Article: Moving dates

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TN-Ward-Fan

Guest
From TR.

France may put some events
in racing's rearview mirror
By JENNA FRYER
The Associated Press

With its rough, gravelly surface and odd corners that give it its famous egg shape, Darlington Raceway is an aging relic in the day of glistening new race tracks.
But as NASCAR's first paved superspeedway, the 54-year-old South Carolina track has a history few facilities can match.

That might not be enough, though, for Darlington to keep its two Winston Cup races a year.

Under a plan to realign its schedule, the tracks where the sport started are endangered species. NASCAR plans to take a hard look at its 36-race schedule, hoping to move events in 2004 out of the crowded Southeast and into larger markets where it can reach new fans.

NASCAR chairman Bill France Jr. targeted Darlington, North Carolina Speedway in Rockingham, Atlanta Motor Speedway and Lowe's Motor Speedway as tracks that might lose one of their races a year.

The announcement caught track operators by surprise, especially at Darlington and Rockingham - two facilities clinging to their two Winston Cup races a year amid longtime rumors that they were in danger of losing at least one date.

"There are a number of large markets out there with beautiful facilities that only have one race a year, and here we are sitting on two dates with four other races within a rock's throw of us," said Darlington president Andrew Gurtis.

"We know there are fans throughout this great nation who want to see Winston Cup racing live, so we accept that there has to be changes made to keep this sport growing. And the truth is, this is an old track."

Gurtis isn't conceding anything. But like Rockingham general manager Chris Browning, he walks a fine line - their tracks are owned by International Speedway Corp., which is run by the France family.

If NASCAR wants to move races from tracks the France family owns, there's little Darlington and Rockingham's operators can do.

"We haven't been selling out and we sit in the middle of a saturated market," Browning said. "So if moving one of our dates to another market could sell tickets and give fans a chance to see racing in other parts of the country, it's hard for me to say that's not good for the sport. That's just the way we have to look at it."

Atlanta and Lowe's, the other two tracks France targeted, are owned by France rival Bruton Smith and his Speedway Motorsports Inc.

Smith has been begging NASCAR for years to give him a second race date at Texas Motor Speedway, and under France's proposal, Smith can get that date if he forfeits one of his races at SMI's other tracks and moves it to Texas.

Smith said there was "zero chance" of that happening.

Truthfully, there's nothing wrong with the Atlanta or Charlotte tracks.

Atlanta offers some of the fastest speeds in NASCAR on its 1.54-mile quad-oval. But weather has long been a problem, even though last season it moved its November race to early October, only to see rain again wash out most of the weekend. Plus, the track doesn't always sell out.

Charlotte is considered NASCAR's home base, and the teams love to compete at the facility because they can sleep at home three weekends a year.

The Coca-Cola 600 is one of the toughest tickets in racing, and The Winston, the annual all-star race held the week before, is a glamorous dash for cash run under the lights.

The October race doesn't sell out, although track organizers hope that changes this year when it moves from a Sunday afternoon event to a Saturday night race on prime time television.

But France is looking for a solution to the Texas problem - an SMI shareholder is suing NASCAR over getting the second date - as well as help the sport grow outside its Southern roots.

So even if Smith doesn't want to give up dates at any of his tracks, France will likely have to take something away from his tracks to make the realignment plan work and encourage other track owners to participate.

That's unsettling to some of the drivers.

"Darlington, with its history, its probably the only track that can say every NASCAR great has raced there," said Ward Burton, a two-time Darlington winner. "If NASCAR wants to change the schedule, there should be ways for them to do it without taking things away from places who don't deserve it."

Even though Darlington and Rockingham have spent millions of dollars on improvements in the past decade to keep up with the shiny new facilities that have popped up in California, Las Vegas, Chicago and Kansas City, seating capacity is small, and except for Darlington's Southern 500 on Labor Day weekend, the tracks don't sell out.

Martinsville (Va.) Speedway, a 56-year-old family-owned short track located less than 100 miles from Charlotte, has no problem filling its 80,000 seats twice a year.

The Campbell family has spent its money to keep amenities current, but because it is located in a tiny market that lacks the hotel and restaurant access that NASCAR has listed as a criteria in its realignment plan, it might not be long before Martinsville falls onto France's list.

"I wouldn't want to be in NASCAR's shoes on this," said

president Clay Campbell. "So many of us have been here when the times were hard in this sport and everyone is experiencing the good times now. It won't be easy for NASCAR to pick who to cut out of, especially when we all played a part in getting the sport where it is today."

***********end of article*************

I really hate to see Darlington and Rockingham lose dates. I also thought Ward's comment was particularly relevent.

But if they're gonna do it, I say do it to every track. Nobody gets 2 dates. Daytona, Talladega, Atlanta, Michigan, Bristol, Charlotte, Martinsville, NH, Pocono, Dover, Richmond...all of them lose a date too. If we're selling our soul to the corporate devil, sell all of it. 36 races on 36 tracks. Spread the wealth. Attract the huddled masses. Turn the dollar, even at the expense of the very facilities that made you, that carried you when nobody else really cared. Heck, why not even write in a sellout clause. If a track fails to sell out for three out of any five years, pull their event and move on. And while we're at it, see if we can't work in a few more coast to coast trips too. You know, North Carolina to Arizona to Florida in consecutive weeks. The teams just love that. Here's my proposed schedule:


Feb 16: Daytona 500, Daytona FL
Feb 23: Phoenix International Raceway, Phoenix AZ
March 2: Homestead-Miami Speedway, Miami FL
March 9: Las Vegas Motor Speedway, Las Vegas NV
March 16: Atlanta Motor Speedway, Atlanta GA
March 23: Irwindale Speedway, Irwindale CA
March 30: Talladega Superspeedway, Talladega AL
April 6: Indianapolis Motor Speedway, Indianapolis IN
April 13: Pike's Peak Speedway, Pike's Peak CO
April 27: The Milwaukee Mile, Milwaukee WI
May 3: Texas Motor Speedway, Fort Worth TX
May 17: The Winston, held at a track randomly determined by lottery
May 25: Lowe's Motor Speedway, Charlotte NC
June 1: New Hampshire International Speedway, Loudon, NH
June 8: Evergreen Speedway, WA
June 15: Gateway Speedway, St. Louis, MO
June 22: Dover International Speedway, Dover DE
July 5: Bristol Motor Speedway, Bristol TN
July 13: Michigan International Speedway, Brooklyn, MI
July 20: California Speedway, Fontana, CA
July 27: Nashville Speedway, Lebanon TN
Aug 3: Infineon Raceway, Sonoma CA
Aug 10: Pocono Raceway, Long Pond PA
Aug 17: Kansas Motor Speedway, Kansas City, KS
Aug 23: Richmond International Raceway, Richmond VA
August 31: Darlington Raceway, Darlington SC
Sept 6: Nazareth, PA
Sept 14: Mesa Marin, CA
Sept 21: Watkins Glen International, Watkins Glen NY
Sept 28: Martinsvilel Speedway, Martinsville VA
Oct 5: Memphis Motorsport Park, Memphis TN
Oct 11: Riverside, CA
Oct 19: Chicagoland Speedway, Joliet, IL
Oct 26: South Boston Speedway, South Boston VA
Nov 2: Myrtle Beach Speedway, Myrtle Beach SC
Nov 9: Kentucky Speedway, KY
Nov 16: North Carolina Motor Speedway, Rockingham, NC


There, that makes sense.

:blink:
 
Originally posted by TN-Ward-Fan
Sept 14:  Mesa Marin, CA

Ya know TN, I have to agree with you. I really like your idea, especially the Mesa Marin date. I would love to see 36 races on 35 different racetracks. I would hope that they would add more road courses and short tracks instead of tracks like Kansas or Vegas.
 
TWF your a sick man.
do you think we ought to give all the transporter drivers your home address. i am sure they all would like to send you a thank you card for making their jobs so much easier.
 
I don not like the way this thing is going.
We could lose one and possibly both races at tracks that hold very good racing and has history to tracks that don't have very good racing and no history. 2 races at Cali no thank you. Especaily if it takes a race from The Rock or Martinisville. I am glad that DOver has not been talked about. If any track actually does lose a race I hope they replace it with Nashville or Kentucky and not Kansas or Chicago, those tracks are simialr already. If we lose 1 Darlinton race they need to move it to a good race track up in the North West. There really is no races over there. I wounder why Pocono has not been mentioned as losing a race. Thats the one track that just about every fan wants to lose a race at.
I read over at jayski that ISC would like to add a second race at Phoniex.

2nd California Race for sure? Bill France is laying out a plan to make some major changes in the 2004 schedule, which it appears almost certain will include two Cup races at the International Speedway Corp.'s Fontana, Calif., track, and a second Cup date at either ISC's Kansas track or Phoenix. NASCAR sources are telling Kansas officials that that track would likely get the second date. Even though the Chicago track would appear to be the more logical choice - because it's the third biggest market in the country - Kansas is owned 100 percent by ISC, but Chicago is a joint venture between ISC and Indianapolis Speedway's Tony George.(Winston Salem Journal)(1-27-2003)
 
Originally posted by PettyBenson4510
I don not like the way this thing is going.
We could lose one and possibly both races at tracks that hold very good racing and has history to tracks that don't have very good racing and no history.

History and competitiveness have nothing to do with it. Who cares if the racing's any good, so long as we expose the sport to a few more people and pop a dollar in our pocket.

NASCAR doesn't care about the racing any more. That's pretty obvious. Bruton Smith, Bill France Jr., and a few other power brokers are too busy adding numbers to notice the racing. They're counting noses instead of lead changes. They act like they're running a rock tour....maximum exposure, no matter what. Well, if that's the goal, then go full force. No track with 2 dates. History be damned. Competition be damned. Butts in seats and bottom line.

Can you tell I'm a tad miffed about this? :p
 
Originally posted by TN-Ward-Fan
Can you tell I'm a tad miffed about this?  :p

Me too. The day they get rid of Bristol or Richmond is going to be the day I leave NASCAR. But, as long as they get their money, they don't care.
 
Originally posted by de7xwcc
TWF your a sick man.  
do you think we ought to give all the transporter drivers your home address. i am sure they all would like to send you a thank you card for making their jobs so much easier.

I do see your point though. It doesn't mean that a team just has to have one transporter driver.
 
They can't have only 1 race at every track(i like the idea) but there is not enought tracks around that could hold the 75,000 to 200,000 people that NASCAR needs or wants. well if you want to add a few more road races in then there could be. I would liek there two be 2 races at Daytona, Dega, 3 at Bristol, 3 Martinsville,Dover, Lowes, Richmond and Rock. Thats 18 races, leaving 18 spots for other tracks.
 
Originally posted by PettyBenson4510
They can't  have only 1 race at every track(i liek the idrea) but there is not enought tracks around that could hold the 75,000 to 200,000 people that NASCAR needs or wants. well if you want to add a few more road races in then there could be. I would liek there two be 2 races at Daytona, Dega, 3 at Bristol, 3 Martinsville,Dover, Lowes, and Rock. Thats 16 races, leaving 20 spots for other tarcks.

I would like to have Daytona and Talladega off the schedual.
 
Of the tracks i listed I think it would be best if they either had one a night race or all races a night race.
 
Intersting theory, conjecture, whatever you want to call it. I think it will come down to the tracks with the most leverage, the ones that don't have it lose a date. We need more racing in the west that is for sure. I'd like to see PPIR get a date, i can't see PIR getting another one . Phoenix has a lot of scheduled races throughout the season and they start early , Feb2 i think this year with Winston West and support series. A race in Washington state would be cool, and another New England track, either Lime Rock, Thompson, or Stafford would be cool too. Of course changes to the seating at hese venues would be needed. The bottom line is folks.......things are going to change whether we like it or not, it progress, greed, business ....whatever you want to call it, but it will happen sooner than later.
 
Money is the deciding factor for Nascar. The tracks that don't sell out or don't have enough seats will be left behind.
 
I like your idea about having a race up in Washington state. They need a race up that way.
 
Originally posted by de7xwcc
TWF your a sick man.  
do you think we ought to give all the transporter drivers your home address. i am sure they all would like to send you a thank you card for making their jobs so much easier.


The heck with the card.............. there will be a line of transporter drivers at his front door. I'll be there too. <LOL>


Guido:rolleyes:
 
Originally posted by 66mustang
I do see your point though. &nbsp;It doesn't mean that a team just has to have one transporter driver.

Yeah, but the driver does more than just drive the transporter from race to race. He usually has other duties at the shop.

I know that the original post may have been tounge-in-cheek but a schedule like this wouldn't even allow enough time to do routine maintenance on the hauler. And a second full time driver would be a must.

Guido:satisfied
 
Originally posted by Guido
Yeah, but the driver does more than just drive the transporter from race to race. &nbsp;He usually has other duties at the shop. &nbsp;

I know that the original post may have been tounge-in-cheek but a schedule like this wouldn't even allow enough time to do routine maintenance on the hauler. &nbsp;And a second full time driver would be a must. &nbsp;

Guido:satisfied

I thought the guys who drove the transporters didn't have a shop job. How long does it take to drive one of those trucks from North Carolina to California?
 
I wish they would put Pikes Peak on the schedule, its only a few miles from my house. They are already planning on adding seats to the track. They're also having something called"speedweeks" here in July to correspond with the USAC and Pikes Peak Hill climb races. ought to be interesting.
 
Originally posted by buckaroo
Hey Guido, you could then haul the wife off with you. &nbsp;I'll be she would love that! :)

Hey CB..... I wish that were true. She doesn't handle long road trips very well. : (

Guido
 
TN-Ward

I was Just reviewing your "suggested" schedule in the Initial Posting..<<G>> and couldn't help but notice---you have (4) Califorina Tracks out of 36 Race dates... <<GGG> Are you partial to those Left Coast Trips..??
Maybe they ought to Build shops out there--and take 4-5 cars to those shops... Spend a Month out there---raceing... Of Course---with Stops "Going" in Texas and Phoenix--and Stops Comming Home in Pikes Peak and Kansas city... That would make for a Nice Road Trip--8-9 weeks on the road... Big 8 Motels would be Full all the time then...<<G>>
 
I think "Grand-Pa" Guido--would Like to Tangle with that Hauler--for 8-9 weeks at a time too...<:) :D
 
Originally posted by 66mustang
I thought the guys who drove the transporters didn't have a shop job. &nbsp;How long does it take to drive one of those trucks from North Carolina to California?


Quite often it is the responsibility of the driver to clean out the rig after returning to the shop. He has to swap out the different rear gears that are carried on board for each track. A hauler may carry anywhere from 12 - 15 rear gears assemblies. Different group of ratios for each track so there are always some gears that have to come off the rig and be replaced by others. Those things are heavy too.

Spare motor may have to be swapped out depending on the track (restrictor plate motors are different). Then there are other assemblies such as spare transmissions, shocks, replacement nitrogen tanks.

All of the supplies have to be restocked (motor oil, lubricants etc.), food and beverages purchased for the next trip. Uniforms need to be taken to cleaners and picked up again before setting out to the next track. Because there are many cars in the stable and each car used at certain tracks along with a back-up car, there are various parts (specific to that car) that have to be transferred from the shop to hauler and back again. Then there are portable generators and cool-down units that have to be checked, cleaned and serviced.


On top of that, scheduled maintenance has to be done on the road tractor and the hauler. All of this is usually handled by the hauler driver.

Other than the crew chief, on some teams the hauler driver can be one of the hardest workers on the team. Long hours and little recognition. Depending on the team finances, the less money available means more work from the hauler driver.

Been there and done that! Don't care to do it again. :)

As for the drive to California, with team driving, it is about 44 hours if I remember correctly. That's with 2 drivers doing team driving and not much stopping along the way.


Guido
 
Originally posted by Rowdy3
I think "Grand-Pa" Guido--would Like to Tangle with that Hauler--for 8-9 weeks at a time too...<:) :D

No thanks, sir Willie! :D

Two weeks at a time is enough for me.

Guido
 
Originally posted by Rowdy3
TN-Ward

I was Just reviewing your "suggested" schedule in the Initial Posting..<<G>> and couldn't help but notice---you have &nbsp;(4) Califorina Tracks out of 36 Race dates... <<GGG> &nbsp; &nbsp;Are you partial to those Left Coast Trips..?? &nbsp;
Maybe they ought to Build shops out there--and take 4-5 cars to those shops... &nbsp; Spend a Month out there---raceing... &nbsp; Of Course---with Stops "Going" in Texas and Phoenix--and Stops Comming Home in Pikes Peak and Kansas city... &nbsp; &nbsp; That would make for a Nice Road Trip--8-9 weeks on the road... &nbsp; Big 8 Motels would be Full all the time then...<<G>>

Actually, no. I was being as sarcastic as possible. If I had my druthers, they wouldn't cross the Mississippi River all season. I just think it's preposterous that, as the season winds down, these guys are required to go from Rockingham, NC to Phoenix AZ to Miami FL in consecutive weeks. Especially with as much on the line as they often have as far as points standings go.

The original thrust of the post was that if NASCAR wants to take a race away from some tracks that have 2 dates, then maybe no track should have 2 dates. If the intent is truly as they say, to expose the sport to more fans, then do it right. There are fans who would love to see them race every week at Bristol. I'm not one of them. But it sickens me to see NASCAR selling its roots to turn a dollar. The series wouldn't be what is has become without the Darlingtons, the Rockinghams, the tracks that have been there forever. I mean, let's be brutally honest here. Would you rather see 2 races at Darlington...or at New Hampshire? 2 at Rockingham...or 2 at Texas?

Sadly, no one really CARES what the fans want. They have Sheryl Crow videos to sell. :rolleyes:
 
Originally posted by gordon24fan
Money is the deciding factor for Nascar. The tracks that don't sell out or don't have enough seats will be left behind.

Of course it is about money. If NASCAR principles sat on thier hands and failed to act with the changing demographics of the sport, they would face competition from another source. Would that really be a good thing?? More than likely it would be the same complaints we hear now only directed at a different organization.
As for selling out seats, if the population will not support the series then the organization has the option to move either the date or relocate the event elsewhere, and that is exactly what NASCAR is doing with these plans, relocating to new markets where the sponsor will get a bigger bang for thier buck in a larger fan attendance market.

There is a lot to be said for the history of Dartlington and it should NEVER lose both dates. The same holds true for Martinsville, but the idea of one date anually at each track does have merit.
 
Fans aren't going to Darlington and the Rock TWF...so they are paying attention to the fans.
 
Originally posted by Whizzer
Of course it is about money. If NASCAR principles sat on thier hands and failed to act with the changing demographics of the sport, they would face competition from another source. Would that really be a good thing?? More than likely it would be the same complaints we hear now only directed at a different organization. &nbsp;
As for selling out seats, if the population will not support the series then the organization has the option to move either the date or relocate the event elsewhere, and that is exactly what NASCAR is doing with these plans, relocating to new markets where the sponsor will get a bigger bang for thier buck in a larger fan attendance market.

There is a lot to be said for the history of Dartlington and it should NEVER lose both dates. The same holds true for Martinsville, but the idea of one date anually at each track does have merit.

Couldn't agree more Whizzer. If they can't sell out, why not find a track that can? I see nothing wrong with that. I hate to see Darlington lose a race though.
 
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