Column: Brian France was right to bring playoffs to NASCAR

Blaze said:
Well fair play to you. I think it was the best chase year we had yet. Feel free to have your opinion tho dude.
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no argument there about the battle if you read it wrong. The statement that Stewart didn't perform over the rest of the year to get into the chase in the first place was what I didn't agree with. Just because a driver isn't number one when the playoff's begin and wins the overall championship gets some peoples goat. The facts are, there is a lot of the season left when the playoffs begin and Stewart's team outperformed in that time frame.
 
StandOnIt said:
no argument there about the battle if you read it wrong. The statement that Stewart didn't perform over the rest of the year to get into the chase in the first place was what I didn't agree with. Just because a driver isn't number one when the playoff's begin and wins the overall championship gets some peoples goat. The facts are, there is a lot of the season left when the playoffs begin and Stewart's team outperformed in that time frame.
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Ahh okay. I mean with the rules, sure he earned it. But for us who don’t like the playoffs or the chase or whatever, we really can see it as him getting lucky with the rules in place. But hey if you enjoy it cool bro. I just love the racing no matter what tho.
 
10-4 said:
Racing is supposed to be entertaining. Nobody would watch it if it wasn't. All those empty seats are starting to sell again and ratings showing a little improvement at some races too is proof to me the sport is headed in the right direction. It makes me laugh when someone calls the playoff format generated drama. The same could be said about Nascar from it's very inception. I like the current format way better than anything in the past.
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Hate to say, but that increase is caused mainly by the new package. I still think "the package" is not the way to make NASCAR more popular long-term but it appears to be what the TV viewers want at the moment.
And that increase is still nothing against the number of fans NASCAR has lost since 2004.

Racing is entertaining when there is a level playing field and not one or two teams that outspend every other team. We don't need any fake drama to have some entertaining racing.
 
Well I know emotion out rules common sense with a lot of fans, but if a person looks at a winner being crowned with 6 or more races to go compared to a culmination of the season ending at the last race, like it or not it makes a hell of a lot more sense from many sides, most of them have to do with money and the health of the sport.
 
Yeah the package while not perfect has overall made improvements for closer racing, more passing, more side by side racing and in turn more exciting racing. Some will never admit that and that is fine. BTW nobody has concrete proof what specifically the decline in fans was from, and that wasn't the first time Nascar has had down times. In the past, they have shortened the season, shortened races and had a lack of attendance at races that was much more critical than it is now and the series survived. A new car is coming soon and there will be plenty to criticize for the skeptical, it won't be perfect, probably the first design will have it's flaws, but it will get better as the revisions are made. It's the design process. The years of the playoffs has gone thru the same process.
 
Zerkfitting said:
In my opinion when a driver falls out of the playoffs, they should re-enter the yearlong points pool. Afterall, the playoffs are for the Cup and everyone else should be racing for their ranking (which would represent the full season effort a purist can appreciate).
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donthaveanickname said:
Hate to say, but that increase is caused mainly by the new package. I still think "the package" is not the way to make NASCAR more popular long-term but it appears to be what the TV viewers want at the moment.
And that increase is still nothing against the number of fans NASCAR has lost since 2004.

Racing is entertaining when there is a level playing field and not one or two teams that outspend every other team. We don't need any fake drama to have some entertaining racing.
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There have always been rich teams willing to spend whatever it takes. What is your problem with that? Racing is a rich man's sport that takes deep pockets. Even the "poor" teams in this sport are far better off than most of us fans of the sport are. Racing is fake drama no matter what format we have. A couple of street racers trying to see who can be the fastest are creating fake drama where there was no drama at all. It's sport. Entertainment at it's very core is all fake drama. The stages add intensity to the sport. They make guys race hard every single lap and fight for every position.
 
Most playoffs, across many sports, make the regular season dreadfully meaningless and dreary. NASCAR was unique in that the entire season mattered equally and was worth following wire-to-wire. They are also unique in that their playoff is not in addition to but rather in place of what was the regular season, and in that sense I am not sure how it can be considered a commercial success. For other sports it's an extension of what are already long seasons to follow, when attendance and television audiences are at their highest by a wide margin...not the case here.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
My understanding is that many people have the same question regarding the NBA's regular season.
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Same can be said for the NHL, as they have a similar season length and take as many playoff teams as the NBA.

As for NASCAR, I don’t have nearly as big a problem with the playoffs as I did prior to 2017. The regular season was virtually meaningless the first three years of the elimination-style chase. The stage/playoff points have gone a long way toward fixing that IMO.
 
jaqua19 said:
I still prefer the original chase system. That, with stage points, and we are golden

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I think that would be a great compromise for fans wanting the old system (like myself) and new fans that like this system. I’d be okay with Win and You’re in....the catch is only Top 10 drivers in points make it in. I think we still do the points reset with 10 to go but we shelve the playoff bracket. No eliminations...eliminations happened anyway in the original Chase formats. Now we add in stage points to add some reward for the regular season and keep stage points through playoff races like now. I’d also add points for pole position, lap led, most laps led and fastest lap of the race.
 
Snappy D said:
I think that would be a great compromise for fans wanting the old system (like myself) and new fans that like this system. I’d be okay with Win and You’re in....the catch is only Top 10 drivers in points make it in. I think we still do the points reset with 10 to go but we shelve the playoff bracket. No eliminations...eliminations happened anyway in the original Chase formats. Now we add in stage points to add some reward for the regular season and keep stage points through playoff races like now. I’d also add points for pole position, lap led, most laps led and fastest lap of the race.
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This would be a huge step in the right direction.
 
10-4 said:
There have always been rich teams willing to spend whatever it takes. What is your problem with that? Racing is a rich man's sport that takes deep pockets. Even the "poor" teams in this sport are far better off than most of us fans of the sport are. Racing is fake drama no matter what format we have. A couple of street racers trying to see who can be the fastest are creating fake drama where there was no drama at all. It's sport. Entertainment at it's very core is all fake drama. The stages add intensity to the sport. They make guys race hard every single lap and fight for every position.
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Agree with you about the stages. I have said several times that the stages are a good addition to the races.

What I am saying is that there should be some sort of budget cap so that teams like JGR and Penske can't outspend smaller teams.
The champion should be whoever scores the most points throughout the season. And with a level playing field, it will not happen that someone wins the championship with 3 races to go.
And even when that happened in the past: Where was the problem?
 
donthaveanickname said:
Agree with you about the stages. I have said several times that the stages are a good addition to the races.

What I am saying is that there should be some sort of budget cap so that teams like JGR and Penske can't outspend smaller teams.
The champion should be whoever scores the most points throughout the season. And with a level playing field, it will not happen that someone wins the championship with 3 races to go.
And even when that happened in the past: Where was the problem?
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Trying to socialize a group of independent businessmen who's business isn't controlled is almost impossible. Throw in the OEM's and it would be worse than impossible. A person should take a look at all of the types of racing, in every category of racing there is because it isn't socialized there are a small handful at the top of the standings. Without exception they are all well funded teams. The most effective way to reduce the costs is for the sanctioning body to make rules or equipment that reduce the cost to participate. That being said the top teams will always find a way to spend more money and be faster than the teams that don't have the resources. This has been a racing law since the first race was held. Money = speed
 
StandOnIt said:
Trying to socialize a group of independent businessmen who's business isn't controlled is almost impossible. Throw in the OEM's and it would be worse than impossible. A person should take a look at all of the types of racing, in every category of racing there is because it isn't socialized there are a small handful at the top of the standings. Without exception they are all well funded teams. The most effective way to reduce the costs is for the sanctioning body to make rules or equipment that reduce the cost to participate. That being said the top teams will always find a way to spend more money and be faster than the teams that don't have the resources. This has been a racing law since the first race was held. Money = speed
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I agree. I dont want a salary cap for the sport because I feel it would be so ungoldy hard to police.
 
StandOnIt said:
Trying to socialize a group of independent businessmen who's business isn't controlled is almost impossible. Throw in the OEM's and it would be worse than impossible. A person should take a look at all of the types of racing, in every category of racing there is because it isn't socialized there are a small handful at the top of the standings. Without exception they are all well funded teams. The most effective way to reduce the costs is for the sanctioning body to make rules or equipment that reduce the cost to participate. That being said the top teams will always find a way to spend more money and be faster than the teams that don't have the resources. This has been a racing law since the first race was held. Money = speed
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Exactly. That's why NASCAR could throw in a budget cap of say 20-25 million $$$ per car and year and avoid having to mandate spec parts.

And the OEMs (except for TRD) are nothing but sponsors. Only thing they provide is the badge at the front and the back of the car.
 
donthaveanickname said:
Exactly. That's why NASCAR could throw in a budget cap of say 20-25 million $$$ per car and year and avoid having to mandate spec parts.

And the OEMs (except for TRD) are nothing but sponsors. Only thing they provide is the badge at the front and the back of the car.
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No OEM engineers working on NASCAR projects? No OEM wind tunnels operating? No OEM CFD hardware and software being used to assist teams? The Ford and GM race simulators have been returned to their suppliers for credit?

I wasn't aware of any of that. I wonder if the manufacturers still write the occasional check?
 
donthaveanickname said:
Exactly. That's why NASCAR could throw in a budget cap of say 20-25 million $$$ per car and year and avoid having to mandate spec parts.

And the OEMs (except for TRD) are nothing but sponsors. Only thing they provide is the badge at the front and the back of the car.
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but Chevy has a simulator that Jimmie Johnson just tweeted out a few weeks ago he was using....... Jeff Gordon used it in his brief comeback in 16. OEM's are still a huge part of this sport in my estimation.... hell Chevy had a emergency meeting at Talladega!
 
aunty dive said:
No OEM engineers working on NASCAR projects? No OEM wind tunnels operating? No OEM CFD hardware and software being used to assist teams? The Ford and GM race simulators have been returned to their suppliers for credit?
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A lot of stuff where lots of money can be saved:D

Snappy D said:
but Chevy has a simulator that Jimmie Johnson just tweeted out a few weeks ago he was using....... Jeff Gordon used it in his brief comeback in 16. OEM's are still a huge part of this sport in my estimation.... hell Chevy had a emergency meeting at Talladega!
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HMS don't have their own simulator??:eek:
 
I've never really bought into the belief that the decline in tv viewers and attendace is a result of the sport moving to the "playoff" style point system over the previous system.

To me its always been due to the fact Dale Earnhardt died. Jeff Gordon, Tony Stewart, Dale Earnhardt Jr. Retired. Mark Martin and Rusty Wallace retired. The most popular drivers in the sport when it was at its biggest popularity wise left and were replaced by drivers that people didnt have the same attachment to.

Ive hardly watched a full race since JR retired. Maybe 1 or 2 a year. I use to not miss a lap for 20 years. I know 2 others guys through work who were die hards as well. Theyre in the same boat as me know. Hardly any interest. One was a jeff gordon fan. The other tony stewart.
 
donthaveanickname said:
. And with a level playing field, it will not happen that someone wins the championship with 3 races to go.
And even when that happened in the past: Where was the problem?
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Back in the day when that happened, a lot of fans just checked out.
Not many people stuck around thinking "I hope my guy can get 2nd or 3rd place in the final standings."
The story was over.
 
Snappy D said:
I think that would be a great compromise for fans wanting the old system (like myself) and new fans that like this system. I’d be okay with Win and You’re in....the catch is only Top 10 drivers in points make it in. I think we still do the points reset with 10 to go but we shelve the playoff bracket. No eliminations...eliminations happened anyway in the original Chase formats. Now we add in stage points to add some reward for the regular season and keep stage points through playoff races like now. I’d also add points for pole position, lap led, most laps led and fastest lap of the race.
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NO for lap led as many of these cars stayed out for that point and were never a factor in the race. NO for fastest lap.
Most laps led, YES 3 points
Pole, Yes 3 points
 
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