Mars Association of Stock Car Racing

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Butch Penton

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Okay, just give me a minute to explain (and for God's sake, don't include my comment in yours).

I want to create a fictional MASCAR (Mars Association of Stock Car Racing). I know it's far-fetched (I write science fiction) but I think this discussion will be fun for gearheads (beautiful minds) and I think this is the place to create my race cars and even the track composition (no rubber trees on Mars).

When we eventually colonize the red planet, everything 'literally required' to build 'anything' (the big 4) is already there: Carbon, Nitrogen, and we can make Oxygen and Hydrogen. Of course we won't have rubber or petroleum products. Entertainment will damn sure include racing, the second oldest profession, so that's where you guys and gals come in.

First of all, Mars gravity is one third of Earth, .38 to be specific. Secondly, The atmosphere of Mars is about 100 times thinner than Earth's which means that there are no winds to worry about (forget the windstorm in "The Martian" film (doesn't work that way), but the problem with low pressure is that I need your help to generate downforce (the NASCAR 2017 downforce package is out the window so don't bother with that).

To keep a 'car' to stick, it will require something ...something I'm asking you guys to figure out? Immense weight? Enormous fins to take advantage of what little atmosphere there is in places I cannot imagine?

Also, it is 95 percent carbon dioxide which would suffocate him, but he wouldn't notice if his skin was exposed to the low atmosphere because every molecule in his body would boil and he would literally explode if the damage to 'a suit to be developed with your help' is torn badly.

What about fuel? Batteries are heavy so maybe that's good to keep the car stuck to the track. On the other hand, there are existing units that can separate oxygen from the CO2 and Methane is available in reasonable amounts, so how about a small methane/oxygen rocket on straightaways with standard braking in the corners? These are just amateur suggestions that fail to address suspension, side force, driver protection (including an oxygen supply). As for suspension, would less gravity and atmosphere require hugely different concepts for suspension? Engine will be exotic as described but can it drive a standard drive shaft, axel, gearbox, etc?

What composition will be the tires on what kind of track? Mars soil is iron oxide (which is why it is the red planet). Iron Oxide would mean rust if there were enough oxygen but there isn't. It is the consistency of a 1 inch powder over a more stable underlayment. I was thinking of spikes like the oldschool short track motorcycles, but that would for sure rip suits and kill instantly. But is a metal compound still the most reasonable without rubber? Carbon composites are available...

There are no stupid ideas and nothing is too bizarre for science fiction if it is 'reasonable'.

Considerations:
Carbon dioxide: 95.32 percent
Nitrogen: 2.7 percent
Argon: 1.6 percent
Oxygen: 0.13 percent
Carbon monoxide: 0.08 percent
Also, minor amounts of: water, nitrogen oxide, neon, hydrogen-deuterium-oxygen, krypton and xenon.

* Oh yeah, I'll clone Harvick so that the #4 car will eventually break the King's all-time win records, though you guys won't let it count because you are racist xenophobia against Martians, even though they will be human. Deplorable, just frikken deplorable.

-help please-
 
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Butch Penton

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- Oh yeah, water will be a very precious luxury, so keep that in mind.
- Also, all habitable areas will be covered by very strong transparent tents but I think the explosion possibilities require that the track be outside the 'tent', perhaps like the hole in a doughnut.
- Surface temperatures of 'both summers' of a Mars year "may" reach a high of about +68 degrees Fahrenheit at noon (at the equator), and a low of about −147°F) at night at the poles. So temps should be taken into consideration.
 
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Butch Penton

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Is there anyway to delete silliness so people don't have to scroll down to make a serious observation,or this this just another waste of time version of Yahoo forum? I mean no disrespect but I also hope to get a little.
 

kkfan91

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How long after colonization are we starting this up?
 
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Butch Penton

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Funny auntie, but if they had to create the 'dwarf planet' bracket because they've already found three others larger than Pluto. It also has to do with an irregular orbit that is entirely differnent from all other solar bodies. There was no way to know any of this until Hubble, and I expect more amazing discoveries with the James Webb telescope scheduled for Oct. '18 launch.

So, anything about MASCAR? I would appreciate it.
 
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Butch Penton

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"How long after colonization are we starting this up?"
Rovers delivered are severely limited. Curiosity has traveled 25 miles in 12 years - no sh*t.
When good old-fashioned horse trading (capitalism) takes hold, there will be at least two companies competing to race on Sunday and sell on Monday. Let's just say when all the hard work is done and there is time to even think of racing and it is realized that they have everything they need.
 

aunty dive

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So, anything about MASCAR? I would appreciate it.
Maybe. Need more information to formulate a rational question about downforce production and the presence or absence of aerodynamic turbulence.

What is the atmospheric pressure at "sea level" on Mars?
 

2 Sweet

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Giant "slot car" track, maybe 8 lanes wide. 16 competitors. They would basically be on rails but have the ability to "jump" tracks every 100 feet or so throughout the course, if they choose, due to built in railroad switches (but obviously a more complex design).

That's all I got.
 
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Butch Penton

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Auntie, no wind, no turbulence.
The atmosphere pressure measured over a Martian year (two times a year on Earth) was a negligible 7 to 10 millibars which is 1 percent Earth sea-level atmospheric pressure. Earth average at sea level is 1013.25 millibar. I was a 20-year naval flight officer and it's fair to say there is 'no atmosphere' to be realistic. So, that is going to take a smarter person than me to figure into the exploitation for a race-rover. I'm liking 2 Sweet's 'slot car' idea. Any comments on that one?
 

aunty dive

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Auntie, no wind, no turbulence.
The atmosphere pressure measured over a Martian year (two times a year on Earth) was a negligible 7 to 10 millibars which is 1 percent Earth sea-level atmospheric pressure. Earth average at sea level is 1013.25 millibar. I was a 20-year naval flight officer and it's fair to say there is 'no atmosphere' to be realistic. So, that is going to take a smarter person than me to figure into the exploitation for a race-rover. I'm liking 2 Sweet's 'slot car' idea. Any comments on that one?
What you mean is no aerodynamic effects of any kind. Oddly, aerodynamics requires air.

I dislike every idea 2 Sweet comes up with so, no.
 
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Butch Penton

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Giant "slot car" track, maybe 8 lanes wide. 16 competitors. They would basically be on rails but have the ability to "jump" tracks every 100 feet or so throughout the course, if they choose, due to built in railroad switches (but obviously a more complex design).

Hell, If that's all you got, it's better than anything else I've gotten from here or FB. I like it, though the outside line will be 'railroaded' by the bottom line because they will know exactly where the track swtiches are. Maybe they can increase the switches like they increased pit speed scoring lines... But then the disadvantaged also wouldn't know where the additional 'working switches' are. Obviously a disadvantage unless MASCAR officials can equalize it somehow. I'm thinking something like speed skating where they cross over to equalize distance traveled. Thoughts?
 

Mr. Gregory

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Is there anyway to delete silliness so people don't have to scroll down to make a serious observation,or this this just another waste of time version of Yahoo forum?
I want to create a fictional MASCAR (Mars Association of Stock Car Racing).

...

* Oh yeah, I'll clone Harvick so that the #4 car will eventually break the King's all-time win records, though you guys won't let it count because you are racist xenophobia against Martians, even though they will be human. Deplorable, just frikken deplorable.
CcsdIVX.jpg
 
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Butch Penton

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"What you mean is no aerodynamic effects of any kind. Oddly, aerodynamics requires air."
Yes, that is one of the problems I asked for help with in the OP. Aerodynamics requires atmospheric pressure whether it's air or methane. Is there anyway to create an artificial atmosphere at this scale? ... And 2 Sweet seems to have a fantastic handle on the question, if you don't mind.
 
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Butch Penton

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Gregory, Point taken and I recognize that you might very well be a Martian in your lifetime. Modern American identity politics aside, do you have any suggestions on the problem under consideration?
 
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Butch Penton

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  1. Science fiction is a very serious form of literature and has often resulted in everyday items such as the platform you are communicating on at this very instant.
 
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Butch Penton

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4tires17gals wrote, "the orange sand would get on grills and overheat cars."
The best and an excellent point! I hadn't thought of that. Since temperatures or so low, it 'might not cause a cooling problem' but a cool way to filter the sand would add interest to the story. On the other hand, the effects of grit on graphite based lubricants is something I hadn't considered. If we use the rocket concept, that will also be a huge consideration. Thanks! Great stuff going into my notes.
 
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Butch Penton

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I wish this was in the Podium so I could make the post I want to.
Don't know what 'the podium' is, but everyone should feel free to send your best to [email protected]. Spent 20 years on aircraft carriers surrounded by insult-masters so I assure you that the worst you'll get is a chuckle.
 

DUN24

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4tires17gals wrote, "the orange sand would get on grills and overheat cars."
The best and an excellent point! I hadn't thought of that. Since temperatures or so low, it 'might not cause a cooling problem' but a cool way to filter the sand would add interest to the story. On the other hand, the effects of grit on graphite based lubricants is something I hadn't considered. If we use the rocket concept, that will also be a huge consideration. Thanks! Great stuff going into my notes.

That guy is basically the brains of this forum so all pertinent questions regarding space sports should be forwarded directly to him.
 

TexasRaceLady

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Alright, gentlemen, you've had your fun ---
either stick to the topic, or move on to something else.
 
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