 

Hotrod

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Those were the best finals I have seen in a long long time.
 
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