Kyle Busch appreciation thread

AuzGrams

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 18, 2016
Messages
6,147
Points
643
Location
The racetrack.
IMO, they need more HP everywhere, but…🥺

I think once they get past 205-210 at Daytona, Talladega, Michigan, Auto Club, Pocono it gets to be too much.

More people didn’t show up at Michigan because of the Gen7, they showed up because there was a horsepower increase in the Motor City.
 

Ford 222

Team Owner
Joined
Apr 25, 2016
Messages
2,028
Points
343
Ok. I’ll bite. Which current Ford Cup driver will get 60 Cup wins?
Probably nobody. If this car equalizes things like it seems to have nobody will approach 9 win seasons again. Btw, the last guy that did that choked and didn’t even make it to the championship 4. But if that’s how you measure current talent, got news for you….driving skill is perishable. And The Instigator‘s on the downside. As to Ford’s driver potential, I’d go with Logano ( who btw has as many titles as the wannabe bully) and Blaney has a good future. Ol Kev’s recent success I’d attribute more to his CC and team. Or did Kev remember how to drive recently….🙄
 

BobbyFord

Secret Agent Man
Contributor
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
64,961
Points
1,033
Location
Southern California.
I think once they get past 205-210 at Daytona, Talladega, Michigan, Auto Club, Pocono it gets to be too much.

More people didn’t show up at Michigan because of the Gen7, they showed up because there was a horsepower increase in the Motor City.
221 into turn 1 at ACS was the best racing.
 

BobbyFord

Secret Agent Man
Contributor
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
64,961
Points
1,033
Location
Southern California.
Probably nobody. If this car equalizes things like it seems to have nobody will approach 9 win seasons again. Btw, the last guy that did that choked and didn’t even make it to the championship 4. But if that’s how you measure current talent, got news for you….driving skill is perishable. And The Instigator‘s on the downside. As to Ford’s driver potential, I’d go with Logano ( who btw has as many titles as the wannabe bully) and Blaney has a good future. Ol Kev’s recent success I’d attribute more to his CC and team. Or did Kev remember how to drive recently….🙄
29 wins since he turned 40.
Joey won’t get 29 more if nobody else showed up.
 

BobbyFord

Secret Agent Man
Contributor
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
64,961
Points
1,033
Location
Southern California.
This car hasn’t “equalized” things out and it never will. The cream always rises.
The only thing equal right now is that nobody has notes from every track. That will change and the best drivers will begin to dominate again.
Nascar needs to leave schit alone for a while.
 

Revman

Hush.
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
Messages
12,001
Points
883
Back on topic.

I wonder if @Revman has any insight.

Mr KFB has been remarkably calm during these struggles. Almost neutral and content.

What's up? Is he officially done at JGR and has accepted that?

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
Great question, and I have noticed that too. I feel like the raw cash is off the table. JGR is going to pay what they are going to pay with the current sponsorship situation. I don't think SHR or Trackhouse is throwing significantly more at him, or I think he would have bitten by now. I think the deal is that he is negotiating for his truck team, Brexton's future, and I still think maybe an ownership stake in JGR or help from Toyota to take his truck team to the next level. Intangibles....kind of. I feel like the calmness is coming from the fact that he has some options obviously.....A long term thing with JGR at a reduced salary.....A one year deal with JGR--and he pressures them to come up with the goods.....A contract comparable to JGR with SHR or Trackhouse.....I think Toyota has entered the room in a big way because they can control some of that intangible stuff. I think that the most significant reason why he hasn't done anything yet is because Chevy and/or Ford need to figure out if they will take on KBM in way congruent to TRD. Doubtful. This is the hang up IMO.

I heard David Wilson on NASCAR Radio last week, and he didn't sound like Toyota was out of the running.....some have speculated that 23XI might have entered the picture with Kurt's issues. The only part of that that makes sense is that MJ could buy and sell anybody in the garage. I wonder if Denny and Michael have had any chats..... I was very much struck by the comment Kyle made about wanting a lifetime relationship with Toyota like Ivan "Ironman" Stewart. Kind of sounded like something that might have been said at the bargaining table. I think there is potential here for Toyota to get involved in an unprecedented way on such a scale that even I would be shocked.

I think I shared the last time you welcomed my perspective that I thought Kyle was gone. I am not sure anymore. I am NOT optimistic that he stays with JGR and/or Toyota, but I am not as sure as I once was that somebody else is offering something substantially better than what he has. Very interesting stuff.....I think that we are in a period now that the longer this goes, the more likely a one year deal is with JGR....
 

BobbyFord

Secret Agent Man
Contributor
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
64,961
Points
1,033
Location
Southern California.
Great question, and I have noticed that too. I feel like the raw cash is off the table. JGR is going to pay what they are going to pay with the current sponsorship situation. I don't think SHR or Trackhouse is throwing significantly more at him, or I think he would have bitten by now. I think the deal is that he is negotiating for his truck team, Brexton's future, and I still think maybe an ownership stake in JGR or help from Toyota to take his truck team to the next level. Intangibles....kind of. I feel like the calmness is coming from the fact that he has some options obviously.....A long term thing with JGR at a reduced salary.....A one year deal with JGR--and he pressures them to come up with the goods.....A contract comparable to JGR with SHR or Trackhouse.....I think Toyota has entered the room in a big way because they can control some of that intangible stuff. I think that the most significant reason why he hasn't done anything yet is because Chevy and/or Ford need to figure out if they will take on KBM in way congruent to TRD. Doubtful. This is the hang up IMO.

I heard David Wilson on NASCAR Radio last week, and he didn't sound like Toyota was out of the running.....some have speculated that 23XI might have entered the picture with Kurt's issues. The only part of that that makes sense is that MJ could buy and sell anybody in the garage. I wonder if Denny and Michael have had any chats..... I was very much struck by the comment Kyle made about wanting a lifetime relationship with Toyota like Ivan "Ironman" Stewart. Kind of sounded like something that might have been said at the bargaining table. I think there is potential here for Toyota to get involved in an unprecedented way on such a scale that even I would be shocked.

I think I shared the last time you welcomed my perspective that I thought Kyle was gone. I am not sure anymore. I am NOT optimistic that he stays with JGR and/or Toyota, but I am not as sure as I once was that somebody else is offering something substantially better than what he has. Very interesting stuff.....I think that we are in a period now that the longer this goes, the more likely a one year deal is with JGR....
Topics evolve. It’s called, “discussion.”
 

AuzGrams

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 18, 2016
Messages
6,147
Points
643
Location
The racetrack.
This car hasn’t “equalized” things out and it never will. The cream always rises.
The only thing equal right now is that nobody has notes from every track. That will change and the best drivers will begin to dominate again.
Nascar needs to leave schit alone for a while.

Who’s “the best”, I could argue Joey Logano is in fact the best driver in the sport just as much as Kyle Larson, Kyle Busch, Kevin Harvick, Chase Elliott, there’s 2-5 others im forgetting.
 

BobbyFord

Secret Agent Man
Contributor
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
64,961
Points
1,033
Location
Southern California.
Who’s “the best”, I could argue Joey Logano is in fact the best driver in the sport just as much as Kyle Larson, Kyle Busch, Kevin Harvick, Chase Elliott, there’s 2-5 others im forgetting.
But if you included stats over the past 5 years, I’d say the list would be narrowed. Larson was great until they changed the car. This is the reason I keep repeating that someone needs to handcuff NASCAR and let us watch the racing evolve. If they keep this crap up then they should just have a lotto and make the drivers unwillingly change cars every stage.
This is circus-level clownery.
 

AuzGrams

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 18, 2016
Messages
6,147
Points
643
Location
The racetrack.
Sure. How’s he doing now?
NASCAR is now reconfiguring tracks 😵‍💫. The common denominator is that they’re still removing seats.
FFS, leave everything alone and let us watch some racing.

They increased the horsepower and allowed more throttle and brake increase yet has won 1/24 races this season versus 10/36 last year. Kyle, Cliff, the 5 team, or his fans can’t make excuses for this season. I don’t think the 5 team is meeting their goals.
 

aunty dive

Team Owner
Contributor
Joined
Mar 17, 2014
Messages
31,272
Points
883
Harvick’s dry spell was 60 + races.

KFB is a long way from done winning races.
 

BobbyFord

Secret Agent Man
Contributor
Joined
Apr 6, 2005
Messages
64,961
Points
1,033
Location
Southern California.
They increased the horsepower and allowed more throttle and brake increase yet has won 1/24 races this season versus 10/36 last year. Kyle, Cliff, the 5 team, or his fans can’t make excuses for this season. I don’t think the 5 team is meeting their goals.
They aren’t. They need to freaking leave things alone and let these teams figure it out.
 

Truex_rox

Wannabe racecar driver.
Joined
Aug 6, 2017
Messages
3,410
Points
443
Harvick is the best Ford driver. He is very consistent, has a knack for mostly keeping the car in one piece, and even grabs good results from races that don’t go all so well. Joey comes close but he is more erratic, and some of the things he does on track are questionable, to put it diplomatically. You may notice that Joey tends to bring in a lot of stage points but doesn’t always put up the finishes, which is a little bit of a theme with him I think. In one of the recent playoffs, where he wasn’t doing too great, that was what he was relying on getting by with until getting knocked out in the round of 8. It’s the exact opposite with Harv, who tends to close out pretty well regardless of form throughout race day. If NASCAR had some sort of OVR rating system (maybe they do and I’m not aware) like the NBA and NFL has with their players, I think Harvick edges out Joey on the basis of experience and racecraft. Joey would have the upper hand in terms of pace.

Sorry for my contribution in derailing the thread a little bit further, lol.
 

jaqua19

Team Owner
Joined
Feb 17, 2015
Messages
8,561
Points
793
I can do 3 maybe, but it depends on everything across the 3 as a whole. Someone could’ve dominated in 2020, and they did. But not so much else in 2021-2022, and be hard to see them as the best so and so driver.

Jimmie Johnson for example. By the end of 2018 or so, he surely wasn’t the best any more, despite just winning a championship two years before that, and slowly fell off from there. Thankfully Harvick is still able to win however lol.

Which is why I think Jimmie was still the best in the sport until 2017. Yes, from 2014-2016 he was generally outperformed across the board in all major stats. However, he still generally lead the series in wins, and won as many titles during that time span anyone else.

Elliott has generally outperformed everyone from 2020-2022. Larson has had too short of a run with HMS to be factored in, imo, even if he was sitting on 6 wins right now.

Harvick, while stronger than Logano in 2020 was a non factor in 2021, and had been that way until a week ago. Logano edges him out as the best imo.

My personal rule is culmative success over a 3 year period. Which is why I'd currently rank today's drivers as

1. Elliott
2. Hamlin
3. Truex
4. Logano


Larson needs more time with HMS before I can plug him in anywhere, and while he's been 1a or 1b these last two seasons, I just need to see more seat time before saying he's "best/second best/third best" in series.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

jaqua19

Team Owner
Joined
Feb 17, 2015
Messages
8,561
Points
793
Great question, and I have noticed that too. I feel like the raw cash is off the table. JGR is going to pay what they are going to pay with the current sponsorship situation. I don't think SHR or Trackhouse is throwing significantly more at him, or I think he would have bitten by now. I think the deal is that he is negotiating for his truck team, Brexton's future, and I still think maybe an ownership stake in JGR or help from Toyota to take his truck team to the next level. Intangibles....kind of. I feel like the calmness is coming from the fact that he has some options obviously.....A long term thing with JGR at a reduced salary.....A one year deal with JGR--and he pressures them to come up with the goods.....A contract comparable to JGR with SHR or Trackhouse.....I think Toyota has entered the room in a big way because they can control some of that intangible stuff. I think that the most significant reason why he hasn't done anything yet is because Chevy and/or Ford need to figure out if they will take on KBM in way congruent to TRD. Doubtful. This is the hang up IMO.

I heard David Wilson on NASCAR Radio last week, and he didn't sound like Toyota was out of the running.....some have speculated that 23XI might have entered the picture with Kurt's issues. The only part of that that makes sense is that MJ could buy and sell anybody in the garage. I wonder if Denny and Michael have had any chats..... I was very much struck by the comment Kyle made about wanting a lifetime relationship with Toyota like Ivan "Ironman" Stewart. Kind of sounded like something that might have been said at the bargaining table. I think there is potential here for Toyota to get involved in an unprecedented way on such a scale that even I would be shocked.

I think I shared the last time you welcomed my perspective that I thought Kyle was gone. I am not sure anymore. I am NOT optimistic that he stays with JGR and/or Toyota, but I am not as sure as I once was that somebody else is offering something substantially better than what he has. Very interesting stuff.....I think that we are in a period now that the longer this goes, the more likely a one year deal is with JGR....
His attitude is remarkable right now. Even his dig at Chastain was light hearted.

It makes me wonder if he's rebranding himself for a reason. It also makes me wonder how much of the bratty KFB stuff was played up cause of his brand. His situation seems less than pleasant and he's showing maturity in ways he never had before.

I'm questioning if things are stabilizing behind the scenes, or if this more likeable version of himself is who he's trying to present.

Kyle is truly one of the more unique personalities in the sport. I've always felt that his DGAF attitude, and his childish temperature was less congruent to who he is than someone like Stewart or DW.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

jaqua19

Team Owner
Joined
Feb 17, 2015
Messages
8,561
Points
793
They increased the horsepower and allowed more throttle and brake increase yet has won 1/24 races this season versus 10/36 last year. Kyle, Cliff, the 5 team, or his fans can’t make excuses for this season. I don’t think the 5 team is meeting their goals.
He's 3rd in the standings, has had race winning speed, and up until last week, lead the series in pass differential.

Their issue is with execution and race calling. This weekend at Richmond, Cliff made a call to not adjust the car when Larson was calling for it.

Another win or two was expected, but all things considered, being a top 4 driver this season isn't exactly catastrophic..they need to clean things up, but it's not as bad as it seems.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

Conover

Team Owner
Joined
May 3, 2017
Messages
646
Points
323
Location
Florida
Hey @Revman I really enjoyed your take and speculation on KDB’s situation and where things might be at this juncture.
I also thought it was very enlightening how, in his presser, he went into the whole vision of his future, the time line , the plans for his son, all of that. I don’t seek to listen to Kyle much, but that was a LOT of info he volunteered and not like his usual commentary. Therefore, I agree it is likely part of his ongoing discussions with teams and manufacturers. He’s saying…”THIS is what I am looking for…let’s make it happen”. He also ideally wants his last contract. His comments of appreciation and desire to ideally stay with Toyota and JGR also sounded sincere.
 

Efisher131

750 truther
Joined
Aug 30, 2016
Messages
3,783
Points
593
They increased the horsepower and allowed more throttle and brake increase yet has won 1/24 races this season versus 10/36 last year. Kyle, Cliff, the 5 team, or his fans can’t make excuses for this season. I don’t think the 5 team is meeting their goals.
Hendrick as a whole outside of the 9 has been in a bad way for about 10 races
 

AuzGrams

Team Owner
Joined
Sep 18, 2016
Messages
6,147
Points
643
Location
The racetrack.
He's 3rd in the standings, has had race winning speed, and up until last week, lead the series in pass differential.

Their issue is with execution and race calling. This weekend at Richmond, Cliff made a call to not adjust the car when Larson was calling for it.

Another win or two was expected, but all things considered, being a top 4 driver this season isn't exactly catastrophic..they need to clean things up, but it's not as bad as it seems.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk

The only standings that really matters to me is playoff points
 

Ford 222

Team Owner
Joined
Apr 25, 2016
Messages
2,028
Points
343
Hey @Revman I really enjoyed your take and speculation on KDB’s situation and where things might be at this juncture.
I also thought it was very enlightening how, in his presser, he went into the whole vision of his future, the time line , the plans for his son, all of that. I don’t seek to listen to Kyle much, but that was a LOT of info he volunteered and not like his usual commentary. Therefore, I agree it is likely part of his ongoing discussions with teams and manufacturers. He’s saying…”THIS is what I am looking for…let’s make it happen”. He also ideally wants his last contract. His comments of appreciation and desire to ideally stay with Toyota and JGR also sounded sincere.
Toyota is going to step in and make it happen. They’re gonna want the first dibs on that kid staying in their fold I’m sure…

Its going to be interesting if when he is a young man if he will continue to mature or have an attitude/maturity level like his father. Jr certainly took His fathers class and grew from it. Probably because he grew up in the limelight and knew how to tolerate it better.
 

Revman

Hush.
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
Messages
12,001
Points
883
Hey @Revman I really enjoyed your take and speculation on KDB’s situation and where things might be at this juncture.
I also thought it was very enlightening how, in his presser, he went into the whole vision of his future, the time line , the plans for his son, all of that. I don’t seek to listen to Kyle much, but that was a LOT of info he volunteered and not like his usual commentary. Therefore, I agree it is likely part of his ongoing discussions with teams and manufacturers. He’s saying…”THIS is what I am looking for…let’s make it happen”. He also ideally wants his last contract. His comments of appreciation and desire to ideally stay with Toyota and JGR also sounded sincere.
Thank you so much man.....I completely agree with your last sentence. Honestly, I think some of his demeanor is about being sad/hurt that for whatever reason, it has come to this.....Again, I appreciate your kindness. This board can use it.
 

Revman

Hush.
Joined
Jan 12, 2014
Messages
12,001
Points
883
His attitude is remarkable right now. Even his dig at Chastain was light hearted.

It makes me wonder if he's rebranding himself for a reason. It also makes me wonder how much of the bratty KFB stuff was played up cause of his brand. His situation seems less than pleasant and he's showing maturity in ways he never had before.

I'm questioning if things are stabilizing behind the scenes, or if this more likeable version of himself is who he's trying to present.

Kyle is truly one of the more unique personalities in the sport. I've always felt that his DGAF attitude, and his childish temperature was less congruent to who he is than someone like Stewart or DW.

Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
Rebranding.....Brilliant point. He is a Toyota teammate with his brother. His brother has rebranded for the better. Maybe Kyle is following his lead. Excellent perspective as always my friend.
 
Top Bottom