More foreign makes in NASCAR?

[GREAT AMERICAN RACE FAN]

NASCAR looking to American built Foreign Car makers for bailout?

"We have companies that are interested in particular in developing the North American market as robustly as they can," France said. "And we're all aware that there are lots of foreign manufacturers producing cars here in America. That was part of the rationale that Toyota used" to get involved in NASCAR.

Other such companies with U.S. plants include Honda, Hyundai, Nissan, BMW and Mercedes-Benz.

But, "I'm not going to name names," France said. "We have been talking to people off and on for a long time. These are decisions, in terms of new manufacturers joining the sport, that will take a long time to evaluate and actually enter.

"So this isn't something that if we turn the light switch on tomorrow morning it would happen. (Story by Ed Hinton)



Is this something NASCAR just cooked up due to current climate of U.S. automakers, or an idea for further relationship with current foreign car manufacturers that build in the U.S.?
I hate the fact that it has come to this, but not much of NASCAR these days looks like my father's NASCAR I grew up listening and watching. I now watch because of habit, not cause I have a passion for the sport like I did 10 years ago. It is nice to see Mark Martin ahead of the field, as I hope he wins the chase, and then retires.

 

[foehammer111]

Is this something NASCAR just cooked up due to current climate of U.S. automakers, or an idea for further relationship with current foreign car manufacturers that build in the U.S.?

Probably a little of both.

I hate the fact that it has come to this, but not much of NASCAR these days looks like my father's NASCAR I grew up listening and watching.

And I'm sure your father complained that "his NASCAR" doesn't look like his father's NASCAR. Which is true, and what I'd expect. NASCAR has evolved just like every other sport in the world. If you're jaded about modern NASCAR, then don't watch. But everything the France family has done to the sport over the years has been to improve upon the series, and keep it relivant.

I'd also like to point out that the Toyota Camry is more American than any of the other brands because it's actually assembled in the US. The Fusion is made in Mexico, and the Impala and Charger are made in Canada. At least Toyota has a vestited interest in the US economy by building their cars here.

That's what NASCAR is going after. They want any new foreign automakers in the sport to have plants in the US. I think this is only going to help the sport grow. Sure it might piss off the purists that think there should only be "American" automakers in NASCAR. But then again, everything seems to piss off purists.

 

[Eagle1]

Probably a little of both.



And I'm sure your father complained that "his NASCAR" doesn't look like his father's NASCAR. Which is true, and what I'd expect. NASCAR has evolved just like every other sport in the world. If you're jaded about modern NASCAR, then don't watch. But everything the France family has done to the sport over the years has been to improve upon the series, and keep it relivant.

I'd also like to point out that the Toyota Camry is more American than any of the other brands because it's actually assembled in the US. The Fusion is made in Mexico, and the Impala and Charger are made in Canada. At least Toyota has a vestited interest in the US economy by building their cars here.

That's what NASCAR is going after. They want any new foreign automakers in the sport to have plants in the US. I think this is only going to help the sport grow. Sure it might piss off the purists that think there should only be "American" automakers in NASCAR. But then again, everything seems to piss off purists.

Excellent post!!

 

[GREAT AMERICAN RACE FAN]

If the sport still is relevit, why has ratings been going down in the last few years. Even before the economy had gotten bad, the stands were not packed out as before in the late '90's. Why, cause NASCAR had made to many changes and "pissed the purist off". Now all you have left is the wine bibbing cheese eating fair weather fans!

I have no problem with Toyota and or a Honda racing in NASCAR, because I know they are in America providing jobs. I know that they studied the way America used to build cars, and have adapted and bettered the way it is done. I also understand that they put a lot of money into their racing programs so that they can be the best. Good luck to them!!!

As for me, I will still watch recreationaly, doze off from time to time this summer, and wake up when the real racing begins at Bristol. Wait, they had to change Bristol, it has gotten to where the racing sucks there now too. Progressive banking, STUPID. Leave a few things alone and let the real fans enjoy what was once a great racing series.

 

[foehammer111]

Obvisouly you're upset with the current state of the sport. Nothing I say is going to change that, but I'd like to point out your flawed way of reacting to it.

Typing out messages on forums will do nothing to change the way the sport is for you. The best way to change the negitive trends as you see them is to stop watching. I'm not talking about dozing off either. Change the channel, or turn the TV off. Don' t buy merchendise, don't attend races, or even worse become a fan of another series. IRL, F1, and many others are dying for your viewership. Nothing will hurt NASCAR more then not watching.

As you said, this has already started to happeen. TV ratings are down. Race attendance is down. Car makers are pulling support, and sponsers are leaving (although those are more because of the economy). But I'd like to point out that TV ratings etc are down from the high of a few years ago. But they're up (in some cases double digits) from 10 or 15 years ago.

But NASCAR is listening. The meeting a couple weeks ago is proof of that. I doubt they'll change anything drastic, but they will make minor tweeks to improve the racing. Changes to the CoT are coming, and you can bet there will be schedule changes.

 

[GREAT AMERICAN RACE FAN]

You are mostly correct, yes typing on a forum is not going to change NASCAR to what it once was for me. Most people on this Forum are reacting to something they see or heard, and then typing their opinion. My opinion has been said typed here and so has yours. So let it be, no reason to talk down to someone cause my opinion does not fit with yours.

 

[TexasRaceLady]

Let's face it, we're preaching to the choir here.

We're all in this together. As I said earlier, it's NASCAR's sandbox.

I quit attending races 3 yrs ago --- mainly because my old knees couldn't stand the stair climbs. But also, the price of attending was out of my financial reach.

 

[GREAT AMERICAN RACE FAN]

Let's face it, we're preaching to the choir here.

We're all in this together. As I said earlier, it's NASCAR's sandbox.

I quit attending races 3 yrs ago --- mainly because my old knees couldn't stand the stair climbs. But also, the price of attending was out of my financial reach.

Same as me, I have a family, money is tight. I will attend a Truck or Busch race from time to time, and cup if I score free tickets.

 

[buckaroo]

Same here. The only time we now go to a big time race is if someone gives us the tickets, and that's how were got to see last year's final race at Charlotte and the all star race this year.

We all have from one time or another, criticized NASCAR for one reason or another. I've been doing so for well over 10 years now cause I didn't like the direction the sport was heading and still don't, but I still watch the races on Sunday. I'm a fan of racing period as I've said many times before and NASCAR has the most races that are televised and so those are the races I watch more than any other. When you watch something over and over, you become more involved in what you are watching and you become a fan, even if you don't like what you see. Being a fan doesn't mean that you love what you see. Fan is short for fanatic and that's what we are to some degree or another.

 

[foehammer111]

So let it be, no reason to talk down to someone cause my opinion does not fit with yours.

I'm not talking down to you, so I'm sorry you feel that way.

I'm just stating my opinion as you are. Although there's always room for improvement, I think the sport is much better off now then it was 10 years ago.

 

[Eagle1]

and "pissed the purist off". Now all you have left is the wine bibbing cheese eating fair weather fans!

Boy talk about talking down to people if they don’t agree with your way of thinking!! Maybe it isn’t you that’s the purist?
I’ve been a fan for many many years and pretty much consider myself a purist, but I understand that like it or not things have to change if they don’t they just fade away like so many other sanctioning bodies have over the past 60 years.
2 questions;
Is the interest in NASCAR really in decline, or is all sports ratings lower than they have been?
Is the interest in NASCAR really in decline, or is the very thing we said a few years ago happening?
NASCAR went through a big explosion of popularity a few years ago, we all knew it wouldn't go forever climbing every year, nothing does. Everything has life spans for growth, then evens off a few years, then declines when (as we called them a few years ago ) FAD fans lose interest and leave? I think the economy has brought it about a little sooner than it would have happened, but it would have happened anyway.
I don't go to as many races as I used to either, in just the last couple years we have quit going to any, but mostly that's due to health reasons and financial. which brings me to what I believe is another reason attendance is down, a great many fans are baby boomers. We're retiring and don't have the resources that we once did, and for that matter the health an energy to do these trips and long days.
As foehammer111 said though the ratings are still quit a bit above what they were before the growth started?

As for the COT I think it's hilarious that people complain that it doesn't look like what you buy on the showroom floor, yet you loved the old car and swear it looked like production cars! Honestly you've got to be kidding me! Show me a Monte Carlo, Taurus, Dodge Charger that the top of the header panel over the leaned back radiator was 20" off the ground. It looked more like an ant eater and the body looked like a banana the way they had it warped for aero. These cars are closer than the old ones were, but more importantly, the manufacturers are the ones that actually pushed NASCAR for this. The automobile industry cannot build a car that will sell and race good too. We went through several years where each mfg cried like a baby cause one or the other mfg had an advantage and they needed NASCAR's help., The fans would holler NASCAR had to do something, it was unfair blah, blah, blah ......... get the picture? The manufacturers had to do it though to make sure one of the others didn't go out and build a model that would really race and produce enough to have it considered legal and the kick the crap out of the rest, kind of like the Dodge Daytona back in the day.lol

There was a guy from Ford I believe it was on Wind Tunnel a few weeks back, and he basically said the same thing, the COT was a good thing in their eyes. If any one manufacturer had a big advantage it could kill the rest in today’s market place, they needed this parity among the manufacturers.
If all the manufacturers pull out, what are you going to race? If you only have one left, then you truly do have an IROC type series or IRL with different style race cars but still only one supplier of motors.
These cars have to fit a template but at least there’s a little difference in them because each team builds their own and if you’ve heard the past few weeks, different teams are building new cars different. Sure beats having only 1 supplier of bodies and chassis.

 

[foehammer111]

Lots of strong emotions here.

I just wanted to clarify that I wasn't picking on purists. I think they're vital to the sport. I consider myself something of a purist, but I'm also a realist. If purists had their way with the sport we'd still be racing Hudson Hornets on Daytona Beach.

As Eagle said, the CoT is a good thing because it brings parity to the sport that is often times hard to find. If anything, they should stop advertising that specific car models. In other words, just make it a Chevy instead of the Impala. Which is more acturate because it's still a Chevy engine, but the body is standard.

This way the car maker doesn't have to be associated with a specific car model.

 

[83WynnsOlds]

I have to agree with Great American Race Fan on this one.

I too watch merely out of habit now. I really don't get excited about racing anymore.
Heck the only think I really get excited about now is seeing which underdogs are going to make the show. I think I'll just start watching quals only and forget the race.

 

[Clutch]

Lots of strong emotions here.

I just wanted to clarify that I wasn't picking on purists. I think they're vital to the sport. I consider myself something of a purist, but I'm also a realist. If purists had their way with the sport we'd still be racing Hudson Hornets on Daytona Beach.

As Eagle said, the CoT is a good thing because it brings parity to the sport that is often times hard to find. If anything, they should stop advertising that specific car models. In other words, just make it a Chevy instead of the Impala. Which is more acturate because it's still a Chevy engine, but the body is standard.

This way the car maker doesn't have to be associated with a specific car model.

I think you have stated your case very well and I dont thiink you were talking down to GARF at all.
I think that is a great point at the end.....especially with the COT, that maufacturers should stop associating the cars with a certain model and just stick with the make.

 

[blue92]

If the sport still is relevit, why has ratings been going down in the last few years.

What started the NASCAR downfall was the coverage on NBC a few years back, and the COT. JMO BTW. If NASCAR is going to run the same cars why not a modified prototype class and let all that build cars in the US race. They might as well because after the government totally ruins GM and Chrysler with forcing them to build small green cars there will be no GM and Chrysler in NASCAR so if NASCAR is to survive they will have no choice but to let others in and by doing so may even help the ratings. Plus NASCAR needs to wake up and start running more road courses during the season even the drivers want this so why be so determined to continue not to run more road courses.

 

[Magnethead]

What started the NASCAR downfall was the coverage on NBC a few years back, and the COT. JMO BTW. If NASCAR is going to run the same cars why not a modified prototype class and let all that build cars in the US race. They might as well because after the government totally ruins GM and Chrysler with forcing them to build small green cars there will be no GM and Chrysler in NASCAR so if NASCAR is to survive they will have no choice but to let others in and by doing so may even help the ratings. Plus NASCAR needs to wake up and start running more road courses during the season even the drivers want this so why be so determined to continue not to run more road courses.

Because Bruton won't budge and we all know why ISC tracks NEVER lose dates....

 

[buckaroo]

What started the NASCAR downfall was the coverage on NBC a few years back, and the COT.

I think it goes back further than that, even before the death of DE. It might even go all the way back to when those Elliott boys from Georgia were able to make their Ford Thunderbird so much better than any of the others. They didn't want any one car, or make for that matter, having so much of an advantage. From then on, anytime one of the top teams cried that someone had an advantage over them, NASCAR would tweak the rules and try to make them more equal. Well now they have achieved that in many ways.

 

[GREAT AMERICAN RACE FAN]

This way the car maker doesn't have to be associated with a specific car model.[/QUOTE]

I agree with that.

 

[John Galt]

I think it goes back further than that, even before the death of DE. It might even go all the way back to when those Elliott boys from Georgia were able to make their Ford Thunderbird so much better than any of the others. They didn't want any one car, or make for that matter, having so much of an advantage. From then on, anytime one of the top teams cried that someone had an advantage over them, NASCAR would tweak the rules and try to make them more equal. Well now they have achieved that in many ways.

If you want to look at it from a parity standpoint, I think you'll find one of the first actions NASCAR took to "make a level playing field," (A joke in about all forms of non-spec car racing) was 1957 when Big Bill forced Karl Kiekhaeffer and his fleet of Dodges and Chrysler 300's out of NASCAR.

But, to get back to the thread subject, if the company makes the car entered in the race, in the USA, then let 'em run, IF they can meet the engine, wheelbase and other necessary entry specifications. After all, NASCAR allowed foreign cars to complete (in the 60's Bowman-Gray had MG's, Austin-Healy's and Sprite's entries in the GN races) and we all know a Jag won one race.

The original concept for the World 600 was to have American car run against Jaguars but the Jag entries backed out at the last moment and the track announced the reason for the name World 600 was that the race was to be the longest race in the world (completely discounting LeMans). It's been domestic cars until they put a Toyota logo on the new race car.

 

[Mopardh9]

I think it goes back further than that, even before the death of DE. It might even go all the way back to when those Elliott boys from Georgia were able to make their Ford Thunderbird so much better than any of the others. They didn't want any one car, or make for that matter, having so much of an advantage. From then on, anytime one of the top teams cried that someone had an advantage over them, NASCAR would tweak the rules and try to make them more equal. Well now they have achieved that in many ways.

Good point Buck....Man Old Bill and Earnie sure had them covered back then didn't they !