Rookie of the Year

[HoneyBadger]

Kevin Conway.

Does anyone else have a serious problem with this?

This is what happens as a result of Cup drivers taking up every quality ride in the Nationwide and Truck Series.

 

[kkfan91]

I don't have a problem with it cause he's just playing by the rules. However I did see a lawyer commercial the other day for a class action law suit against Extenze wonder how much longer they will be a sponser for him and when they are gone bye bye Kevin.

 

[HoneyBadger]

I don't have a problem with it cause he's just playing by the rules. However I did see a lawyer commercial the other day for a class action law suit against Extenze wonder how much longer they will be a sponser for him and when they are gone bye bye Kevin.

You missed my entire point (no surprise there).

My point isn't about Conway at all. My point is that quality racecar drivers aren't getting a shot at Cup because they can't even get a shot in Nationwide. Trevor Bayne and Austin Dillon are the only quality drivers I see getting a Cup ride in the next three years. Allgaier's a great driver, but he'll end up back at the dirt tracks in Illinois or back in ARCA. It was just so much more important for Penske that Brad Keselowski (a Cup driver) get a Nationwide championship than it was to keep Allgaier in the organization.

 

[kkfan91]

You missed my entire point (no surprise there).

My point isn't about Conway at all. My point is that quality racecar drivers aren't getting a shot at Cup because they can't even get a shot in Nationwide. Trevor Bayne and Austin Dillon are the only quality drivers I see getting a Cup ride in the next three years. Allgaier's a great driver, but he'll end up back at the dirt tracks in Illinois or back in ARCA. It was just so much more important for Penske that Brad Keselowski (a Cup driver) get a Nationwide championship than it was to keep Allgaier in the organization.

No your question was does anyone have a problem with this as in Conway winning which I said no. The part about Nationwide and Trucks was your opinion. Look where you put a ?

 

[Go Panthers]

You missed my entire point (no surprise there).

My point isn't about Conway at all. My point is that quality racecar drivers aren't getting a shot at Cup because they can't even get a shot in Nationwide. Trevor Bayne and Austin Dillon are the only quality drivers I see getting a Cup ride in the next three years. Allgaier's a great driver, but he'll end up back at the dirt tracks in Illinois or back in ARCA. It was just so much more important for Penske that Brad Keselowski (a Cup driver) get a Nationwide championship than it was to keep Allgaier in the organization.

Right now nascar lacks a "AAA" division, so to speak. What has happened in the Nationwide series is going to hurt the growth of the next generation of Nascar drivers.

You dont see guys running in the Nationwide series like Gordon and others did before they drove cup cars. When i was in scouts as a kid we were always invited to the Busch races for free at Charlotte. We'd follow the busch guys up to the cup series and watch them there.

Where is next generation going to come from?

 

[HoneyBadger]

Right now nascar lacks a "AAA" division, so to speak. What has happened in the Nationwide series is going to hurt the growth of the next generation of Nascar drivers.

You dont see guys running in the Nationwide series like Gordon and others did before they drove cup cars. When i was in scouts as a kid we were always invited to the Busch races for free at Charlotte. We'd follow the busch guys up to the cup series and watch them there.

Where is next generation going to come from?

The problem is they come from ARCA and either end up directly in the Cup Series where they fail or they end up in a S&P Nationwide ride.

And now the Truck Series is headed the direction of the Nationwide Series... superteams, Kyle Busch dominance, several Cup drivers entered in the races, etc.

The K&N Pro Series would be good for NASCAR but they don't race on tracks bigger than a mile. So a driver gets in to Nationwide or Trucks from K&N Pro Series and fails because they've never seen a superspeedway before. This is the strength of the ARCA Series... and, if Dragger and Gundrum don't kill the series, ARCA's going to end up being the new Nationwide Series.

 

[HoneyBadger]

No your question was does anyone have a problem with this as in Conway winning which I said no. The part about Nationwide and Trucks was your opinion. Look where you put a ?

That's because you're too damn headstrong to understand how I was asking the question. Asking if anyone else had a problem had nothing to do with the fact that Conway won ROTY... it had to do with the fact that he was the only ROTY contender, never even cracked the top-25 in competition, etc.

The reason there weren't other ROTY contenders was because guys who have proven themselves in Nationwide end up out of a ride because Childress, Penske and Roush are afraid they're going to threaten their Cup drivers for Nationwide Championships. Cup drivers in Nationwide are the reason Allgaier's without a ride, they're the reason Stephen Leicht is without a ride, and so on.

 

[Go Panthers]

The problem is they come from ARCA and either end up directly in the Cup Series where they fail or they end up in a S&P Nationwide ride.

And now the Truck Series is headed the direction of the Nationwide Series... superteams, Kyle Busch dominance, several Cup drivers entered in the races, etc.

The K&N Pro Series would be good for NASCAR but they don't race on tracks bigger than a mile. So a driver gets in to Nationwide or Trucks from K&N Pro Series and fails because they've never seen a superspeedway before. This is the strength of the ARCA Series... and, if Dragger and Gundrum don't kill the series, ARCA's going to end up being the new Nationwide Series.

Jayski reported earlier that nascar may be looking at a way that drivers can only compete for points in one division. They would be required to notify nascar when they get their license at the start of the year to tell nascar which series they would like to be awarded points in.

Cup drivers can still run in those races, but wont get points. I think that will fix a big part of the issue.

 

[HoneyBadger]

Right now nascar lacks a "AAA" division, so to speak. What has happened in the Nationwide series is going to hurt the growth of the next generation of Nascar drivers.

You dont see guys running in the Nationwide series like Gordon and others did before they drove cup cars. When i was in scouts as a kid we were always invited to the Busch races for free at Charlotte. We'd follow the busch guys up to the cup series and watch them there.

Where is next generation going to come from?

Agreed on the Busch Series comments. A lot of people watch their favorite drivers at the short tracks grow. Allgaier has a huge following from when he ran short tracks in Illinois and a ton of them followed him in to ARCA and Nationwide. Quite honestly, Allgaier and Stenhouse are the only reasons I followed Nationwide the past couple of seasons.

 

[John Galt]

Right now nascar lacks a "AAA" division, so to speak. What has happened in the Nationwide series is going to hurt the growth of the next generation of Nascar drivers. You dont see guys running in the Nationwide series like Gordon and others did before they drove cup cars. When i was in scouts as a kid we were always invited to the Busch races for free at Charlotte. We'd follow the busch guys up to the cup series and watch them there.

Where is next generation going to come from?

Not only the drivers but the owners. Teams could start in BGN and then work their way up to Cup but now? Germaine is the only one halfway seriously trying it and the progress they've made is pitiful. What would happen if Roush and Childress (Just taking two for example, were to fall terminally ill next season? (God forbid!!!) Then we'd be down to Ganassi, Hendrick, Gibbs and Penske? That could be around 8½ cars per owner per race?

By allowing the BGN Series to deteriorate I believe that once again NA__AR has successfully shot itself in the foot.

Keeping on subject; IRT Conway... He had about the average season that one would expect from a Cup rookie from the pre-Jeffie Pooh era.

 

[Mopardh9]

Jayski reported earlier that nascar may be looking at a way that drivers can only compete for points in one division. They would be required to notify nascar when they get their license at the start of the year to tell nascar which series they would like to be awarded points in.

Cup drivers can still run in those races, but wont get points. I think that will fix a big part of the issue.

I hope this is true.

 

[sloggie]

How does that fix anything? Do you really think Kyle Bush competes in Nationwide for championship points?

 

[HoneyBadger]

Jayski reported earlier that nascar may be looking at a way that drivers can only compete for points in one division. They would be required to notify nascar when they get their license at the start of the year to tell nascar which series they would like to be awarded points in.

Cup drivers can still run in those races, but wont get points. I think that will fix a big part of the issue.

I hope this is true.

I don't mind the Cup drivers running in the series.. Nobody in NASCAR minds it. It gives the Nationwide drivers a chance to learn from them. It's these drivers running full-time in massive quantities that's the problem.

The other problem is that the Cup drivers don't give the Nationwide drivers a chance to learn. I'm telling you I have a serious problem everytime a Cup driver wrecks a Nationwide rookie and then says they don't have enough experience... um, that's why they're in the Nationwide Series.

That, and Kyle Busch -- everytime he loses a Nationwide race or is held up against a Nationwide-only driver, he *****es that they should move over for him because he's a Cup driver and he's the almighty Kyle Busch. The Cup drivers feel they're entitled to Nationwide wins because they run in Cup.

 

[Guido]

How does that fix anything? Do you really think Kyle Bush competes in Nationwide for championship points?

True!

It's the money that the struggling teams need and it gets taken buy the Cup guys racing in the lower series and usually winning the top 10 positions and big money each race.

 

[HoneyBadger]

How does that fix anything? Do you really think Kyle Bush competes in Nationwide for championship points?

It doesn't fix anything. It's only going to get worse with the new car coming to Nationwide. Like I said, it's a race-condition practice session for the Cup drivers. When they developed the COT for Nationwide, they said they were going to make it completely different from the Cup cars so there'd be no benefit from running the Nationwide races. Now, all they're doing is making the Cup cars exactly like the Nationwide cars.

Until there's absolutely no benefit from running the Nationwide races, the Cup drivers will be there. If they ran the Nationwide races at completely different tracks than the Cup Series (Rockingham, North Wilkesboro, Pikes Peak, Langley, South Boston, etc.), there'd be no benefit to the Cup teams and the owners will keep them out of those races. The worst things NASCAR ever did in Nationwide were putting V8 engines in the Nationwide cars and modifying the schedule to have the Nationwide Series compete with the Cup Series on superspeedways.

And it just gets worse and worse every year. When Harvick did it in 2001, he was having to travel to the west coast to run the Nationwide race then travel all the way back to the east coast to run the Cup race. It was very hard for him to compete for that championship. Now, you talk to team owners and drivers and they'll tell you it's actually not that difficult anymore because it's only an hour long (maybe two) flight between venues.

They should run the standalone Nationwide races directly after Cup Series qualifying and run them far away -- make it so difficult on the Cup drivers that they have to pick a race. When they race at Sonoma in Cup, race at Rockingham in Nationwide. Run the Nationwide race at 1pm EST and Cup qualifying at 4pm Saturday. That'll keep them out of the Nationwide race.

 

[HoneyBadger]

True!

It's the money that the struggling teams need and it gets taken buy the Cup guys racing in the lower series and usually winning the top 10 positions and big money each race.

This is also true. You should only be eligible for the race winning money if you are running for points in that series (assuming they make the Cup drivers pick a series).

Why do you think the Cup drivers haven't invaded ARCA yet?