Whizzer
Gig'em
Happy29: "Hold on wait a minute now, who the hell dropped the bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki that killed hundreds of thousands of Japanese.... not to mention some Japanese christians also, hey not to mention, old men, old women, and women and children?
Whizzer: Those innocent Japanese people had no idea the war was being lost to the Americans. They were so brainwashed and the leaders so insistent of victory the average Japanese citizen felt they were on the winning side despite the carnage piled on thier nation daily by U.S. bombers in the last year of the war.
As for the loss of civilian Japanese lives, consideration must be given to the fact this was war and there are few, if any, boundaries in war neither did Japan adhere to the rules of the Geneva Convention. Collateral damage and loss of innocent lives are all a part of war. Rape, torture, killing of old men, women and children and animals are part of war. By both sides. War is not something that embraces the culture some think of as sacred. There is no sanctity in war. There is only cruelty, death and destruction.
Happy29"You think we're still angry at the Japanese for Pearl Harbor? Ha, talk to them about Nagasaki and Hiroshima and get their feelings about it."
Whizzer: Talking to the Japanese people about Nagasaki and Hiroshima indicates nothing as most were ignorant of the way the war was going at the time and the opinions of today are "after the fact". What would they have rather had happen?? The allied troops continue the bombing raids??
Happy29: "I think the Japanese have contributed lots of things to our economy, for example, cars, electronics that are ten times as better than we have here for ex. Playstation 2, Gamecube, hell they even have that talking toilet that our scientists would take decades to make !"
Whizzer: The Japanese people DID NOT contribute to this country's economy. Immediately after the war ended, the United States infused billions of dollars into that economy to enable the Japanese government to rebuild and become self-sufficient. We put them back on thier feet, not the other way around.
As a matter of fact, the first manufactured products to come from Japan were junk and a common joke when the first Japanese cars, electronics, toys and games were exported.
Up until sometime in the mid-seventies, twenty-five years after the war ended, Japanese manufacturing was considered a failure by United States standards, and was only saved from total collapse by the constant infusion of American dollars.
Since that time, the Japanese have become more proficient and produced a quality product that today might be considered as good and in some cases, better than items made in this country.
Happy29: "They've also deployed troops to Operation Iraqi Freedom, they were so gracious enough to allow us to launch fighter jets from bases in Japan to make sure the North Koreans arent doing stuff, we also have U.S Army and U.S Marine forces stationed there too. Hey, they also let us ship our wounded during Vietnam to Japan, they have to be pretty good friends to be giving us all this stuff even though we bombed them and killed hundreds of thousands of their people."
Whizzer: Of course we have bases in Japan to reduce the threat from North Korea. We also have the ulterior motive of guarding the State of Hawaii, a stepping stone in the event of an attack against the Mainland.
The thought this country killed thousands of innocent Japanese people is not ludicrious. It is reality. It was war. We did not (for once) start the war with Japan. It was the other way around. This country had no choice and as a result, innocent people on both sides, died, which included every allied soldier who lost thier life fighting against the Imperial Japanese Military.
When opinions are formed against this government, there are times they are justified as there is little question things are wrong with this or any government. There are also things wrong with labor unions, Wall Street, education, industry, education, churches, welfare and all social classes, to mention just a few. All in all, given the sacrifice many have made in defense of this nation so that citizens might continue with thier opinions and try to understand things are not always "just" and "right", prove the system does work.
Just as the downtrodden cannot all be saved, neither could innocent Japanese people be saved from the death and destruction of war. That was the decision of the rulers of Japan before, during and up to the signing of the surrender documents by Japan. Adressing the question about the bombing of Nagasaki and Hiroshima, the question should be, what were Truman's options ??
Finally, to clarify a point made in another post on the same thread containing the comment on the number of lives lost at Pearl Harbor being 25,000, that number is incorrect. According to military records, more lives were lost on September 11, 2001, than were casualties from the attack by the Japanese of Pearl Harbor on December 7, 1941.
Whizzer: Those innocent Japanese people had no idea the war was being lost to the Americans. They were so brainwashed and the leaders so insistent of victory the average Japanese citizen felt they were on the winning side despite the carnage piled on thier nation daily by U.S. bombers in the last year of the war.
As for the loss of civilian Japanese lives, consideration must be given to the fact this was war and there are few, if any, boundaries in war neither did Japan adhere to the rules of the Geneva Convention. Collateral damage and loss of innocent lives are all a part of war. Rape, torture, killing of old men, women and children and animals are part of war. By both sides. War is not something that embraces the culture some think of as sacred. There is no sanctity in war. There is only cruelty, death and destruction.
Happy29"You think we're still angry at the Japanese for Pearl Harbor? Ha, talk to them about Nagasaki and Hiroshima and get their feelings about it."
Whizzer: Talking to the Japanese people about Nagasaki and Hiroshima indicates nothing as most were ignorant of the way the war was going at the time and the opinions of today are "after the fact". What would they have rather had happen?? The allied troops continue the bombing raids??
Happy29: "I think the Japanese have contributed lots of things to our economy, for example, cars, electronics that are ten times as better than we have here for ex. Playstation 2, Gamecube, hell they even have that talking toilet that our scientists would take decades to make !"
Whizzer: The Japanese people DID NOT contribute to this country's economy. Immediately after the war ended, the United States infused billions of dollars into that economy to enable the Japanese government to rebuild and become self-sufficient. We put them back on thier feet, not the other way around.
As a matter of fact, the first manufactured products to come from Japan were junk and a common joke when the first Japanese cars, electronics, toys and games were exported.
Up until sometime in the mid-seventies, twenty-five years after the war ended, Japanese manufacturing was considered a failure by United States standards, and was only saved from total collapse by the constant infusion of American dollars.
Since that time, the Japanese have become more proficient and produced a quality product that today might be considered as good and in some cases, better than items made in this country.
Happy29: "They've also deployed troops to Operation Iraqi Freedom, they were so gracious enough to allow us to launch fighter jets from bases in Japan to make sure the North Koreans arent doing stuff, we also have U.S Army and U.S Marine forces stationed there too. Hey, they also let us ship our wounded during Vietnam to Japan, they have to be pretty good friends to be giving us all this stuff even though we bombed them and killed hundreds of thousands of their people."
Whizzer: Of course we have bases in Japan to reduce the threat from North Korea. We also have the ulterior motive of guarding the State of Hawaii, a stepping stone in the event of an attack against the Mainland.
The thought this country killed thousands of innocent Japanese people is not ludicrious. It is reality. It was war. We did not (for once) start the war with Japan. It was the other way around. This country had no choice and as a result, innocent people on both sides, died, which included every allied soldier who lost thier life fighting against the Imperial Japanese Military.
When opinions are formed against this government, there are times they are justified as there is little question things are wrong with this or any government. There are also things wrong with labor unions, Wall Street, education, industry, education, churches, welfare and all social classes, to mention just a few. All in all, given the sacrifice many have made in defense of this nation so that citizens might continue with thier opinions and try to understand things are not always "just" and "right", prove the system does work.
Just as the downtrodden cannot all be saved, neither could innocent Japanese people be saved from the death and destruction of war. That was the decision of the rulers of Japan before, during and up to the signing of the surrender documents by Japan. Adressing the question about the bombing of Nagasaki and Hiroshima, the question should be, what were Truman's options ??
Finally, to clarify a point made in another post on the same thread containing the comment on the number of lives lost at Pearl Harbor being 25,000, that number is incorrect. According to military records, more lives were lost on September 11, 2001, than were casualties from the attack by the Japanese of Pearl Harbor on December 7, 1941.
