Humor me: Can You Make A Modern Late Model Passenger Sedan Into a Race Car?

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virtualbalboa

driver of corey day bandwagon since 2022
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I'm not talking about going TCR racing with it, obviously, since I'm in the NASCAR forum. Imagine NASCAR announced tomorrow that there will be a new class - not even a national one, just one they'll sanction for weekly series or whatever - based on modern V8 platform cars like Dodge Chargers and Ford Mustangs and Chevy Camaros. Ignoring those places where this is actively a class already, what are the real obstacles to this? The NHRA for example has the Factory Stock Showdown, and those cars are 7 second quarter mile cars doing 180. What do you actually need to do to those cars to set them loose on a half mile pavement track or even, dare I ask, a 1 mile plus oval? They already exist in the context of road racing, rallycross, drag racing, and drifting, so clearly this can be done to someone's safety satisfaction. Would that actually more expensive than buying a template late model or is the bigger issue that it might eliminate the need for those suppliers if you're buying a car from a dealership?
 
A modern car? Not really. Too much tech, too much plastic. But 30 years ago? Sure. Strip the accessories and interior. Put in a roll cage. Boom, you can go enduro racing. Last time you could strip a car down, weld in a cage, and have a late model- 1980ish.
 
Not a current car, people are racing Crown Vics on asphalt and dirt. They strip it down and put a roll cage in it. I don't know if I'd want to drive one going 180.
 
Are we talking about work beyond what is being done to convert factory Miatas, Mustangs, and Porsches to run in their respective IMSA series? The Miatas ran on Martinsville's oval last year.
 
A little over 100 grand and it's ready to go...needs a roll bar.
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I Googled 'TCR Racing'. Apparently I misunderstood what I read. I thought that was straight-from-the-factory, no modifications.
virtualbalboa said:
What do you actually need to do to those cars to set them loose on a half mile pavement track or even, dare I ask, a 1 mile plus oval?
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Technically, you don't 'need' to do anything. Put them out there and wave the flag. Anything beyond that is just how much one is willing to spend.
 
The Fundamentals of Chassis Twist in motorsport: When a racecar encounters uneven surfaces or lateral forces while cornering, diagonal corners of the vehicle experience different vertical loads. If the chassis lacks torsional stiffness, it bends and twists. The "Unintended Spring": A flexible chassis acts as an extra, unpredictable suspension spring. This alters the intended load transfer at the tires, making the car's balance inconsistent.

Suspension Efficiency: A highly rigid chassis allows the springs and dampers to do 100% of the work. Because the chassis remains static, it translates driver inputs and suspension setup changes directly to the contact patch of the tires with maximum fidelity. If a chassis is too soft, adjustments to front or rear roll stiffness—such as changing anti-roll bars—will simply twist the frame instead of altering the vehicle's handling balance.

Aerodynamic Consistency: Modern racecars are highly sensitive to ride height and pitch. Chassis flex can change aerodynamic platforms mid-corner, leading to unpredictable downforce losses. While racecars require immense stiffness, adding excess material to achieve it can add unnecessary weight. Engineers must balance rigidity with weight by utilizing stiff, lightweight materials like carbon fiber monocoques or tubular spaceframes.

How Engineers Measure and Improve Rigidity; Engineers evaluate stiffness by comparing the total torsional rigidity of the frame directly to the roll stiffness of the suspension. Torsional stiffness is measured by fixing one end of the chassis and applying a torque to the other, plotting the torque (in \(\text{Nm}\)) against the resulting twist angle (in degrees).

Modifications: In production-based racecars, engineers increase rigidity by installing weld-in FIA-spec roll cages, utilizing advanced composites, stitch-welding seams, and adding strategic triangulation or strut tower braces.

From: Racecar Engineering Magazine
 
Charlie Spencer said:
I Googled 'TCR Racing'. Apparently I misunderstood what I read. I thought that was straight-from-the-factory, no modifications.

Technically, you don't 'need' to do anything. Put them out there and wave the flag. Anything beyond that is just how much one is willing to spend.
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Pretty much ready to go. The Caddy I posted has almost 700 HP. can easily make 900 with a larger supercharger and comes with a factory warranty. The blackwing CT5 needs little. Certain Corvettes and Mustang models are in the same boat and all come with factory warranties also.
 
So, a lot of tracks have Bomber/Any Car/Pure Stock classes which is what the OP is looking for, I think.

Coastal Plains Raceway in Jacksonville just took their class and split it to where there's a four-cylinder class and a separate class for V6/V8 engines. Which the latter is what Street Stock kind of used to be a long time ago.

It costs so much to go late model racing and so many people have quit racing because of it. It's causing a lot of tracks to really readjust their programs and how they approach things. There are more and more of these pure stock type of races popping up all over because of it.

Langley Speedway in Hampton, Virginia, also does something called Wacky Wednesday, which basically takes a drag racing program and puts it on an oval. For instance, you have one car start on the backstretch and another on the frontstretch. I'm sure other tracks do something simililar.

The OP could also check out his regional SCCA chapter/division.
 
It's ironic given that I've run a racetrack before, that I can't give much more insight. I've never had any desire to race. I've had guys offer me a car or kart to race in to make car count and still have no desire.
 
HoneyBadger said:
It's ironic given that I've run a racetrack before, that I can't give much more insight. I've never had any desire to race. I've had guys offer me a car or kart to race in to make car count and still have no desire.
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How much insight do you need?

Insufficient torsional rigidity enables chassis twist, resulting in inconsistent wheel loading which produces undriveable cars at race speeds.
 
HoneyBadger said:
So, a lot of tracks have Bomber/Any Car/Pure Stock classes which is what the OP is looking for, I think.

Coastal Plains Raceway in Jacksonville just took their class and split it to where there's a four-cylinder class and a separate class for V6/V8 engines. Which the latter is what Street Stock kind of used to be a long time ago.

It costs so much to go late model racing and so many people have quit racing because of it. It's causing a lot of tracks to really readjust their programs and how they approach things. There are more and more of these pure stock type of races popping up all over because of it.

Langley Speedway in Hampton, Virginia, also does something called Wacky Wednesday, which basically takes a drag racing program and puts it on an oval. For instance, you have one car start on the backstretch and another on the frontstretch. I'm sure other tracks do something simililar.

The OP could also check out his regional SCCA chapter/division.
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I'm not necessarily looking to race myself. I'm just mostly wondering how it is that most tracks running street stocks are still seeing people with 84 Monte Carlos being a huge chunk of the field when we have decades of V8 cars to use now.
 
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