I would put Trickle ahead of Phillips.... Trickle came down to Larry's home track and decimated him. Do not get me wrong, Larry was a hell of a wheel man. But in short track racing did not quite measure up to Trickle.
2022 Nascar Hall of Fame
- Thread starter StandOnIt
- Start date
I love this... have to play it over and over. And the crowd goes wild!
wi_racefan
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Actually Matt would have been my #4 on the modern era ballot behind Kirk, Carl and Jeff Burton.
Carl was a far more popular driver than Matt and did a lot more to grow the sport on the fan and media side while he was in the car. Matt has a championship, Carl tied for a championship under the playoff system to a guy that didn't have a chance had it not been for the playoff system, so to me that's a wash. (I'm a huge smoke fan, but can look at it objectively). Besides a couple broadcast by Matt neither have really done much for the sport since stepping out of the car.
Jeff Burton was referred to as the "mayor" because he did a lot as far as working with the drivers and sanctioning body. Like him or not in the booth he's done a lot for the sport since getting out of the car.
Kirk IMO has been underrated and looked over for far to long for all of his accomplishments with Sr.
Two guys not even on the ballot I would have actually put before Matt would be Larry McReynolds and Jeff Hammond. Both accomplished a lot and continue to do a lot for the sport to this day.
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Which means nothing in regard to winning a race or the skill behind the wheel. Just my honest opinion.
wi_racefan
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I respect that but this is the hall of fame proven by the overwhelming margin that Jr was inducted by. Also a guy that has 2 less cup wins than Carl......
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cheesepuffs
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Junior's popularity and influence compared to Carl is night and day though. In addition to the fanbase stuff itself, Junior is also an Xfinity championship car owner and a broadcaster. His hands are in way more areas of the sport than Carl's ever were and he's succeeded in all of it.
wi_racefan
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I get that and that's why I thought anyone that didn't vote for Jr should be removed from the voting panel. But the point that was trying to be made (not by me) was that doing stuff outside the car doesn't mean anything, wins do.
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Revman
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I don't like any Hall of Fame for any sport. Period. I have never understood them. How about a museum dedicated to the history of the sport where people can come and celebrate those who they consider to be the pillars of the sport? Why does it have to be a competition? What in the hell is the point? Frankly, I'm glad it's over for another year.
9050lx
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I suspect a lot of people don't know how good a driver Dick Trickle was. A short track master. Comes to your home track, sets fast time, takes home the money. Probably have to ask Rusty Wallace or Mark Martin how talented he was.
Charlie Spencer
Road courses and short tracks.
How do you propose deciding who's a pillar of the sport and who isn't? Where do you draw the line? Casey Atwood? Buckshot Jones?
wi_racefan
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Witnessed the man race, no doubt a short track legend. It's no joke the guy would show up anywhere and everyone else was racing for 2nd.
Unfortunately he'll never see the nascar HOF as his nascar stats are lacking.
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Allen B
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Everyone gets a participation trophy. All who played in these games we know you tried your best.
Greg
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I agree most of his great mid west racing achievements weren't nascar races. But I still think they should eventually put racers like him and Bob Senneker into the HoF.
I do think that indirectly they were big positives for the brand and nascar should be big enough to recognize them.
Daytripper
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If not for competition what is the point of any sport?
9050lx
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Not to mention, Jr was born into royalty in a sense, a likeable chap, talks intelligently, and is a very capable driver.
Revman
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Not really my point at all. Games haves scores based on performance. HOF candidates are judged by guys like Dave Moody. Judged. Like figure skating. It is my understanding that several (if not many) judges didn't even show up this year. Who are the judges and what credentials do they have besides being "industry insiders?"
Revman
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This is exactly my point.
Probably true, but to win Rookie of the year at the age of 47 running only a partial schedule as a temporary driver is pretty impressive
Charlie Spencer
Road courses and short tracks.
You misunderstand, I was asking YOU directly if those guys belong in this proposed museum. If they don't, how do you propose selecting who does? If they do, then we can just use Racing Reference as a museum since everyone and their accomplishments is already in it.
Allen B
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I understand your point. But, I can't think of a single sporting event where there isn't some judgement call that is made during the course of the event. That's like saying you don't like sports because you don't know who the refs, judges, track officials are lol.
Everyone has their own opinion who the best is in the athletic sport or event they follow. That's what makes it fun. At least for me it is.
sdj
Just a race fan
I have been to the Hall of Fame in Charlotte twice. Not only is it a HOF, it is also a hell of a museum. If any get the chance to go, take it, and oh yeah, plan a whole day for it. 
DIDIT
Old School Fan
Interesting. I wonder how someone would know who I consider a pillar of the sport so when I come I can celebrate them being included in said museum?
Revman
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Museum curators (i.e. Winston Kelly) solicit artifacts. Rotate exhibits. Let Winston Kelly and Tom Jensen decide....NASCAR historians.
Revman
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Winston Kelly probably knows.
Charlie Spencer
Road courses and short tracks.
Have you been to the hall? Have you even looked at the frickin' web site? Those things are already happening.
Artifacts are being solicited:
Artifact Donations Guidelines | NASCAR Hall of Fame
At this time we’re not collecting tribute material or mass produced collectibles. Fill out a NASCAR Hall of Fame donation request here.
www.nascarhall.com
Exhibits rotated now, about racers and racing outside of just HOF members. Last time I checked, Bubba isn't in the HOF:
Bubba Wallace's Winning Talladega Car | A Limited-Time Exhibit at the NASCAR Hall of Fame
For a limited time, Bubba Wallace's 2021 Talladega Superspeedway winning Toyota Camry is on display in the NASCAR Hall of Fame.
www.nascarhall.com
There's a lot more in here than just the selected HOF members and Cup drivers:
Whelen Hall of Champions
In the Whelen Hall of Champions the NASCAR Hall of Fame honors the individuals who have risen to the top of their sports.
www.nascarhall.com
Martinsville isn't a driver, and Lightning McQueen is a fictional car.
Martinsville Speedway 75th Anniversary Exhibit | NASCAR Hall of Fame | Curators' Corner
As part of Martinsville Speedway’s 75th Anniversary season, the NASCAR Hall of Fame and NASCAR have partnered to recognize the history and legacy of the track.
www.nascarhall.com
And what qualifies Kelly and Jensen as 'NASCAR historians'? What about their backgrounds makes the better qualified than the people voting for HOF membership?
DIDIT
Old School Fan
Yep, that really supports your position.
Revman
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Yep. Skip the vote, and we're good IMO.Have you been to the hall? Have you even looked at the frickin' web site? Those things are already happening.
Artifacts are being solicited:
Artifact Donations Guidelines | NASCAR Hall of Fame
At this time we’re not collecting tribute material or mass produced collectibles. Fill out a NASCAR Hall of Fame donation request here.
Exhibits rotated now, about racers and racing outside of just HOF members. Last time I checked, Bubba isn't in the HOF:
Bubba Wallace's Winning Talladega Car | A Limited-Time Exhibit at the NASCAR Hall of Fame
For a limited time, Bubba Wallace's 2021 Talladega Superspeedway winning Toyota Camry is on display in the NASCAR Hall of Fame.
There's a lot more in here than just the selected HOF members and Cup drivers:
Whelen Hall of Champions
In the Whelen Hall of Champions the NASCAR Hall of Fame honors the individuals who have risen to the top of their sports.
Martinsville isn't a driver, and Lightning McQueen is a fictional car.
Martinsville Speedway 75th Anniversary Exhibit | NASCAR Hall of Fame | Curators' Corner
As part of Martinsville Speedway’s 75th Anniversary season, the NASCAR Hall of Fame and NASCAR have partnered to recognize the history and legacy of the track.
And what qualifies Kelly and Jensen as 'NASCAR historians'? What about their backgrounds makes the better qualified than the people voting for HOF membership?
Well, I like Winston's input more than a couple of recent NASCAR Champions who admittedly don't know much about those who they are supposed to vote on...Jensen too. What makes Chase Elliott qualified to vote?
Revman
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I think my point is that the vote is BS pitting a man or woman's entire career against another. For what? How in the hell can a bunch of people in 2022 evaluate the worth of a guy who raced in the 60's? Baseball is as bad involving the media.
Whizzer
Gig'em
Foyt is listed as a selection in the Pioneer Category but was he really a Pioneer? In 34 years he raced 124 races averaging fewer than 4 races per year. He wasn't a regular in the series and cherry picked his races. While I think A.J. is arguably the greatest driver of all time based on his versatility and ability, not so sure he should be considered a Pioneer of NASCAR. Ard, Matthews and Moody are better suited as selections for Pioneers of NASCAR. JUMHO. YMMV.
StandOnIt
Farm Truck
It's all a matter of opinion. Foyt was bigger than Nascar back in his day and he won Daytona 5 times.Foyt is listed as a selection in the Pioneer Category but was he really a Pioneer? In 34 years he raced 124 races averaging fewer than 4 races per year. He wasn't a regular in the series and cherry picked his races. While I think A.J. is arguably the greatest driver of all time based on his versatility and ability, not so sure he should be considered a Pioneer of NASCAR. Ard, Matthews and Moody are better suited as selections for Pioneers of NASCAR. JUMHO. YMMV.
Whizzer
Gig'em
Doesn't answer the question, "was he really a Pioneer?" To me, the category title, "Pioneer", indicates someone who was involved in the development of the sport in capacities beyond being a winning driver, but not excluding it as well. It could be a mix of driver/innovator/crew chief/ owner as long as they were specifically involved in being a Pioneer of the sport and have laudable accomplishments.
That may be where our differences lie because there is no question, at least in my book, A.J. was one of, if not the greatest, driver of my generation and that generation covers my interest in NASCAR since 1958 at the age of 22. I think there are better suited candidates when it comes to Pioneers of the sport. My guess is, "Smoke" is pushing for A.J. to be inducted.
BUT ......... like I said, JMHO. YMMV.
I like we can discuss this without getting anxious or resorting to name calling. Thanx!!
wi_racefan
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I wasn't a fan of the sport back when AJ was driving but I have to imagine having him in the field brought a lot of attention to the sport, so I guess an argument could be made it did a lot to grow the sport
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StandOnIt
Farm Truck
Sam Ard had one Winston Cup start. Banjo Matthews in 11 years averaged 4.6 races a year with 0 wins. Ralph Moody ran a total of 47 races in 5 years with 5 wins. Poineers in that sense, but moving the needle for Nascar compared to A.J. Foyt? You be the judge. Foyt's 7 wins in 128 races with 5 coming from Daytona which is mainly the track he raced on over a period of 34 years stands up with any of those drivers IMO, not to mention who is the most popular driver, has multiple titles in the most competitive series during his heyday. Not enough room to post all of his accomplishments in racing.
DIDIT
Old School Fan
It is a subjective opinion of esteemed voters who know much more about racing than anyone on this board. Having a Hall of Fame recognizes extraordinary efforts and abilities and displays those recognized for others to see. You don't think we need that and I do. Ok, so be it.
Man there’s some solid drivers this year.
Revman
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Indeed.
Revman
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Arguable as hell BTW.