NASCAR needs a new car ASAP

MRM

MRM

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We heard about the head injuries last season with the Gen7 car. Things have been calmer to this point. But the damage to Larson's car shows one reason why NASCAR needs a new car ASAP. They have also made these cars "spec cars" meaning just about everything on them is the same. Then people wonder why fans complain about the racing and the drivers are now complaining about it. Still, a Cup car should not have
342984967_772782984297999_1844170071574839560_n.jpg
the type of damage that Larson's did on Sunday.
 
I am by no means a roll bar or race car designer, but, didn't the roll bar in the photo do its job in dissipating the impact inertia G's ?

Having said that, if the drivers side had been hit in exactly the same spot at over 170 MPH, I am afraid Larson would be history or fubar. JMHO.
 
A hit like that has never been witnessed in modern NASCAR. They will evaluate and improve. Just like they did with the 2 or 3 (iirc) wall opening crashes in the early 2000s that destroyed/collapsed/damaged the roll cages (Jeff Fuller at Kentucky is most famous).

You see damage that significant as Preece hit what is the weakest part of the cage. There is very little vertical or horizontal bracing there. Had Preece hit the driver's side the damage would not be nearly as significant. There is about 2x the amount of bars on the driver's side as opposed to the passenger's side.

Last hit like this I can remember that might be close in severity is Biffle hitting Jeff Purvis at Nazareth. Both Kyle's are in much better shape than he was.
 
Do you not know how that is supposed to work? That's designed to do that to absorb energy. The drivers side would not crumple in that way. Of anything this means the car is doing its job. No matter what people may think NASCAR knows way more about what it is doing then some schmucks on the internet who haven't had a science class since high school.
 
kkfan91 said:
Do you not know how that is supposed to work? That's designed to do that to absorb energy. The drivers side would not crumple in that way. Of anything this means the car is doing its job. No matter what people may think NASCAR knows way more about what it is doing then some schmucks on the internet who haven't had a science class since high school.
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I wonder how some of these people function in their daily lives. Online NASCAR fans have a knee jerk reaction to EVERYTHING.

Remember when guys getting diagnosed with concussions meant the Gen 7 was a death machine?
 
BobbyFord said:
There’s a reason that car is going to R&D. That isn’t a crumple zone. That wasn’t supposed to fail like that.
“I’m really lucky nothing got me inside the car.”
-Kyle Larson
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Yeah they take cars to R&D to analize how the car did in major wrecks and if needed fix the problems. Nascar has been doing that for years. The drivers area is constructed differently than the passenger side.
 
sdj said:
I am by no means a roll bar or race car designer, but, didn't the roll bar in the photo do its job in dissipating the impact inertia G's ?

Having said that, if the drivers side had been hit in exactly the same spot at over 170 MPH, I am afraid Larson would be history or fubar. JMHO.
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Had the bars not given like they did its likely both Ryan and Kyle would have been injured.

When everyone screams about wanting to make it stronger they fail to realize that rigidity kills people. Look at how rigid the rear of these cars were last year and guys were getting concussions. Now do we want that deflection on the drivers side? No but the drivers side have a lot more reinforcement
 
wi_racefan said:
Had the bars not given like they did its likely both Ryan and Kyle would have been injured.

When everyone screams about wanting to make it stronger they fail to realize that rigidity kills people. Look at how rigid the rear of these cars were last year and guys were getting concussions. Now do we want that deflection on the drivers side? No but the drivers side have a lot more reinforcement
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Yep, it's possible that area of the car was designed to give. But hysterical thinking says WE NEED A NEW CAR lol. Maybe take up chess or learn golf would be a better solution for some around here.
 
...Verily I say unto you, No prophet is accepted in his own country.”...

Racing is often a lot like life and it seems like that no current generation car is acceptable in Nascar. I know every freaking generation since the 1981 update has had some snarkers. I am sure it existed prior I am just commenting on the ones I can easily remember.

I am not trying to dis the critics there are some legitimate complaints. Just be realistic with the expections nothing is perfect.
 
Not only should this be a major red flag to the safety of the car, the overall racing product keeps getting worse. Short track racing has been terrible. Talladega was a dud. It's like they wanted to make a car that races better on the 1.5-mile tracks, but forgot it needs to be good on the other type of tracks. These are spec cars and it's hard to have good racing when everyone is basically using the same equipment.
 
MRM said:
Not only should this be a major red flag to the safety of the car, the overall racing product keeps getting worse. Short track racing has been terrible. Talladega was a dud. It's like they wanted to make a car that races better on the 1.5-mile tracks, but forgot it needs to be good on the other type of tracks. These are spec cars and it's hard to have good racing when everyone is basically using the same equipment.
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Your best bet might be to quit watching until they get a different car unless you enjoy complaining, because a new car ain't happening.
 
BobbyFord said:
There’s a reason that car is going to R&D. That isn’t a crumple zone. That wasn’t supposed to fail like that.
“I’m really lucky nothing got me inside the car.”
-Kyle Larson
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Not to take away from Larson’s experience, but isn’t he known as one of the guys who isn’t involved much on the tech side of racing? He’s a wheel man but I am not sure I would put much stock in his initial impression of this. He walked away from getting hit in the door at a high rate of speed and the car absorbed much of the energy. The car kept him safe. 20 years ago, we might be talking about a severe injury or death.

The biggest issue with the fanbase is that they use the emotional reactions of drivers as fuel for their own outrage. Ryan Newman is the only recent driver whose opinion I fully trust when it comes to the engineering of the car.

Taking the car to R&D isn’t an admission of failure, the car did its job but things can always be better. When it comes to safety, never stop improving.
 
I wonder how many hundreds of thousands of social media posts have been made by people grateful the hit didn’t happen on the drivers’ side?

If it did, there would have been much less damage. The round steel tubing used in the door bars will bend, break / tear or pop welds given sufficient impact force. The driver’s side bars are tied to each other and to the rectangular steel tube main frame rail by welded steel intrusion plates on both sides of the tubes.

The young man injured in the crash of a re-purposed Gen 6 Cup car during Saturday’s Xfinity race was still in hospital last night. Bell rung.

There isn’t much you can’t learn about Nextgen cars if you’re willing to do a little digging … saves a lot of hyperbolic angst.

 
aunty dive said:
I wonder how many hundreds of thousands of social media posts have been made by people grateful the hit didn’t happen on the drivers’ side?

If it did, there would have been much less damage. The round steel tubing used in the door bars will bend, break / tear or pop welds given sufficient impact force. The driver’s side bars are tied to each other and to the rectangular steel tube main frame rail by welded steel intrusion plates on both sides of the tubes.

The young man injured in the crash of a re-purposed Gen 6 Cup car during Saturday’s Xfinity race was still in hospital last night. Bell rung.

There isn’t much you can’t learn about Nextgen cars if you’re willing to do a little digging … saves a lot of hyperbolic angst.

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Lets not let facts get in the way of a good argument
 
The Nature Boy said:
The ignorance and toxicity of this fanbase is a barrier to getting new fans. Who wants to join a fanbase that complains all the time? Where’s the fun in that?
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I do have a degree in Mechanical Engineering so I feel I have a better understanding than most on a lot of this stuff and it amazes me the stuff that comes out of fans sometimes. Same thing can be said about the toe link. I'm pretty sure making that stronger isn't what you really want, then you'll start breaking more important and expensive things.
 
wi_racefan said:
I do have a degree in Mechanical Engineering so I feel I have a better understanding than most on a lot of this stuff and it amazes me the stuff that comes out of fans sometimes. Same thing can be said about the toe link. I'm pretty sure making that stronger isn't what you really want, then you'll start breaking more important and expensive things.
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You can post that a hundred times, all you will get is fake news from the peanut gallery.
 
aunty dive said:
I wonder how many hundreds of thousands of social media posts have been made by people grateful the hit didn’t happen on the drivers’ side?

If it did, there would have been much less damage. The round steel tubing used in the door bars will bend, break / tear or pop welds given sufficient impact force. The driver’s side bars are tied to each other and to the rectangular steel tube main frame rail by welded steel intrusion plates on both sides of the tubes.

The young man injured in the crash of a re-purposed Gen 6 Cup car during Saturday’s Xfinity race was still in hospital last night. Bell rung.

There isn’t much you can’t learn about Nextgen cars if you’re willing to do a little digging … saves a lot of hyperbolic angst.

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Most of the areas on the car are painfully designed to bend or crush to lessen impacts. Hours and hours are devoted to that. Where all that stops completely are in the drivers area, that area is built like a tank. How did they shed so much weight on the LeMans car? Most of it is they took away some of the armor that the cup cars have.
 
Peanut gallery engaged.......

Breaking News.........

There is room for improvement in the rear toe link and suspension of the current car.
We have not seen the final update in this area.
 
wi_racefan said:
Had the bars not given like they did its likely both Ryan and Kyle would have been injured.

When everyone screams about wanting to make it stronger they fail to realize that rigidity kills people. Look at how rigid the rear of these cars were last year and guys were getting concussions. Now do we want that deflection on the drivers side? No but the drivers side have a lot more reinforcement
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This was a huge issue in modified racing in the 80s. The chassis were too rigid. Richie Evans died...at Martinsville... because the cars were too rigid and dint absorb any energy.
 
BobbyFord said:
There’s a reason that car is going to R&D. That isn’t a crumple zone. That wasn’t supposed to fail like that.
“I’m really lucky nothing got me inside the car.”
-Kyle Larson
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I'm astounded some are saying that's how the car is supposed to look. Of course cars have crumple zones but the driver sits in a safety cell that shouldn't be caved in at all. The drivers compartment is NOT part of the crumple zone.
Obviously there are more bars on the drivers side but we don't know how that car would've looked after a drivers side it. And I'm not curious to find out.
 
MRM said:
We heard about the head injuries last season with the Gen7 car. Things have been calmer to this point. But the damage to Larson's car shows one reason why NASCAR needs a new car ASAP. They have also made these cars "spec cars" meaning just about everything on them is the same. Then people wonder why fans complain about the racing and the drivers are now complaining about it. Still, a Cup car should not haveView attachment 70180 the type of damage that Larson's did on Sunday.
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Yep cost effectiveness does not = safety as a priority unfortunately
 
StandOnIt said:
So you are saying Nascar cut corners on safety? How did you come by that?
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I'm saying they're doing the best they can with what they're already highly invested into, and now they're in a bad spot. It's very clear this car is a step backwards in regards to safety compared to it's predecessor, it gave 3 drivers concussions last year Kurt Bowman Reddick, one of them retired. The Preece in car impact is not normal stuff nor the puncture into the greenhouse of Larson's, and if no significant changes get made I guess we all just hope for the best. Right now they're getting lucky in this aspect, and I hope that continues.
 
Turtle84 said:
I'm saying they're doing the best they can with what they're already highly invested into, and now they're in a bad spot. It's very clear this car is a step backwards in regards to safety compared to it's predecessor, it gave 3 drivers concussions last year Kurt Bowman Reddick, one of them retired. The Preece in car impact is not normal stuff nor the puncture into the greenhouse of Larson's, and if no significant changes get made I guess we all just hope for the best. Right now they're getting lucky in this aspect, and I hope that continues.
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Jr. concussed and retired, Newman was put in the hospital among various ankle and leg injuries over the years with the old car. The inuries with the new car in the rear was from too much protection not too little. It's hard to make an educated statement comparing the two until the new car is in service as long as the old one was. The old car wasn't a complete redesign from the ground up but more of a new improved model of the COT
 
StandOnIt said:
That's a good article. It points out that the bar that was loose didn't have a triangle gusset like the other three door bars had welded to them. I would think that would be significant.
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I find it hard to believe Yahoo had anything to do with that article. They usually repeat themselves over & over. I hate that.


I find it hard to believe Yahoo had anything to do with that article. They usually repeat themselves over & over. I hate that.


I find it hard to believe Yahoo had anything to do with that article. They usually repeat themselves over & over. I hate that.


^^^^^this normally what it looks like with a couple other words to divide the paragraphs. Just awful editing.
 
KTMLew01 said:
I find it hard to believe Yahoo had anything to do with that article. They usually repeat themselves over & over. I hate that.


I find it hard to believe Yahoo had anything to do with that article. They usually repeat themselves over & over. I hate that.


I find it hard to believe Yahoo had anything to do with that article. They usually repeat themselves over & over. I hate that.


^^^^^this normally what it looks like with a couple other words to divide the paragraphs. Just awful editing.
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To tell the truth I didn't read it from Yahoo, it was posted on Road and Track. I try not to do Yahoo, my mouse doesn't work properly on that site. :idunno:

www.roadandtrack.com

NASCAR's Scariest Crash of the Year: What Went Wrong With Kyle Larson’s Door Bar Failure

A portion of a tube frame intruding into a NASCAR cabin is terrifying, but this impact would have looked different on the driver's side.
www.roadandtrack.com www.roadandtrack.com
 
StandOnIt said:
To tell the truth I didn't read it from Yahoo, it was posted on Road and Track. I try not to do Yahoo, my mouse doesn't work properly on that site. :idunno:

www.roadandtrack.com

NASCAR's Scariest Crash of the Year: What Went Wrong With Kyle Larson’s Door Bar Failure

A portion of a tube frame intruding into a NASCAR cabin is terrifying, but this impact would have looked different on the driver's side.
www.roadandtrack.com www.roadandtrack.com
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That explains why it makes sense. Was a essentially copy & paste from R&T. I should have known.

Doh...guess that IS on R&T's site. Was in my Yahoo feed. My bad.
 
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