California Speedway Demo / Rebuild

Naitch said:
No man, this thread has convinced me that Fontana was the best track ever and that all tracks pale in comparison. Tearing down Fontana would be like if the Green Bay Packers tore down Lambeau Field.
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I understand and know that there are fans who came to NASCAR for the plate races at some level and expect them now and forever and ever and ever. I don't agree fundamentally to the infatuation with 33 degrees or 31 degrees being the comparative Lambeau Field in this comparison over, you know, the facility as a whole. The fact that I think it takes zero talent to do it is a good tell. But I do understand it.
 
virtualbalboa said:
I understand and know that there are fans who came to NASCAR for the plate races at some level and expect them now and forever and ever and ever. I don't agree fundamentally to the infatuation with 33 degrees or 31 degrees being the comparative Lambeau Field in this comparison over, you know, the facility as a whole. The fact that I think it takes zero talent to do it is a good tell. But I do understand it.
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I will never understand how some people can think it takes no talent to run in close quarters to other drivers at 180+ MPH. That just defies logic.
 
StandOnIt said:
Year after year of single file racing, empty stands, and rising real estate values were California's Speedway's problems.
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Literally nobody felt that way in the last 10 years.
Never mind the different versions of the car....blame the track.
Real estate values and paying down debt were the issues here.....and in the process SoCal fans and those of us who migrated to The Inland Empire got dumped on.
Fontana was a great track, and it's not coming back in any form....but still NASCAR is silent. Slap in the face to those of us who saw that as our home track. Ball up and admit that it isn't coming back Phelps.
 
Naitch said:
No man, this thread has convinced me that Fontana was the best track ever and that all tracks pale in comparison. Tearing down Fontana would be like if the Green Bay Packers tore down Lambeau Field.
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You ever been there sport?
 
Naitch said:
I will never understand how some people can think it takes no talent to run in close quarters to other drivers at 180+ MPH. That just defies logic.
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Hey, if Mike Wallace can do it...

I'm as rabidly anti-pack racing as anyone here but I'll acknowledge it takes talent, skill, and experience. I think surviving and winning requires more luck than the other forms of racing seen in NASCAR, but just watching will show not anyone can do it.
 
Daytripper said:
It takes talent, just not as much as real racing!
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Real racing is being the first person to complete a predetermined distance. Different types of racing takes different types of talent.

I don’t like cookie cutter mile and a halves or Michigan/Fontana style tracks but I wouldn’t denigrate the talent it takes to be successful there.
 
BobbyFord said:
The stands weren't empty. It wasn't single file racing. Multiple lines through the corners, as opposed to guys just following each other around lap after lap...đźš‚
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I love that area too....down to earth people. Great place to go. Miss it terribly.
 
Revman said:
Literally nobody felt that way in the last 10 years.
Never mind the different versions of the car....blame the track.
Real estate values and paying down debt were the issues here.....and in the process SoCal fans and those of us who migrated to The Inland Empire got dumped on.
Fontana was a great track, and it's not coming back in any form....but still NASCAR is silent. Slap in the face to those of us who saw that as our home track. Ball up and admit that it isn't coming back Phelps.
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The crowds that continued to decline did. ;)
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Hey, if Mike Wallace can do it...

I'm as anti-pack racing as anyone here but I'll acknowledge it takes talent, skill, and experience. I think surviving and winning require more luck than the other forms of racing seen in NASCAR, but just watching will show not anyone can do it.
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And the survival and luck element often comes because certain drivers run out of talent. If plate racing were so easily, we wouldn’t regularly see big pileups. The big pileups happen because of how difficult it is to run in close quarters at 180+ MPH.
 
Naitch said:
I will never understand how some people can think it takes no talent to run in close quarters to other drivers at 180+ MPH. That just defies logic.
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Cleetus McFarland was faster in ARCA practice just a week or so ago than Helio Castroneves, Corey Day, or Brenden Queen. You can't have it both ways.
 
virtualbalboa said:
Cleetus McFarland was faster in ARCA practice just a week or so ago than Helio Castroneves, Corey Day, or Brenden Queen. You can't have it both ways.
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That's one thing about pack racing - practice is insignificant. That's why Cup has essentially stopped scheduling it. It's all about knowing how to push and be pushed (skills to learn), how the car does in the draft, and who you can get to partner with you.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
That's one thing about pack racing - practice is insignificant. That's why Cup has essentially stopped scheduling it. It's all about knowing how to push and be pushed, and who you can get to partner with you.
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I was assured it was impossible to drive at these speeds without special talents. Now it's irrelevant until you get in a draft? Huh
 
virtualbalboa said:
Cleetus McFarland was faster in ARCA practice just a week or so ago than Helio Castroneves, Corey Day, or Brenden Queen. You can't have it both ways.
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Derrike Cope once won a Dover race on speed. I am going to use that one example to prove that Cope was a better driver than Dale Earnhardt and Darrell Waltrip.

Sometimes flukes happen. Hut Stricklin once dominated a Southern 500.

virtualbalboa said:
I was assured it was impossible to drive at these speeds without special talents. Now it's irrelevant until you get in a draft? Huh
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You’re either being obtuse or willfully ignorant. Cletus is probably a **** tier racer but he’s at least a car guy who is used to fast speeds and has actually raced before (which you keep ignoring). That puts him miles ahead of most.

Your average yahoo off the street, including you? You would spin off turn 2 and enter the backstretch sideways, if you don’t lose control and put it in the wall beforehand. I have seen some arrogant crap from this fanbase but a fan thinking they can hop in a stock car and turn a competitive lap at any track has to rank up there. Just pure disrespect and arrogance.
 
virtualbalboa said:
I was assured it was impossible to drive at these speeds without special talents. Now it's irrelevant until you get in a draft? Huh
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No, you've been assured it's impossible to RACE in a pack at these speeds without talent, not DRIVE around in practice as a single car with no one around you.

If you don't have the needed talent and skill to run in the draft, you're either going to wreck or fall out of the draft. If you fall out, it doesn't matter what kinds or types of skill or talent you have; your only option is to hope for a Lucky Dawg.
 
Naitch said:
Derrike Cope once won a Dover race on speed. I am going to use that one example to prove that Cope was a better driver than Dale Earnhardt and Darrell Waltrip.

Sometimes flukes happen. Hut Stricklin once dominated a Southern 500.
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I love how predictable a fluke it is.

Naitch said:
You’re either being obtuse or willfully ignorant. Cletus is probably a **** tier racer but he’s at least a car guy who is used to fast speeds and has actually raced before (which you keep ignoring). That puts him miles ahead of most.

Your average yahoo off the street, including you? You would spin off turn 2 and enter the backstretch sideways, if you don’t lose control and put it in the wall beforehand. I have seen some arrogant crap from this fanbase but a fan thinking they can hop in a stock car and turn a competitive at any track has to rank up there. Just pure disrespect and arrogance.
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So what you're saying is practically anyone with experience in a high performance race car of any classification has greater capability than a random person, in spite of most racing being done in a straight line or on short tracks by regular ass people. I gotcha.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
No, you've been assured it's impossible to RACE in a pack at these speeds, not DRIVE around in practice as a single car with no one around you.

If you don't have the needed talent and skill to run in the draft, you're either going to wreck or fall out of the draft. If you fall out, it doesn't matter what kinds or types of skill or talent you have; you're toast.
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Turning a hot lap in practice or even qualifying on a plate track mostly comes down to the quality of your car. There’s not much you can do to show your talents there.

But you still have to clear the baseline level of skill to drive a race car. After all, Cody Ware is closer in talent to prime Dale Earnhardt than he is to any of us here.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
No, you've been assured it's impossible to RACE in a pack at these speeds without talent, not DRIVE around in practice as a single car with no one around you.

If you don't have the needed talent and skill to run in the draft, you're either going to wreck or fall out of the draft. If you fall out, it doesn't matter what kinds or types of skill or talent you have; you're toast.
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The most important thing in keeping the draft is not having an ancient detuned or spent motor that is 25 mph slower than your competition.
 
Naitch said:
If you’re racing on a short track, you are by definition not a “regular ass” person. You are a race car driver.
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They're regular people with jobs racing for a purse where the winner takes home $250 or $400. It's a hobby. Lmao

Do I get to be a race car driver if I take a rental Corvette to Test and Tune at Milan?
 
virtualbalboa said:
They're regular people with jobs racing for a purse where the winner takes home $250 or $400. It's a hobby. Lmao
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What does the purse have to do with anything? I don’t care if you’re a greeter at Walmart. If you race on the weekends, you’re a race car driver and miles ahead of you and me.

I have a lot of respect for anyone who goes out there and races, no matter what level. Racing is not easy. Whether you do it as a hobby or for a living, racing a car in close quarters with other people is really ****** hard. Those guys who do it for a “hobby” still have to learn car control, race craft, patience, and a lot of other things that you and I don’t in our day to day lives.
 
Naitch said:
What does the purse have to do with anything? I don’t care if you’re a greeter at Walmart. If you race on the weekends, you’re a race car driver and miles ahead of you and me.

I have a lot of respect for anyone who goes out there and races, no matter what level. Racing is not easy. Whether you do it as a hobby or for a living, racing a car in close quarters with other people is really ****** hard. Those guys who do it for a “hobby” still have to learn car control, race craft, patience, and a lot of other things that you and I don’t in our day to day lives.
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What separates me from them is my willingness to pay to race. That's it. If I wanted to blow a few thousand I could be on track this year. I'm not saying I'd be good. But I can easily be on track. And it would be a hobby.
 
virtualbalboa said:
What separates me from them is my willingness to pay to race. That's it. If I wanted to blow a few thousand I could be on track this year. I'm not saying I'd be good. But I can easily be on track. And it would be a hobby.
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You could and you would learn something in the process. You would gradually get better at driving a race car at a base level.

But you haven’t taken that initial step so I think you’re a long ways off from turning a hot lap at Daytona.
 
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