NASCAR needs to own up to it

MRM

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NASCAR needs to own up to the fact that Fontana does not need nor deserve two races a year. The low attendance count yesterday was an embarrasment. They gave away all kinds of tickets and still couldn't get the place half full. They threw Rockingham under the bus to move that date out there and the attendance gets worse every year. It's time to move that date somewhere else, anywhere.
 
Somewhat along the lines of the topic.

What should good attendance be based on:

1. Number of people in attendance.
2. Percent of track seats sold.

some tracks have a large seating capacity and some have much smaller capacity.
 
I agree, two fontanas is too much. This was the most exciting one I can remember and thats not saying much.
 
and here's a shocker:sarcasm:

California TV Ratings down from 2009: The NASCAR Sprint Cup Series race on FOX earned an overnight rating of 5.0 rating /10 share opposite the Olympics yesterday for racing from Auto Club Speedway in Fontana, CA. That's down -6% compared to last year's 5.3/8 in a later time period. Yesterday's 5.0/10 is the lowest overnight for FOX's Fontana race since it moved to February, and the lowest for the race since 2003 when it drew a 4.9/11 in April. Greensboro, NC topped all markets yesterday with a 13.0/23. Charlotte was next with an 11.9/23, up +1% over last year's 11.8/17. For race-by-race TV Ratings chart and TV Ratings news, see my 2010 TV Ratings page for more.(2-22-2010)
 
Kentucky and Gateway need a date for sure. Take a date away from Fontana to give to a 3rd road course, a date away from Atlanta to give to Kentucky, and a date away from Pocono to give to Gateway.
 
Kentucky and Gateway need a date for sure. Take a date away from Fontana to give to a 3rd road course, a date away from Atlanta to give to Kentucky, and a date away from Pocono to give to Gateway.

I approve
 
I still say a bad day at Fontana is better than a good day at Martinsville, attendance wise that is.
 
I still say a bad day at Fontana is better than a good day at Martinsville, attendance wise that is.

The 55,000 at Cali didn't beat the attendance at Martinsville last year.Martinsville had 63,000 at last years races.
 
Well if they can't sell enough tickets they need to take out some of the seats. At least it would look better.....
 
someone at NASCAR must have come across this thread, read below. Now me personaly I am from South Carolina so you know I didn't approve of the loss of the Southern 500 on labor day weekend but NASCAR was doing what it thought would make them more marketable to the public by giving the west another date. Wrong, stick to your roots, drop the 2nd fontana race & bring back the labor day Southern 500. If you wanna 3rd California race then have them tear down Fontana & make it a concrete banked half mile & turn the rest of the land into somekind of large garden or something. Then get rid of the 2nd Loudon date.


Attendance woes continue at Auto Club Speedway

FONTANA, Calif. -- It's time to get off Gillian's Island.

The ruse is up. Gillian Zucker seems to be a very nice and sharp lady who works extremely hard at running Auto Club Speedway and trying to convince all of Southern California what the rest of America already knows: that NASCAR is pretty darn cool, and one of the best sports in the world to experience seeing in person.

But it's not working. It's nothing, really, to be ashamed about. The almighty National Football League couldn't even make it work in fickle Southern California.

Zucker, the track president at the facility where Sunday's Auto Club 500 was run, has been very creative with her marketing program. Not as creative as she is with fudging attendance numbers and convincing herself that her track really does deserve the two Sprint Cup dates it currently owns on the 38-race schedule (counting two non-points events), but creative nonetheless.

Sunday's official guesstimate on attendance was 72,000.

Seriously? The grandstands, which seat 92,000, might have been half full. Maybe. But that might even be a stretch. Let's say they were and give 'em 46,000 for that -- which would mean there were another 26,000 in the infield, where there couldn't have been half that.

A most generous but much closer to accurate estimate on the attendance would have been, say, 56,000. And that's not enough to justify continuing to come this far west two times a year. It's that simple.

Gillian's logic

We all know Kansas Speedway, a place that seats 81,687 and generally sells all of them plus puts another 10,000 in the infield, is about to get a second date. It's likely to happen as soon as next season, when the $680 million Hollywood Casino at Kansas Speedway is set to open overlooking Turn 2. If Kansas gets a second NASCAR weekend, the date has to come from somewhere.

Even Zucker knows it.

"I think every track has to be concerned that it would come from them," Zucker said Sunday while driver Jimmie Johnson, from the nearby San Diego area, was in the process of winning a highly entertaining race at the facility she runs. "And I will be out there kicking and screaming, fighting and scratching, to keep our two dates. I know what we bring to the economy of California. It's something that we're proud of, and it's something that this state needs.

"And I also believe there is a big opportunity for NASCAR here. There are a lot of fans out there. We just need to keep delivering a great product out on that race track." (Continued)

Well, unfortunately, it is not as simple as that. Auto Club Speedway has been holding two events per year since 2004 -- but the crowds have been falling off at both events, or so it appears to the naked eye, for at least the past three years. ("Official" attendance guesstimates by Captain Gillian and her ill-fated, lost-on-a-NASCAR-island crew may not support this assumption that nonetheless is widely held by everyone who actually has gone to a race there during that time span).

Wouldn't it be better for everyone involved to take one date away from Auto Club Speedway and gamble on getting better results in Kansas? For that matter, there are other venues that probably deserve the Sprint Cup date just as much as Kansas and infinitely more than ACS -- such as Las Vegas Motor Speedway, which has been begging for a second race weekend; or even Kentucky Motor Speedway, which is salivating for the chance at just one.

But Zucker isn't buying into the theory that one great race would be better than two seemingly mediocre ones (at least in terms of attendance) at her place.

"I personally think that a lot of emphasis is put on sellouts," Zucker said. "But you have to remember that these facilities are not all equal. If you have a facility that has 50,000 seats and it sells out, is that better than having a facility with 92,000 seats and might not? So I really don't know that selling out one race is better than having two that are almost there and on their way."

Poor Ms. Zucker. You are in denial.

Business time

Zucker also claimed Sunday that the economy is largely to blame for all the empty seats in her grandstands, and there is no doubt that is true. But the crowds began falling off even before the economy went in the tank.

The fact is that NASCAR probably was premature in the first place in awarding a second date to Southern California. You can't blame it for trying. Times were good back in '04. Nationwide interest in the sport was at an all-time high; television ratings and attendance virtually at every track were peaking. Plus it's a huge, relatively untapped market that seemed ripe for the picking. Los Angeles is 50 miles to the west of Auto Club Speedway, and San Diego is 108 miles to the south.

Zucker has relentlessly and tirelessly attempted to engage this vast and varied fan base. For that, she should be applauded. And there are no problems with the facility itself, which is fine. But these folks just don't care that much about racing, or at least not enough of them do.

A reporter asked Zucker on Sunday how she keeps from getting discouraged. She admitted the crowd was not as large as she would have liked.

"It's not as big as I want it to be. But you know what? I love NASCAR. I love it," she said. "And for me, when I was first introduced to this sport and I saw it for the first time, I felt like I had been missing something because I hadn't been experiencing it from the time when I was a small child. I want other people to have that opportunity.

"So I continue to be excited about the idea of introducing a community to this sport. And we continue to have a lot of people who haven't been exposed to it getting exposed to it. That charges me up. That's why I don't get discouraged."

Her enthusiasm and determination are admirable, even if her mathematical skills when figuring attendance figures are not.

But enough is enough. This West Coast Experiment has run its course, and it's not like the venue will be deprived of NASCAR altogether, as it still will have one date to sell. That makes so much more sense.

It's time for NASCAR to get down to business -- elsewhere on this spring date, beginning next season.
 
I would like to see them take away both of Fonatna's races. Put them where the racing is good.
 
I would like to see them race at The Rock again, but I doubt that's going to happen. :(
 
Would love to see NASCAR race at Road Atlanta for another road course.

I would love to see that as well. Why won't nascar add another road course? At least have one in the chase.
 
I would love to see that as well. Why won't nascar add another road course? At least have one in the chase.

I think in the Chase it should have the follow tracks

Super Speedway (Plate Track)
Short Track
Road Course
Pocono or Darlington (Because of the way the track is laid out)
and if possible a dirt track.
 
I would like to see them take away both of Fonatna's races. Put them where the racing is good.

How was the racing not good on sunday? Of all the races there, sundays' was very good, plenty of passing, and a challenge for the lead at the end.
 
Somewhat along the lines of the topic.

What should good attendance be based on:

1. Number of people in attendance.
2. Percent of track seats sold.

some tracks have a large seating capacity and some have much smaller capacity.

It should be based on track seats sold. If you can seat 100,000 people and are only selling 60,000, time to give up that date. California was at least half empty. Attendance continues to decline out there. And they didn't have the excuse of the Oscars, rain, or anything else.
 
Thought I had read that the train that takes people to the track wasn't running due to lack of interest. If true that's a good indicater right there.
 
I think in the Chase it should have the follow tracks

Super Speedway (Plate Track)
Short Track
Road Course
Pocono or Darlington (Because of the way the track is laid out)
and if possible a dirt track.

I like that, but we know dirt wont happen.

Talldega, Martinsville, Pocono, Road Atlanta short course, 2 1.5 mile tracks, another short track, 2 1 mile tracks.

That's 9 tracks.

For the 10th, This track to end the season will change from year to year with the following criteria:

- Must only have 1 race during the entire season, and it Must not be a chase date
- Must have the most official (starting line) lead changes of any track meeting that criteria
- In the event of a tie, the track with the earliest date wins

In simple terms, the first race with the most official lead changes in the 26 "regular season" races.

This removes plate tracks from the picture, and makes sure no track will have 3 dates. Basically, it creates a great opportunity for 1 different track to boast that it had the most lead changes (best competition) of any 1-date tracks, giving that track a second date for that year as the championship hosting track. By nature, It wouldn't be able to boast this until after race 26, though. It will also boost sales, because even though it's only a 9 week sales window, people will want to go there for the (expectly) close racing and the championship.

As an Astrick to that, Road America should go on the cup schedule, Fontana should lose a date, Pocono should lose a date, Kentucky should get on the cup schedule, and a few other changes. That would make more tracks only have 1 date and thus be eligible, would still make Bruton happy because Vegas would still only have 1 date and be championship race eligible, and keep ISC happy because they'd have just a good of chance at getting championship honors.
 
Kentucky and Gateway need a date for sure. Take a date away from Fontana to give to a 3rd road course, a date away from Atlanta to give to Kentucky, and a date away from Pocono to give to Gateway.


...or a fourth road course or a street course ( I recommend St Peterburg, Fl)



Good Call Spike!
 
Somewhat along the lines of the topic.
What should good attendance be based on:
1. Number of people in attendance.
2. Percent of track seats sold.
some tracks have a large seating capacity and some have much smaller capacity.

That is only part of the issue why they gave multiple races to Fontana and other tracks. NASCAR and sponsors are looking for more than seat sales and television viewers. They are looking at the mass media market that blankets the surrounding areas with coverage other than provided during the running of the race. They want the media stories that begin a week before the race: the interviews, public appearances and all the hoopla, show cars drawn because of the event, and any other exposure prior to and post race.

Markets like Rockingham, Darlington, North Wilkesboro were sort of step children in that market and thus were first to lose dates because of over saturization and lack of other nearby mass marketing.
On the other hand, there is Pocono which has a distinct advantage as it is two hours from New York City, Philadelphia and Harrisburg and those three cities alone give extra media coverage sponsors and NASCAR are seeking.

It all boils down to more bang for the buck at no extra expense to either primary recipient. IOWs it is a win, win situation.
 
That is only part of the issue why they gave multiple races to Fontana and other tracks. NASCAR and sponsors are looking for more than seat sales and television viewers. They are looking at the mass media market that blankets the surrounding areas with coverage other than provided during the running of the race. They want the media stories that begin a week before the race: the interviews, public appearances and all the hoopla, show cars drawn because of the event, and any other exposure prior to and post race.

Markets like Rockingham, Darlington, North Wilkesboro were sort of step children in that market and thus were first to lose dates because of over saturization and lack of other nearby mass marketing.
On the other hand, there is Pocono which has a distinct advantage as it is two hours from New York City, Philadelphia and Harrisburg and those three cities alone give extra media coverage sponsors and NASCAR are seeking.

It all boils down to more bang for the buck at no extra expense to either primary recipient. IOWs it is a win, win situation.

Good post and I agree.
 
Really? Where'd you get that stat?

Because I vividly remember a lot of sections being tarped off during the Cup races.

Are you referring to Fontana or Martinsville being tarped off? I was at both M'Ville races last year and don't remember any tarps at either race.

On a side note, M'Ville is my favorite track to attend. I actually like it better than Bristol and the ticket prices are great. I see no need for hate on M'Ville :D
 
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