#11 Team Penalty

wi_racefan said:
One would think, but race teams do a lot of crazy things to make up for something else in that area. It’s hard to believe that SOP wouldn't be to weigh them all, therefore the only way would end up with a light one was because it was intentional. This isn't ol Billy-Bob in his garage putting together an engine for his old pick-up and just assumes everything that he buys is right. These guys do QC on everything.
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You’ve come to the conclusion that it was done purposefully because “it’s hard to believe” their standard operating procedures weren’t followed.

The facts of the matter are that humans err and that there is no way to gain any advantage in this manner. The opposite is true.
 
aunty dive said:
You’ve come to the conclusion that it was done purposefully because “it’s hard to believe” their standard operating procedures weren’t followed.

The facts of the matter are that humans err and that there is no way to gain any advantage in this manner. The opposite is true.
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Are you sure? Then why did some of the other engines come back with light rods in them too? Seems like a lot of human error
 
aunty dive said:
I wasn’t commenting on the severity of the penalty.

When you own the game, you make the rules. 😇
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Nah, it isn't time to try to throw shade on Nascar. The part was illegal period back then and no amount of yota double talk is going to change that OR the fact that they took a winning engine away before NAscar could inspect it this time.
 
wi_racefan said:
Are you sure? Then why did some of the other engines come back with light rods in them too? Seems like a lot of human error
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I’m sure.

I wasn’t aware of any other similar transgressions at JGR or elsewhere. Please enlighten me.
 
Blaze said:
Lot of scripts getting mixed up around here. Damn.
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Some people talking about another situation with some similarities and some of the same players.

Do you have something to contribute to the discussion?
 
Charlie Spencer said:
I assume Toyota will pick up the $100K fine. It's gonna be difficult to compensate JGR for the points...
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Don't lose track of the big picture. This is a win for "Toyota" regardless of the penalty. The publicity alone is probably worth millions of dollars...all at Denny's expense!
 
aunty dive said:
Some people talking about another situation with some similarities and some of the same players.

Do you have something to contribute to the discussion?
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I mean I would comment on the fact that I agree with @wi_racefan but then you would tell me I’m wrong, and then when I discuss back I’ll be told I like to argue, for doing what everyone else is doing, so nah, I got nothing to add.
 
aunty dive said:
I’m sure.

I wasn’t aware of any other similar transgressions at JGR or elsewhere. Please enlighten me.
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After getting busted for the one in the Matt's car they went through and checked all the engines that were slated for competition and they found at least one more. That one was scheduled to be in Clint's car.
 
aunty dive said:
I’m sure.

I wasn’t aware of any other similar transgressions at JGR or elsewhere. Please enlighten me.
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Sorry I was wrong it was 3 engines with light rods in them. Somehow they were all slated for the same driver..........

www.theoaklandpress.com

TRD recalls 3 Bowyer engines after Kenseth penalty

RICHMOND, Va. (AP) — A parts review by Toyota after Matt Kenseth’s penalty led the manufacturer to pull three engines from Michael Waltrip Racing’s inventory as a precautionary mo…
www.theoaklandpress.com www.theoaklandpress.com
 
Revman said:
No excuse. NONE. I am pissed. Bring the heat. I have it coming, and it's part of the fun.....even when it isn't "fun" for me.
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Don't beat yourself up Rev, it could happen to anyone...and don't worry if JGR runs low on engines...I'm sure Rick would be glad to loan them some engines until they replace the ones needing rebuilt.
 
wi_racefan said:
Sorry I was wrong it was 3 engines with light rods in them. Somehow they were all slated for the same driver..........

www.theoaklandpress.com

TRD recalls 3 Bowyer engines after Kenseth penalty

RICHMOND, Va. (AP) — A parts review by Toyota after Matt Kenseth’s penalty led the manufacturer to pull three engines from Michael Waltrip Racing’s inventory as a precautionary mo…
www.theoaklandpress.com www.theoaklandpress.com
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“Warning lights are flashin’ down in quality control”

Thanks. If I heard about that, I forgot about it. Sounds to me like somebody took a shortcut and trusted the Mahle piston QC process. Bad mistake.
 
wi_racefan said:
Sorry I was wrong it was 3 engines with light rods in them. Somehow they were all slated for the same driver..........

www.theoaklandpress.com

TRD recalls 3 Bowyer engines after Kenseth penalty

RICHMOND, Va. (AP) — A parts review by Toyota after Matt Kenseth’s penalty led the manufacturer to pull three engines from Michael Waltrip Racing’s inventory as a precautionary mo…
www.theoaklandpress.com www.theoaklandpress.com
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Is this the same bunch MWR that put rocket fuel in their engine at Daytona when Toyota made their debut into the Cup series? Oh say it ain't so lol.
 
DIDIT said:
Don't lose track of the big picture. This is a win for "Toyota" regardless of the penalty. The publicity alone is probably worth millions of dollars...all at Denny's expense!
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Let's be clear....there is a difference between the PR arm Toyota Racing/Toyota and TRD. This is horribly embarrassing for TRD...nothing good here for the team members who bust their asses every day to win races.
 
TRD are the "hands dirty" bunch who don't see the limelight or entertain the pretty people. In the spirit the culture that is TRD, I won't rationalize it. It's inexcusable....and it stings 100 times worse than an engine failure. While I believe with 100% certainty there wasn't anything going on with the engines, I lose the ability to assert that with this error. I get that. I can take the shots. My loyalty does not waver. I run my mouth when WE win, and I will take the kick in the nuts when this kind of **** happens. Expect my boy @StandOnIt to shoot carp in the barrel. Have at it.
 
Revman said:
TRD are the "hands dirty" bunch who don't see the limelight or entertain the pretty people. In the spirit the culture that is TRD, I won't rationalize it. It's inexcusable....and it stings 100 times worse than an engine failure. While I believe with 100% certainty there wasn't anything going on with the engines, I lose the ability to assert that with this error. I get that. I can take the shots. My loyalty does not waver. I run my mouth when WE win, and I will take the kick in the nuts when this kind of **** happens. Expect my boy @StandOnIt to shoot carp in the barrel. Have at it.
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It's Koi.
 
Revman said:
TRD are the "hands dirty" bunch who don't see the limelight or entertain the pretty people. In the spirit the culture that is TRD, I won't rationalize it. It's inexcusable....and it stings 100 times worse than an engine failure. While I believe with 100% certainty there wasn't anything going on with the engines, I lose the ability to assert that with this error. I get that. I can take the shots. My loyalty does not waver. I run my mouth when WE win, and I will take the kick in the nuts when this kind of **** happens. Expect my boy @StandOnIt to shoot carp in the barrel. Have at it.
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You are always welcome to become an HMS/Chevy fan. We love your loyalty and enthusiasm and can totally understand your move if you choose to do so. But if you drive your own moving van watch out for low underpasses. :D
 
Nitro Dude said:
You are always welcome to become an HMS/Chevy fan. We love your loyalty and enthusiasm and can totally understand your move if you choose to do so. But if you drive your own moving van watch out for low underpasses. :D
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I'd louver too....not. At least MY people didn't go on the passive/aggressive offensive like Jeffy did. Stood up and admitted wrong doing......
 
Revman said:
I'd louver too....not. At least MY people didn't go on the passive/aggressive offensive like Jeffy did. Stood up and admitted wrong doing......
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Just keep in mind that the door is always open. But the sooner you make the move the sooner you will start accumulating HMS/Chevy fan seniority. :)
 
StandOnIt said:
Is this the same bunch MWR that put rocket fuel in their engine at Daytona when Toyota made their debut into the Cup series? Oh say it ain't so lol.
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That was 100% on David Hyder, he was famous for cheated up race cars, from his own late models right on up to Cup
 
Spotter22 said:
That was 100% on David Hyder, he was famous for cheated up race cars, from his own late models right on up to Cup
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....and Lee White was pissed. Really pissed.
 
This was a brutal penalty. Don't quite understand why it was so severe, but hey.
 
jaqua19 said:
This was a brutal penalty. Don't quite understand why it was so severe, but hey.
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I honestly do, and I support it. Do I think that TRD has been messing with the engines, and trying to cover it up? Hell no. 100% no. Never. Not even a little. Nope. Having said that, there is damage done because the mistake allows the speculation to exist, and that is not good for the sport. You cannot be messing with engines. We all know that. Fact....the 11 team was penalized because of a procedural error on TRD's part by OUR own admission. They were not penalized for an illegal engine. However, the procedural error opens the door of accusation....and if there is any uncertainty over what is happening with the motors, this sport will have severe credibility issues.
 
jaqua19 said:
This was a brutal penalty. Don't quite understand why it was so severe, but hey.
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The Good (Rule) Book sayeth thou shalt not speak blasphemy against one of the Holy Trinity: the Lord God Engine (in this case), the Sacred Fuel, or the Holy Tires. To doeth so shalt resulteth in the wrath of St. Daytona, who shall smiteth thee within a cubit of thy life.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
The Good (Rule) Book sayeth thou shalt not speak blasphemy against one of the Holy Trinity: the Lord God Engine (in this case), the Sacred Fuel, or the Holy Tires. To doeth so shalt resulteth in the wrath of St. Daytona, who shall smiteth thee within a cubit of thy life.
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They were smoted.
 
The first link is about Denny's recent penalty. The second link is from before that penalty was announced and talks about the team's problems over the entire season.

www.si.com

Denny Hamlin: Margin For Error is Gone After TRD Sealed Engine Penalty

After last weekend's race at Michigan International Speedway, Denny Hamlin thought he was firmly in the fight for the NASCAR Cup Series regular season champions
www.si.com www.si.com

slicksandsticks.com

Joe Gibbs Racing’s Engine Woes: HMS Insider Sounds the Alarm for the Team

HMS insider raises red flags on Joe Gibbs Racing's engine woes, stressing urgent need for improvement amid mounting playoff pressure.
slicksandsticks.com slicksandsticks.com

>>...Joe Gibbs Racing’s Engine Woes: The recent remarks from an HMS insider regarding the challenges faced by Joe Gibbs Racing (JGR) in the Cup Series raise critical questions about the team’s future direction. With engine reliability issues undermining their playoff hopes and competitors like 23XI Racing gaining ground, JGR finds itself at a crossroads...<<
 
Revman said:
I honestly do, and I support it. Do I think that TRD has been messing with the engines, and trying to cover it up? Hell no. 100% no. Never. Not even a little. Nope. Having said that, there is damage done because the mistake allows the speculation to exist, and that is not good for the sport. You cannot be messing with engines. We all know that. Fact....the 11 team was penalized because of a procedural error on TRD's part by OUR own admission. They were not penalized for an illegal engine. However, the procedural error opens the door of accusation....and if there is any uncertainty over what is happening with the motors, this sport will have severe credibility issues.
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Well in fairness once you broke those block seals there was no other choice then self report
 
Tumbleweed said:
The first link is about Denny's recent penalty. The second link is from before that penalty was announced and talks about the team's problems over the entire season.

www.si.com

Denny Hamlin: Margin For Error is Gone After TRD Sealed Engine Penalty

After last weekend's race at Michigan International Speedway, Denny Hamlin thought he was firmly in the fight for the NASCAR Cup Series regular season champions
www.si.com www.si.com

slicksandsticks.com

Joe Gibbs Racing’s Engine Woes: HMS Insider Sounds the Alarm for the Team

HMS insider raises red flags on Joe Gibbs Racing's engine woes, stressing urgent need for improvement amid mounting playoff pressure.
slicksandsticks.com slicksandsticks.com

>>...Joe Gibbs Racing’s Engine Woes: The recent remarks from an HMS insider regarding the challenges faced by Joe Gibbs Racing (JGR) in the Cup Series raise critical questions about the team’s future direction. With engine reliability issues undermining their playoff hopes and competitors like 23XI Racing gaining ground, JGR finds itself at a crossroads...<<
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First article.....So, Denny was upset. That's not news.....but it is worthy of note that David Wilson delivered the news himself. That's leadership, so thanks for that.

The second article is complete ****. It is written as if JGR is in control of the engine stuff. They aren't....TRD is. Duh....and it was written pre-Michigan when every ****** Toyota finished the race, and WE won the ******** thing with great power even with a "margin" installed----presumingly a software adjustment.

I don't mind discussion over what TRD did or didn't do, but good God....that second article is third tier YouTube stuff.
 
Spotter22 said:
Well in fairness once you broke those block seals there was no other choice then self report
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That is true, and the admission that I was speaking about was the post penalty stuff. The self-report was not admirable, it was necessary.
 
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