All Electric NASCAR Series on the Horizon

The existence of such a series will necessitate a breakthrough in battery tech. To have an EV racing series, you need to solve 3 problems:

1. A safer battery that is less prone to fires
2. A battery that can be charged relatively quickly
3. A battery that can run for extended periods of time at high rates of speed.

All of these breakthroughs would be game changers for consumer automobiles.
The series in your head would be entirely dependent on OEMs funneling hundreds of millions of dollars into it, which isn't going to happen. They don't need NASCAR to sanction events in order to continue the development of battery life and charging times. You act like it's mandatory that OEMs would have to participate in the series and be forced to improve, when in reality they would take their ball and go home as it wouldn't be economical.
 
Or retrain the miners to make solar panels, wind blades, etc.
I get it, with coal miners. It would be tough to make that adjustment, especially if you come from generations of coal miners.

Economic Populists have no clue how the global economy works. We can sell that coal to European nations, which would be another blow to Russia; and we could sell to Africa, undercut China, and help modernize the industrial world.
 
The series in your head would be entirely dependent on OEMs funneling hundreds of millions of dollars into it, which isn't going to happen.

You think NASCAR is R&Ding an EV series for no reason?

The OEMs have historically used racing to drive innovation, I am not sure why you’re so opposed to the idea that it could happen with EV technology.
 
You think NASCAR is R&Ding an EV series for no reason?

The OEMs have historically used racing to drive innovation, I am not sure why you’re so opposed to the idea that it could happen with EV technology.
They're putting together an EV series to keep OEMs baited into using NASCAR as a marketing platform. You don't seem to be able to separate the marketing and technical development side of racing and NASCAR.
 
They're putting together an EV series to keep OEMs baited into using NASCAR as a marketing platform. You don't seem to be able to separate the marketing and technical development side of racing and NASCAR.

And you seem to think that everything is tied solely to marketing, which is a cynical point of view that only makes sense if you ignore the history of auto racing.

If this series happens, it will require innovations in technology that will find their way to passenger cars. There’s literally no way around that.
 
Voters believe lying politicians who claim they can do something about, or that their opponents are responsible for, the price of a commodity sold on a global market. "Drill more!" -might- make sense if the output stayed in the US, but it goes on the market with every other country's production.
And IF it did work the way populists think, we would run out of oil pretty quickly.
 
These foos that have these ass-squat trucks are completely free to do what they want with their vehicles as long as it doesn’t create a safety hazard for the non-brain-dead public. You should be able to see the vehicle in front of you.
Those aren’t big badass pick up trucks.
International CXTs are big badass pick up trucks.
 
These foos that have these ass-squat trucks are completely free to do what they want with their vehicles as long as it doesn’t create a safety hazard for the non-brain-dead public. You should be able to see the vehicle in front of you.

They can’t see in front of them and they are a safety hazard. That’s why North Carolina banned the modifications.

These trucks are also so high off the ground that their lights blind people driving smaller vehicles - which causes another safety issue.

There’s been a surge of pedestrian deaths too over the past decade. Which the Institute for Highway Safety blames these big ass trucks for.

And too many kids want them so they can be macho manly men and “rule the road” and intimidate other drivers.
 
And you seem to think that everything is tied solely to marketing, which is a cynical point of view that only makes sense if you ignore the history of auto racing.

If this series happens, it will require innovations in technology that will find their way to passenger cars. There’s literally no way around that.
That isn't cynical, it's real. NASCAR is 100% a marketing powerhouse. Yes, Henry Ford won with Sweepstakes in 1901 or whatever and auto racing was considering a mark of how excellent the machine was at one time. Those days are long gone.
 
That isn't cynical, it's real. NASCAR is 100% a marketing powerhouse. Yes, Henry Ford won with Sweepstakes in 1901 or whatever and auto racing was considering a mark of how excellent the machine was at one time. Those days are long gone.

 

Name me one single innovation that road cars have taken from the gen 6 or NextGen.
 
That isn't cynical, it's real. NASCAR is 100% a marketing powerhouse. Yes, Henry Ford won with Sweepstakes in 1901 or whatever and auto racing was considering a mark of how excellent the machine was at one time. Those days are long gone.

But the series literally doesn’t exist without technological breakthroughs. The technology that will enable an EV series does not currently exist.

This series’s very existence will rely on technological breakthroughs that will make their way to passenger cars.
 
I don't think you guys understand how small the publicity of this would be for EVs compared to putting half that amount of money into targeted online advertising.
And yet manufacturers spend money publicizing vehicles with only the names in common with their consumer counterparts, including vehicles like the SS that were only available in limited numbers. By your logic, is that money that would be better spent in other ways?
 
But the series literally doesn’t exist without technological breakthroughs. The technology that will enable an EV series does not currently exist.

This series’s very existence will rely on technological breakthroughs that will make their way to passenger cars.
You are speaking factually about a series that does not even exist yet.

We have one photo of one prototype. What if this series is eight cars on track before the Cup races on Sunday for a ten lap demonstration?
 
And yet manufacturers spend money publicizing vehicles with only the names in common with their consumer counterparts, including vehicles like the SS that were only available in limited numbers. By your logic, is that money that would be better spent in other ways?
Yes, and I'll cite how we haven't had a new OEM join the sport for almost 20 years now, which funny enough coincides with the internet targeted marketing era.
 
What if this series is eight cars on track before the Cup races on Sunday for a ten lap demonstration?

Then NASCAR will have sunk a lot of money into something with minimal rate of return. I guess it's not impossible but it also seems like extremely poor marketing for EVs. Why would I buy an EV in that situation? I'm watching them do 10 laps and then watching the ICE do 500 miles. That's a poor statement on the performance of EVs and the OEMs would be foolish to go along with that marketing scheme.

Note - I expect the EV races to be shorter than a Cup race but 10 laps right before a 500 mile race just highlights the differences in performance.
 
At least my argument is based on the reality of what NASCAR is

Is it though? You seem to believe in a world where an EV racing series can exist without a single technology being developed that can improve the performance of EV passenger cars. That sounds like a fantasy world to me.

Your whole argument is based in an anti-NASCAR viewpoint that is endemic among the fanbase. A viewpoint that believes that NASCAR does nothing good. When it comes to pushing new technologies in automobiles, there has historically been no better venue than auto racing.
 
NASCAR is WWE 2.0 or the Masked Singer or the Bachelor or summing like that. It’s not about quality racing anymore. It’s about profit. Taylor Swift should replace Hailie Deegan; THAT is NASCAR.
The France family wishes Taylor took sweet to Josh Berry instead of Travis Kelce.
 
Is it though? You seem to believe in a world where an EV racing series can exist without a single technology being developed that can improve the performance of EV passenger cars. That sounds like a fantasy world to me.

Your whole argument is based in an anti-NASCAR viewpoint that is endemic among the fanbase. A viewpoint that believes that NASCAR does nothing good. When it comes to pushing new technologies in automobiles, there has historically been no better venue than auto racing.
What are you talking about? Are you not aware of Formula E or Extreme E? Electric racing has already existed for years. But NASCAR as a sanctioning body is not and never has been a hotbed of cutting edge engineering that contributes to the greater good of society. The France family has one objective and that is to sell tickets and sell advertising. You're barking up the wrong tree if you want NASCAR to provide a proving ground for road-relevant breakthrough tech. That has never been a remote priority or mission of the sanctioning body.
 
What are you talking about? Are you not aware of Formula E or Extreme E? Electric racing has already existed for years.

But Formula E shows the technological challenges associated with EV racing. Drivers have to conserve their battery life so they can't run all out. The races are also typically 30-35 laps (with a somewhat soft 45 minute limit). Formula E cars can only go for 70 miles or so and the drivers have to be super careful so they don't run out their battery life. Electric racing exists but it still has a long way to go and this is a good entry point for NASCAR and the American OEMs (and Toyota).

If NASCAR wants to convince American OEMs to hop on board, Formula E would be a good leverage point. The American OEMs (and Toyota) are going to want to be on the cutting edge of EV technology as well, especially as they grow in market share. Formula E is already a playground for the OEMs who are using it to develop EV technology.
 
More to the point though: Formula E shows the challenges of powering light, single seat, open wheel cars for 70 miles races. Stock cars are heavier and closer in weight to a passenger vehicle. It'll take more battery power to run them for a prolonged period of time and many of the same challenges that we see with charging and sustaining battery life in passenger cars will be magnified in a racing series that demands more battery life.
 
But Formula E shows the technological challenges associated with EV racing. Drivers have to conserve their battery life so they can't run all out. The races are also typically 30-35 laps (with a somewhat soft 45 minute limit). Formula E cars can only go for 70 miles or so and the drivers have to be super careful so they don't run out their battery life. Electric racing exists but it still has a long way to go and this is a good entry point for NASCAR and the American OEMs (and Toyota).

If NASCAR wants to convince American OEMs to hop on board, Formula E would be a good leverage point. The American OEMs (and Toyota) are going to want to be on the cutting edge of EV technology as well, especially as they grow in market share. Formula E is already a playground for the OEMs who are using it to develop EV technology.
Why on Earth do you think they need NASCAR to accomplish this and can't push EV tech without an on-track arms race? The arms race here would be in profit to be made from consumer sales, and they don't need NASCAR to advertise that they have the most range now, or the quickest charging.
 
NASCAR isn’t as big as most people think it is. Nobody at my work follows or attends.
Everyone at work follows football and baseball.
I’ve never been to a football game and I’ve never attended or made it through a televised baseball game; I lasted a couple innings.
 
But NASCAR as a sanctioning body is not and never has been a hotbed of cutting edge engineering that contributes to the greater good of society. The France family has one objective and that is to sell tickets and sell advertising. You're barking up the wrong tree if you want NASCAR to provide a proving ground for road-relevant breakthrough tech. That has never been a remote priority or mission of the sanctioning body.
Agreed, but selling tickets and advertising hasn't been the manufacturers' goal. Their goal has been to sell cars. The sponsors and TV partners' goal is to also to sell advertising. The teams are out to win races and hopefully turn a profit. Everyone involved in the process has different goals and ways to accomplish them.

There's nothing preventing NASCAR and the manufacturers from developing a framework that sells ticket while supporting development.
 
Why on Earth do you think they need NASCAR to accomplish this and can't push EV tech without an on-track arms race?

NASCAR seems to think they do, or else they wouldn't be investing in R&D to get the ball rolling. Sometimes you can pursue profit (in this case driven by having the best EV tech) while doing something that benefits society (improving EV tech).

The history of auto racing is filled with teams and OEMs developing new tech because it helps them win and then that tech making it to passenger cars. I don't know why you're being too obtuse to understand this. The teams and OEMs will drive the innovation and NASCAR is getting the ball rolling to entice them to do it. NASCAR will likely work with the OEMS to develop a base line and then the teams will do what they always do and figure out how to make the car go fast with maximum "fuel" efficiency.
 
NASCAR seems to think they do, or else they wouldn't be investing in R&D to get the ball rolling. Sometimes you can pursue profit (in this case driven by having the best EV tech) while doing something that benefits society (improving EV tech).

The history of auto racing is filled with teams and OEMs developing new tech because it helps them win and then that tech making it to passenger cars. I don't know why you're being too obtuse to understand this. The teams and OEMs will drive the innovation and NASCAR is getting the ball rolling to entice them to do it. NASCAR will likely work with the OEMS to develop a base line and then the teams will do what they always do and figure out how to make the car go fast with maximum "fuel" efficiency.
How do you know that NASCAR is even developing much of anything? They can contract out a spec battery and motor and be done with it.

Again, tech filtering from the racing world down to street cars is ancient history. This isn't 1912 anymore.
 
Why on Earth do you think they need NASCAR to accomplish this and can't push EV tech without an on-track arms race? The arms race here would be in profit to be made from consumer sales, and they don't need NASCAR to advertise that they have the most range now, or the quickest charging.
Same reasons manufacturers around the world participate in all forms of racing. Publicity. A showcase to demonstrate superiority over competitors. As you noted earlier, racing may not be the best way to spend an advertising dollar, but marketing campaigns are built around multiple interfaces. If you can combine R&D and publicity, why not?
 
Same reasons manufacturers around the world participate in all forms of racing. Publicity. A showcase to demonstrate superiority over competitors. As you noted earlier, racing may not be the best way to spend an advertising dollar, but marketing campaigns are built around multiple interfaces. If you can combine R&D and publicity, why not?
I agree with you. Publicity. The NASCAR vision and objective has never been about R&D for the OEMs though and that doesn't serve their product. They put rolling billboards out there in a way that keeps them appealing to their current OEM partners and they make sure that no one billboard gets too far out ahead of another one. That's their product.
 
Agreed, but selling tickets and advertising hasn't been the manufacturers' goal. Their goal has been to sell cars. The sponsors and TV partners' goal is to also to sell advertising. The teams are out to win races and hopefully turn a profit. Everyone involved in the process has different goals and ways to accomplish them.

There's nothing preventing NASCAR and the manufacturers from developing a framework that sells ticket while supporting development.
The teams and owners continue to make less and less money while NASCAR continues to make more.
NASCAR isn’t getting more popular from a fan standpoint. They’ve been cutting seats and real estate. They just sold ACS, one of the most popular tracks in the lineup. I look forward to the EV Series, I expect it will attract a different audience. I won’t be there. I’m barely there now.
Maybe dirt and short tracks across the nation will be more welcoming of electric cars.
Time will tell.
I’ll be kicking rocks.
 
How do you know that NASCAR is even developing much of anything? They can contract out a spec battery and motor and be done with it.

They could - whether they're developing it or paying someone to develop it, the outcome is the same. But there's also no chance the OEMs go for a spec battery or motor. Ford would want to show why a Ford EV is superior to a Chevy EV and a spec series would go against that motive. EVs are still an emerging sector and OEMs want maximum publicity for the performance of "their" product.
 
They could - whether they're developing it or paying someone to develop it, the outcome is the same. But there's also no chance the OEMs go for a spec battery or motor. Ford would want to show why a Ford EV is superior to a Chevy EV and a spec series would go against that motive. EVs are still an emerging sector and OEMs want maximum publicity for the performance of "their" product.
The OEMs went for spec everything else and even had a common body template once upon a time... It is about having your name on those billboards on track, and having a chance that on some weeks your billboard will finish ahead of the others.
 
The OEMs went for spec everything else and even had a common body template once upon a time... It is about having your name on those billboards on track, and having a chance that on some weeks your billboard will finish ahead of the others.

I disagree here. EVs are an emerging market and the OEMs are going to want to secure marketshare before people's preferences harden. The performance of that billboard is part of the package when you're trying to convince skeptical consumers that your product can perform, especially given the anxiety around EV performance that was expressed earlier in the thread.

Maximizing performance is where innovation will happen.
 
Regardless, if NASCAR rolls out an EV series, I'll at least give it a look on the telly. If there's a race at Darlington or Charlotte, I may attend; it depends on the length of the race. I strongly doubt it will replace Trucks or X, at least not initially, but NASCAR has dropped series before (Goody's Dash, convertibles). I could see the Trucks being converted to an EV series if enough manufacturers want to participate.
 
Nobody is buying a new car on Monday anymore, based on what happens during a NASCAR event the previous weekend.
These aren’t stock cars.
That ship sailed long ago.
I can't believe some people still act like it's the 1960s here, like sales and advertising haven't evolved.
 
Regardless, if NASCAR rolls out an EV series, I'll at least give it a look on the telly. If there's a race at Darlington or Charlotte, I may attend; it depends on the length of the race. I strongly doubt it will replace Trucks or X, at least not initially, but NASCAR has dropped series before (Goody's Dash, convertibles). I could see the Trucks being converted to an EV series if enough manufacturers want to participate.

The EV series would probably fill the void left by the Goody's Dash Series. I'd be worried about the level of talent that it would attract though. I wouldn't mind seeing it just run short tracks, which should help boost ticket sales at some local tracks and give them an infusion of revenue.
 
I live in LA. I’m not even remotely interested in seeing more electric cars.
I will never attend an electric car race. I see them everyday. Boring AF.
 
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