I don't know much about economics...

D

Digger

Guest
... and quite frankly don't care about the stock market.

But with the credit problems, morgtage issues, Sprint's problems, record oil prices and now Boomer Nation, I'm starting to worry that ten years from now, I won't be able to provide for myself or any family, espically if I stay in the state of Maryland.

Today, the first boomer applied and starts recieving social security (that I'm paying more than $1,000/year into). Of course, the fear Mr. Bush has outlined is that social security won't be around 30 years from now, and changes need to be made. I agree!

But the good ol' Democratic Party said, leave it as is. :D

So now, the tsunami has begun, and over a time period of several years, that $1,500-$3,000 adds up, especially when I'm trying to pay for college and provide food for myself. Granted, I recieve most of my tax dollars back, but not social security or MD Medicare Tax (while most of MD's middle-class can't afford nor qualifies for medicare).

And then today, oil companies reported profits down. Boo hoo, right? Well, oil prices are at $85/barrell, and economists believe oil companies are afraid to raise gas prices because the Democrats have threatened them repeatedly with investigations and charges for price gauging. Well, when the oil comapnies hurt, so is the rest of the stock market.

Add that to the already large problems with credit, and the economy heading into a recession.

And now, Comcast says they can't give us FOX Business Channel HD so we'll be ou t of the loop around here.

And MARYLAND is getting ready to raise the sale tax and the general taxes AGAIN!!! :mad:

Republicans in office = Economy good.
Democrats in office = Economy bad.
 
While I'll agree with a lot you said the last is not necessarily the way I'd phrase it. Fiscal conservatives = good. Either party is going to blame the other as they don't know much about economics either. They fail to realize that every time there has been a cut in taxes the tax revenues have gone up. An increase in taxes suppresses the amount of taxes collected.

Let me illustrate it with this story. When we have to pay less in taxes you have lots of money. No worries. So your general inclination is to spend it, everywhere. This increased spending on your part puts more money in the pockets of those you are buying from. They, also being flush in cash, start to spend more. And so the spending goes. Well if the spending increases then the production of goods must increase to keep up with the increased demand for product. This means more people working more hours, additional workers being hired, etc. This increased output means more taxes collected from a larger number of people. So all is good. (And, yes I know this is simplistic and there are other factors at work but it's a start).

Now let's look at the other side. The side you are seeing now. You are looking at the bleak side of taxes going up. You're not sure how much money you'll have so you cut back on your spending. This starts to show by the various stores and vendors not having as robust sales so they start to order fewer goods. The factories become bloated with goods they have produced and that are not selling so they begin to cut back on hiring, reducing hours and laying off workers. This in turn means these workers now have less money with which to spend so the cycle continues. Because remember you are not alone. There are hundreds of thousands, millions of you, all doing the same thing. Cutting back on spending which causes a ripple effect in the economy. Further disrupting the economy. Persons out of work aren't paying taxes but are a drain as they collect benefits.

And so it goes until some force causes it to change. Often times war which boosts the economy as it gears up the war machine.

Oh and whatever you do, KEEP WORKING and PAYING TAXES. I've got 9 years, 1 month and 15 days until I retire... :D
 
I personally have a matress full of currency at my disposal. I started mowing lawns at the age of 2 & have close to a million dollars in monopoly cash because of my great work ethic. Now, I just need to find out how to get the shoe to pay up for landing on my boardwalk & i'll be set.
 
My husband hit 62 last month --- and will start drawing SS. It certainly won't be much, but it will be welcome. He has to pay for most of his medical insurance out of our pocket, because his retirement doesn't cover it.

I hit 62 next year --- I have no SS because most school districts in Texas don't contribute to it. I do not pay for my medical insurance because I have the highest deductible offered by the state retirement system --- $4,000. I am fortunate that I am healthy and only go to the doctor on rare occasions. When I retired, I couldn't see paying the big bucks for a low-deductible if I never used it. When I hit 65, I will have to pay for Medicare --- and Lord knows, how much it will be.
 
I used to dream about retiring and where we might live and the things we would do. I'm closing in on 60 and retirement is nowhere in sight. I'll be elligible for retirement in a couple of years and because I worked in private business for twelve years before I begun work with the post office, I will also receive around $350 from SS, but even that on top of my civil service retirement just isn't even close to allowing me to live anywhere close to where we are today. But even if it would, with the way society is moving these days, social programs from education to the vehemouth health, my taxes will continue to go up and up as long as the Democrats continue to want to take care of the public. And with the SCHIP controversy, it only gets worse. Soon, we will be required to pay for couple's, making $80,000 a year, health insurance. This is just the first step to socialized medicine and though other countries who have done this keep showing us that it doesn't work, our country continues on the path that will eventually make this country just another socialistic country with one party rule. Hmmmm, that sounds very familiar. :eek:
 
AndyMarquisLIVE said:
... and quite frankly don't care about the stock market.

But with the credit problems, morgtage issues, Sprint's problems, record oil prices and now Boomer Nation, I'm starting to worry that ten years from now, I won't be able to provide for myself or any family, espically if I stay in the state of Maryland.

Today, the first boomer applied and starts recieving social security (that I'm paying more than $1,000/year into). Of course, the fear Mr. Bush has outlined is that social security won't be around 30 years from now, and changes need to be made. I agree!

But the good ol' Democratic Party said, leave it as is. :D

So now, the tsunami has begun, and over a time period of several years, that $1,500-$3,000 adds up, especially when I'm trying to pay for college and provide food for myself. Granted, I recieve most of my tax dollars back, but not social security or MD Medicare Tax (while most of MD's middle-class can't afford nor qualifies for medicare).

And then today, oil companies reported profits down. Boo hoo, right? Well, oil prices are at $85/barrell, and economists believe oil companies are afraid to raise gas prices because the Democrats have threatened them repeatedly with investigations and charges for price gauging. Well, when the oil comapnies hurt, so is the rest of the stock market.

Add that to the already large problems with credit, and the economy heading into a recession.

And now, Comcast says they can't give us FOX Business Channel HD so we'll be ou t of the loop around here.

And MARYLAND is getting ready to raise the sale tax and the general taxes AGAIN!!! :mad:

Republicans in office = Economy good.
Democrats in office = Economy bad.
Click to expand...
First of all, it has nothing to do with maryland.

And, you are better off without Fox Business Channel.....watch CNBC

And you mis-interpret the oil profits......what was reported was that profits are slightly down from "RECORD" profits......their profits are still astronomical. The cost of oil is hurting the economy and will hurt it even more within 6 months when oil goes to $100 a barrel.

GWB's plan for S.S. was all B.S.....and would not help people like you, only those that have mucho money would benefit.

I suggest that you learn to understnad how the stock market works and start investing or you "WILL" not have money to retire. Putting money into an IRA at an early age is key to retirement. Bitching about it will result in zilch.

Oh, one more thing. If you would keep people like Connie Morella in office instead of voting her out you would stand a much better chance.
 
AndyMarquisLIVE said:
CNBC's boring as hell, and 90% of what they cover is irrelevant. Sorry. :idunno:
Click to expand...
The Stock Market is like watching grass grow. It isn't necessarily exciting. The secret is "a little at a time". Going for the big kill will usually get you killed.
 
muggle not said:
The Stock Market is like watching grass grow. It isn't necessarily exciting. The secret is "a little at a time". Going for the big kill will usually get you killed.
Click to expand...

I don't invest in the stock market, which is why CNBC is irrelevant. I used to watch Economywatch until it got cancelled. But CVS pharmacy making $2 million instead of $2.1 million has no affect on me.

Credit does affect me, the morgtage crisis does affect me, oil prices does affect me, and the overall state of our economy does. The stock market is only a fraction of the picture, and that's what CNBC does, whereas FOX Business covers the whole picture.
 
Well Mug...maybe not!

muggle not said:
The Stock Market is like watching grass grow. It isn't necessarily exciting. The secret is "a little at a time". Going for the big kill will usually get you killed.
Click to expand...

We purchased our first home in 1967. We paid $19,400. for it. Our income that year was $14,300. The DOW was about 900 most of the year.

My son is looking at a smaller home right now. It is priced at $135,000. My son's income is around $85,000. And where is the DOW today, 14,000 something?

My point here is that it is all about inflation.. Little gain if any is made in allowing money to sit in stocks. The money made in the stock market is in taking risks... not in parking money for a lifetime..

Certainly the market will rise! BECAUSE our money is worth LESS the market MUST be worth larger numbers to stay even, or near even. But is there really a personal gain after 20 or more years of holding a stock? Prolly not.
Betsy:rolleyes:
 
Betsy said:
We purchased our first home in 1967. We paid $19,400. for it. Our income that year was $14,300. The DOW was about 900 most of the year.

My son is looking at a smaller home right now. It is priced at $135,000. My son's income is around $85,000. And where is the DOW today, 14,000 something?

My point here is that it is all about inflation.. Little gain if any is made in allowing money to sit in stocks. The money made in the stock market is in taking risks... not in parking money for a lifetime..

Certainly the market will rise! BECAUSE our money is worth LESS the market MUST be worth larger numbers to stay even, or near even. But is there really a personal gain after 20 or more years of holding a stock? Prolly not.
Betsy:rolleyes:
Click to expand...
Wow, you could not be further from the truth. The Annualized gains in the S&P500 from July 1982 to present has been 11.4%. The realized annualized gains (after inflation) has been 8%. An annualized gain of 8% on ones money every year is extremely good, but a person has to be patient and let it grow over a period of time.
 
Howdy Mug

muggle not said:
Wow, you could not be further from the truth. The Annualized gains in the S&P500 from July 1982 to present has been 11.4%. The realized annualized gains (after inflation) has been 8%. An annualized gain of 8% on ones money every year is extremely good, but a person has to be patient and let it grow over a period of time.
Click to expand...

Wow! You sound like one of the guys that SELLS this stuff.. Look back at the incomes I listed and the price of the homes I listed and then look at the DOW!
There has been NO GAIN in the dow since I first purchased a home in 1967..compared to the price of homes and INCOME!
Yeah you can list this and then list that..but in REAL FACT the DOW is worth exactly what the dollar has drifted down and not a penny more..

Do you get it? Sure the DOW number is hiogher..but so is everything else.. All have have gained in number as the dollar has lost ground..
Betsy:rolleyes:
 
And, as further proof of how the dollar has fallen it takes 1.7 cents to produce a penny. Back in 1996 it cost only 0.7 cents to produce a penny. The mint produces 10M to 14M pennies every year. That too is a lot of money wasted.
 
This is like talking to a wall. Your argument is non-sensical. First I believe you must have an understanding of the definition of "inflation". If you don't understnad inflation then there is no sense in trying to explain things to you. The sad thing is that there may be some people that believe your B.S. on the stock market and not invest because of it.
 
Betsy said:
We purchased our first home in 1967. We paid $19,400. for it. Our income that year was $14,300. The DOW was about 900 most of the year.

My son is looking at a smaller home right now. It is priced at $135,000. My son's income is around $85,000. And where is the DOW today, 14,000 something?

My point here is that it is all about inflation.. Little gain if any is made in allowing money to sit in stocks. The money made in the stock market is in taking risks... not in parking money for a lifetime..

Certainly the market will rise! BECAUSE our money is worth LESS the market MUST be worth larger numbers to stay even, or near even. But is there really a personal gain after 20 or more years of holding a stock? Prolly not.
Betsy:rolleyes:
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Ok, look at it this way, and using your numbers.
If the DOW was, as you say, at 900 and is now at 14000. That is a gain of 1455%. Now, if you had invested $19,400 (the value of the house) in the DOW at that point it would be worth today $301,670.
 
Howdy Mug

Like I said...PLAYING the market has great risk for possible great rewards.
PARKING your money in the market usually will end up with the results of the inflation during the parking.
As prices go up due to inflation the value of EVERYTHING goes up.. Including the value of the business you may be invested in.. yes inflation hits the stock prices too.. In the end you are left with a LOT more money...but it won't buy more than it would have when you invested years ago...
Savvy stock sellors have many "talking points" to use to get your and my monies but it all boils down to inflation..
I ask you again to look at my first post on this subject.
Betsy:rolleyes:
 
muggle not said:
Ok, look at it this way, and using your numbers.
If the DOW was, as you say, at 900 and is now at 14000. That is a gain of 1455%. Now, if you had invested $19,400 (the value of the house) in the DOW at that point it would be worth today $301,670.
Click to expand...

Yep! And that is about what that particular house is worth today!
Betsy:rolleyes:
 
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