Most BS Article Ever

Right, because taking Jimmie Johnson out of the field in favor of some start-and-park is a good idea.

Getting into the field based on champions and owners point provisional are apart of the sport for a variety of reasons. They're not going anywhere.
 
Get rid of provisionals, if caught cheating at all send them home. If fail post race strip them of everything: winnings, points, trophies, whatever. Now do this for anything found tampered with by the teams.

Small infractions like car height, etc.. Keep penalties small (start in rear, loss of a few points. The reason being is anything could cause those issues.
 
Jeffrey00 said:
Get rid of provisionals, if caught cheating at all send them home. If fail post race strip them of everything: winnings, points, trophies, whatever. Now do this for anything found tampered with by the teams.

Small infractions like car height, etc.. Keep penalties small (start in rear, loss of a few points. The reason being is anything could cause those issues.
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This is a horrible take on the issue.

Provisionals are there for a reason. Just because you fail a post race inspection doesn't mean you are cheating, it means a certain part of the car failed.

Do you really think drivers like Jimmie, who have enough skills to at least hold his own in this sport would purposefully cheat?

There are a plethora of reasons why cars fail inspections and that is why provisionals are needed. Its like a backup.

If NASCAR starts doing what you're implying them they'd send and suspend top tier drivers on a weekly basis. That is no way to do business.

NASCAR gives teams room to explore within their "grey" area so no need to go nuclear on teams that get caught because they went abit too far.

Chad Knaus is someone who likes to push the limits. Ain't nothing wrong with that. Most of the time he pays for it.

Take what NASCAR did to Kenseth earlier this year. They did all but take away the win. Penalty was so harsh even NASCAR realized this and backed off and gave them back their points.

In this sport you gotta do what you gotta do. You can even get away with a little cheating here and there but the trick is to not get too greedy with whatever it is you're doing to your cars.
 
Yes, because obviously the best way to enforce the rule would be to take a top-tier driver out of the race for the weekend and piss off a bunch of fans who pay big money to watch their driver(s) race :rolleyes:

This also leads to the question of whether NASCAR should also park drivers who crash during qualifying...

The whole premise is simply stupid. The fans fill the stands to cheer on their favorite top-tier drivers. I highly doubt anybody's gonna be paying big bucks to watch Timmy Hill complete 30 laps. Jimmie's time wasn't allowed, but the rule means that he's automatically locked into the field; the same goes for a driver who crashes his/her car during qualifying. That's how its been for a long while. Sounds like the author's butthurt about JJ's success from last place more than anything having to do with the rule. Obviously since he still finished well, having to start at the rear just wasn't enough :eek:
 
Nascar's rules and inspection process don't need improving . They are working just fine . The evidence is the closeness of the competition . There will always be boundries to be pushed and innovation to be made , as there is in any sport . Nascar is doing a great job of keeping things in check. Idiots who don't understand racing will keep coming up with stupid stuff like this .If anything , I am concerned that penalties have become too severe and may be discouraging innovation .
 
ted@economy said:
Nascar's rules and inspection process don't need improving . They are working just fine . The evidence is the closeness of the competition . There will always be boundries to be pushed and innovation to be made , as there is in any sport . Nascar is doing a great job of keeping things in check. Idiots who don't understand racing will keep coming up with stupid stuff like this .If anything , I am concerned that penalties have become too severe and may be discouraging innovation .
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Exactly!!!!!!!!! ( imo:)
 
That may be silly but it's not the most ridiculous article I've read. That title goes to an "article" posted awhile back by a new member which basically said the following.....

All auto racing of any kind should be illegal.
All race car drivers should be charged with crimes and arrested.
All drivers/fans of auto racing are nothing more than blood thirsty psychopaths.

You can ask TRL or Thegroundpounder99 and they will tell you I'm not exaggerating on any of the above points of the article.
 
Stewart Fan said:
That may be silly but it's not the most ridiculous article I've read. That title goes to an "article" posted awhile back by a new member which basically said the following.....

All auto racing of any kind should be illegal.
All race car drivers should be charged with crimes and arrested.
All drivers/fans of auto racing are nothing more than blood thirsty psychopaths.

You can ask TRL or Thegroundpounder99 and they will tell you I'm not exaggerating on any of the above points of the article.
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Yep, If memory serves TRL deleted it but I cant be sure, got CRS today.
 
Stewart Fan said:
That may be silly but it's not the most ridiculous article I've read. That title goes to an "article" posted awhile back by a new member which basically said the following.....

All auto racing of any kind should be illegal.
All race car drivers should be charged with crimes and arrested.
All drivers/fans of auto racing are nothing more than blood thirsty psychopaths.

You can ask TRL or Thegroundpounder99 and they will tell you I'm not exaggerating on any of the above points of the article.
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No you're not exaggerating at all, that one will never be topped in the BS department.

This one is BS though. JJ's time was disallowed and he started in the back per the rule book. Guys like Mike Bliss, Landon Cassil, Michael McDowell and the rest of the S&P's have no intentions of racing and shouldn't get a starting spot over a team that does for any reason. They put nothing in to the sport and only take. Insulting to any true racer or fan out there.
 
reck said:
This is a horrible take on the issue.

Provisionals are there for a reason. Just because you fail a post race inspection doesn't mean you are cheating, it means a certain part of the car failed.

Do you really think drivers like Jimmie, who have enough skills to at least hold his own in this sport would purposefully cheat?

There are a plethora of reasons why cars fail inspections and that is why provisionals are needed. Its like a backup.

If NASCAR starts doing what you're implying them they'd send and suspend top tier drivers on a weekly basis. That is no way to do business.

NASCAR gives teams room to explore within their "grey" area so no need to go nuclear on teams that get caught because they went abit too far.

Chad Knaus is someone who likes to push the limits. Ain't nothing wrong with that. Most of the time he pays for it.

Take what NASCAR did to Kenseth earlier this year. They did all but take away the win. Penalty was so harsh even NASCAR realized this and backed off and gave them back their points.

In this sport you gotta do what you gotta do. You can even get away with a little cheating here and there but the trick is to not get too greedy with whatever it is you're doing to your cars.
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I guess you either missed my point or I didn't get it across very well. I am talking about getting caught actually cheating, like rocket fuel or an altered or engineered part. Something Nascar can look at and actually see there was malicious intent. Those are the ones I am saying go home, don't collect your $200.

Part failures and the like should stay the same with the little slaps on the wrists.
 
Jeffrey00 said:
I guess you either missed my point or I didn't get it across very well. I am talking about getting caught actually cheating, like rocket fuel or an altered or engineered part. Something Nascar can look at and actually see there was malicious intent. Those are the ones I am saying go home, don't collect your $200.

Part failures and the like should stay the same with the little slaps on the wrists.
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My problem with 'an altered or engineered part ' is the roof flap spacer of last week . It isn't a part that has any bearing on the racecar . It simply keeps two things from rubbing together . The teams collect an ounce of weight here and there and transfer it to the bottom of the car to help the balance in cornering. Altering the spacer didn't hurt anything , but it was an innovative way to transfer an ounce or two from the top of the car to the bottom. If teams aren't looking for that kind of stuff , they aren't doing their jobs.
Course , being a former Bill Elliott fan , I have no issues with 'innovation'.:D
 
ted@economy said:
My problem with 'an altered or engineered part ' is the roof flap spacer of last week . It isn't a part that has any bearing on the racecar . It simply keeps two things from rubbing together . The teams collect an ounce of weight here and there and transfer it to the bottom of the car to help the balance in cornering. Altering the spacer didn't hurt anything , but it was an innovative way to transfer an ounce or two from the top of the car to the bottom. If teams aren't looking for that kind of stuff , they aren't doing their jobs.
Course , being a former Bill Elliott fan , I have no issues with 'innovation'.:D
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But...

Every team that had the unapproved roof flap part was able to produce an approved part immediately.

Hmmmmmm.
 
Smoke14 said:
But...

Every team that had the unapproved roof flap part was able to produce an approved part immediately.

Hmmmmmm.
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Yes of course , the approved part came with the roof flap kit . It was heavy , maybe stainless steel or something (I have no idea) , the teams said ,hey we could make this out of a lighter alloy and save an ounce of weight .Why not ? No problem to put the approved part back on ,but why not let all the teams use the new part ?
 
ted@economy said:
Yes of course , the approved part came with the roof flap kit . It was heavy , maybe stainless steel or something (I have no idea) , the teams said ,hey we could make this out of a lighter alloy and save an ounce of weight .Why not ? No problem to put the approved part back on ,but why not let all the teams use the new part ?
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If the new part had been presented to NASCAR for approval, it would have been OK.

The cars are weighed and have to be within spec. If a team can move 4 ounces from the top of the car to the left lower rail, well, who knows...
 
While we are If'ing, If there had only been 2 or 3 cars involved especially if they were Rick Hendrick's cars then I firmly believe that there would have been very large fines, deducted points and crew chief's on the bench for a few races, and yes in my mind there is no doubt it would have happened.
 
Johali said:
While we are If'ing, If there had only been 2 or 3 cars involved especially if they were Rick Hendrick's cars then I firmly believe that there would have been very large fines, deducted points and crew chief's on the bench for a few races, and yes in my mind there is no doubt it would have happened.
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True, and I don't agree with this. Nascar basically said lets just hit the reset switch and move on. bull****, if you have 2 teams or 43 teams caught with unapproved parts you punish them.
 
ted@economy said:
My problem with 'an altered or engineered part ' is the roof flap spacer of last week . It isn't a part that has any bearing on the racecar . It simply keeps two things from rubbing together . The teams collect an ounce of weight here and there and transfer it to the bottom of the car to help the balance in cornering. Altering the spacer didn't hurt anything , but it was an innovative way to transfer an ounce or two from the top of the car to the bottom. If teams aren't looking for that kind of stuff , they aren't doing their jobs.
Course , being a former Bill Elliott fan , I have no issues with 'innovation'.:D
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hmmm, might have to rethink the whole unapproved part aspect. Teams using unapproved parts can be considered cheating with malicious intent because if they didn't think issue with the part why didn't they present to Nascar? I understand that we would get into a lot of grey areas.
 
Jeffrey00 said:
True, and I don't agree with this. Nascar basically said lets just hit the reset switch and move on. bull****, if you have 2 teams or 43 teams caught with unapproved parts you punish them.
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Yep.
 
The rules are pretty clear. Not penalizing the teams for the roof flap spacers was a pretty blatant cop out. As someone else mentioned, the teams were able to produce a legally approved roof flap spacer in world record time.

DSquad48 said:
Yes, because obviously the best way to enforce the rule would be to take a top-tier driver out of the race for the weekend and piss off a bunch of fans who pay big money to watch their driver(s) race :rolleyes:
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I don't care who the fans show up to see. Your argument is strictly an economic one that has no bearing on the sport. It'd be like Major League Baseball saying they can't suspend players from the New York Yankees for substance abuse or saying the NFL can't penalize the New England Patriots and if the NFL wants to set a standard, they do it to a team like Kansas or Jacksonville.

The best way to make a statement is to drop the hammer on a big name. You want to get the message across about substance abuse in MLB, suspend someone like A-Rod or Derek Jeter for it. Want to get the message across about helmet-to-helmet contact in the NFL, suspend someone like Haloti Ngata. Want to get the message out about cheating in NASCAR, sit someone like Jimmie Johnson out for a race.

It's like saying we shouldn't send celebrities or athletes to prison because people pump millions of dollars in to the economy to watch their movies or buy their jerseys.

If the fans don't like their driver being in the race because he cheated, there's no room to blame NASCAR. Only one person you can blame for that.
 
Hang em all , it'll teach them a lesson. Do you know what a spacer is ? Do you seriously believe , it is a criminal offence to mess with one ? This is just an example of the micromanagement already taking place in the garage . A complete waste of time and effort . Is there no single nut or bolt or spacer on the car that the team can alter? Put the template on the car , give them a tolerance to work within , tear down the engines of the top five cars , and cut the teams some slack.
 
From what I understand, they are going to or already have produced a better lighter roof flap mechanism because of the changes the teams engineers made. they build a better mousetrap so to speak. The 48 thing was considered an accident, not intentional. I believe like many others that the 48 got a free pass, but I also believe that behind the scenes they were told to not pull this stunt again. This isn't all that uncommon though, over the years various teams have been sent to the back after their cars were found to be illegal and had to be fixed. Sometimes fines were handed out, sometimes not. Kinda stupid to throw a competitive car out of the race IMO. Starting in the back is enough of a penalty. Lets face it, the car would qualify if it was fixed and allowed to redo the qualification. Comparing it to stick and ball drug use? Don't think Nascar is close to that low of a level, doesn't matter who it is, they would be suspended.
 
When NASCAR announced there wouldn't be any fines for this I was surprised. Then when I heard how many teams were involved, I realized how hard it would be to penalize that many teams and make it stick. There were just too many cheaters this time.

I also do not believe it would have made any difference which teams were involved. Remember Carl Long?
 
Smoke14 said:
When NASCAR announced there wouldn't be any fines for this I was surprised. Then when I heard how many teams were involved, I realized how hard it would be to penalize that many teams and make it stick. There were just too many cheaters this time.

I also do not believe it would have made any difference which teams were involved. Remember Carl Long?
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The number of teams involved is why NASCAR didn't penalize them. It had nothing to do with the infraction - it was nothing more than a cop out.
 
“We examined this from every aspect we possibly could and determined that there would be no penalties involved,” said NASCAR Vice President of Competition Robin Pemberton in a statement. “Based upon our inspection and subsequent review, it was our determination that the functionality and safety aspects of the roof flaps were not compromised and the on track competition would not be impacted.
"Moving forward we will work with the roof flap manufacturer and the race teams to evaluate and optimize the associated installation hardware, review the process in its totality and communicate in a timely manner to the garage area any revisions that we determine need to be made.”

“There are fit and finish things that you cut up and change to get them to fit in your cars. Yes, that part is different than what is delivered in the kit and they have the stance that everything in that kit is what has to be in that car.”
Teams were allowed to change the spacers to homemade spacers that NASCAR deemed compliant at the track.
 
roofflapspacers_zps44c1b672.png

roofflap.jpg

Here are the offending pieces causing all the stink. I guess they used two small ones instead of the longer piece.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
The number of teams involved is why NASCAR didn't penalize them. It had nothing to do with the infraction - it was nothing more than a cop out.
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I wouldn't say it was a cop out. What purpose would taking points from three fourths of the field serve?
 
Smoke14 said:
I wouldn't say it was a cop out. What purpose would taking points from three fourths of the field serve?
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To stay consistent, not following the rules doesn't apply just because the offenders were almost half the field, fair is fair and that decision was In My Opinion not the least bit fair.
 
Johali said:
To stay consistent, not following the rules doesn't apply just because the offenders were almost half the field, fair is fair and that decision was In My Opinion not the least bit fair.
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Just wait until Wednesday, none of trucks are running splitters and they have modified the wheel openings to accommodate the mud. There isn't one of them that will fit the template. ;)
 
Smoke14 said:
Just wait until Wednesday, none of trucks are running splitters and they have modified the wheel openings to accommodate the mud. There isn't one of them that will fit the template. ;)
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Yeah but I think they should take the fenders off and the windows out and the drivers wear open faced helmets like the old days. :D
 
I think that their should be harsher penalties for the crew chiefs if the car fails inspection...unless it's proven to be some issue that they don't oversee (like with the gibbs thing) By harsher, I mean banned from Nascar if you're caught cheating too many times.. That way it would cull the likes of Knaus to push over the limits so often. Nothing really happens to him but fines.. if his job was on the line, it would be totally different.
 
Lazyking said:
... if his job was on the line, it would be totally different.
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Yeah , it would be totally different . One of the best crew chiefs ever would be gone . Many infractions are beyond his control , like the lightweight valve that got Kenseth . The crew chief takes the hit for everything because the buck stops at him . I don't want to see him , or any other crew chief gone ..
 
ted@economy said:
Yeah , it would be totally different . One of the best crew chiefs ever would be gone . Many infractions are beyond his control , like the lightweight valve that got Kenseth . The crew chief takes the hit for everything because the buck stops at him . I don't want to see him , or any other crew chief gone ..
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Their has to be accountability somewhere. Knaus and his team are the ones that have had the most problems. That's not a coincidence. Since these fines and probation is such a joke, I would get harsher on the penalties. The thing with Kenseth wouldn't count against the crew chief. That is an engine supplier issue.

No one pays to see the crew chief.
 
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