Mark Martin was robbed.

DUN24 said:
This is the hardcore old school type NASCAR grudge that I look for. :beerbang:
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This is going to be the default response to races ending under caution for the rest of my life. And I will not "let it go" either, my name ain't Elsa. People want to see someone "let it go", turn on Frozen.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Seems like just about every restrictor plate race finishes under caution. But the whole entire field wrecks on the last lap in 2007 and they stay green.

Mark Martin was robbed. Just like he was robbed in 1990.
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Been saving it for you.....

Andy_Dead_Horse_Pic.jpg
 
Honestly, I think G-W-C is bull**** in of itself. It does not improve the racing product. Races are going to finish under caution, fans just need to deal with that.
 
Personally I find it very different. 2007 and 2014 the wreck happened off turn 4 right before the trioval. Only a few hundred yards before the line and an entire lap to get slowed down before driving through the wreck. 2015 the wreck happened in the middle of the back stretch with an entire mile and a half before the line & the entire field would have driven into a wreck coming off turn 2. Not worth risking another potential wreck after the finish and/or the cars driving passed where the wreck was at speed & hitting debris into the stands. I can see why they threw the yellow this time compared to 2007 and 2014. But this doesnt mean NASCAR is inconsistant with their calls.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Personally I find it very different. 2007 and 2014 the wreck happened off turn 4 right before the trioval. Only a few hundred yards before the line and an entire lap to get slowed down before driving through the wreck. 2015 the wreck happened in the middle of the back stretch with an entire mile and a half before the line & the entire field would have driven into a wreck coming off turn 2. Not worth risking another potential wreck after the finish and/or the cars driving passed where the wreck was at speed & hitting debris into the stands. I can see why they threw the yellow this time compared to 2007 and 2014. But this doesnt mean NASCAR is inconsistant with their calls.
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Yep, completely two different scenarios.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Personally I find it very different. 2007 and 2014 the wreck happened off turn 4 right before the trioval. Only a few hundred yards before the line and an entire lap to get slowed down before driving through the wreck. 2015 the wreck happened in the middle of the back stretch with an entire mile and a half before the line & the entire field would have driven into a wreck coming off turn 2. Not worth risking another potential wreck after the finish and/or the cars driving passed where the wreck was at speed & hitting debris into the stands. I can see why they threw the yellow this time compared to 2007 and 2014. But this doesnt mean NASCAR is inconsistant with their calls.
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Yup. It was the right call that day. But Andy's a bitter young man that can't accept things that happened 7 years ago. He's gonna end up in a rocking chair on his porch as an old man, kids making fun of him and leaving burning bags of poop at his doorstep.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Personally I find it very different. 2007 and 2014 the wreck happened off turn 4 right before the trioval. Only a few hundred yards before the line and an entire lap to get slowed down before driving through the wreck. 2015 the wreck happened in the middle of the back stretch with an entire mile and a half before the line & the entire field would have driven into a wreck coming off turn 2. Not worth risking another potential wreck after the finish and/or the cars driving passed where the wreck was at speed & hitting debris into the stands. I can see why they threw the yellow this time compared to 2007 and 2014. But this doesnt mean NASCAR is inconsistant with their calls.
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I can understand them throwing the caution yesterday, but they should have re-set the field and attempted another G-W-C. Even if it meant another red flag while they got the mess cleaned up.
 
SpeedPagan said:
I can understand them throwing the caution yesterday, but they should have re-set the field and attempted another G-W-C. Even if it meant another red flag while they got the mess cleaned up.
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Agreed
 
We can't just change the rules when we don't like the outcome. My guy finished third. Heck, he may have been able to take the lead had the rules been different. The GWC rule is pretty simple and straight forward. I like it. I'm glad that they at least get in that one attempt at a green flag finish. Sometimes it doesn't work out but thanks to this rule we've got more of a chance of it happening.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
We can't just change the rules when we don't like the outcome. My guy finished third. Heck, he may have been able to take the lead had the rules been different. The GWC rule is pretty simple and straight forward. I like it. I'm glad that they at least get in that one attempt at a green flag finish. Sometimes it doesn't work out but thanks to this rule we've got more of a chance of it happening.
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The problem here is when they threw the caution, it was obvious that everyone was backing down, they weren't racing to the finish. My guy finished 5th. Do I think he would've won had they attempted another G-W-C? Probably not, but I'd like to think myself as a racing fan first, and a Johnson fan second. The fact that they started backing down when the caution came out, thus giving Joey the win, is troubling for me.
 
SpeedPagan said:
The problem here is when they threw the caution, it was obvious that everyone was backing down, they weren't racing to the finish. My guy finished 5th. Do I think he would've won had they attempted another G-W-C? Probably not, but I'd like to think myself as a racing fan first, and a Johnson fan second. The fact that they started backing down when the caution came out, thus giving Joey the win, is troubling for me.
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Not so sure they began backing down that much. Joey's spotter told him to stay in the gas all the way to the line and Harv/Jr were still right behind him. But I get your point.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Personally I find it very different. 2007 and 2014 the wreck happened off turn 4 right before the trioval. Only a few hundred yards before the line and an entire lap to get slowed down before driving through the wreck. 2015 the wreck happened in the middle of the back stretch with an entire mile and a half before the line & the entire field would have driven into a wreck coming off turn 2. Not worth risking another potential wreck after the finish and/or the cars driving passed where the wreck was at speed & hitting debris into the stands. I can see why they threw the yellow this time compared to 2007 and 2014. But this doesnt mean NASCAR is inconsistant with their calls.
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2015 was different from 2007 and 2014, but 2007 and 2014 was not different. Same wreck, same place, different call by NASCAR.
 
SpeedPagan said:
Honestly, I think G-W-C is bull**** in of itself. It does not improve the racing product. Races are going to finish under caution, fans just need to deal with that.
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SpeedPagan said:
I can understand them throwing the caution yesterday, but they should have re-set the field and attempted another G-W-C. Even if it meant another red flag while they got the mess cleaned up.
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SpeedPagan said:
The problem here is when they threw the caution, it was obvious that everyone was backing down, they weren't racing to the finish. My guy finished 5th. Do I think he would've won had they attempted another G-W-C? Probably not, but I'd like to think myself as a racing fan first, and a Johnson fan second. The fact that they started backing down when the caution came out, thus giving Joey the win, is troubling for me.
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Speed , I'm old and sometimes I have to read these posts three or four times . I think I agree with one of these posts , but I'm not sure which one .
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Not so sure they began backing down that much. Joey's spotter told him to stay in the gas all the way to the line and Harv/Jr were still right behind him. But I get your point.
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They showed the race again on FOX Sports 1 this morning. Harvick and Jr (and the rest of the field) visibly slowed down when the caution came out.

I don't know if racing back would have changed the outcome. NASCAR made the right call with throwing the caution. It's their precedent. A precedent they didn't adhere to in 2007.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Seems like just about every restrictor plate race finishes under caution. But the whole entire field wrecks on the last lap in 2007 and they stay green.

Mark Martin was robbed. Just like he was robbed in 1990.
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I just can't stand it a minute longer. I swore I wasn't going to post in response to your post. Being a longtime Mark Martin fan, when I read what you said...... I just knew there there was someone out there that remembered and felt the same. I saw beating a dead horse and knew that was right...... what's over is over, we can never go back. But....... that doesn't mean we don't remember.......... and still believe Mark was screwed over 2 times........ What really burns my butt about '90......... and the carb spacer....... all the crew chiefs in the garage were questioned and not a one of them except Kirk Shelmerdine said it would make a difference. Karma to Kirk because he hasn't done a thing as far as his 'driving' career.............. That's about all I have to say....... I could say a whole more but I've already said more than I intended. Just couldn't resist.........
 
As a fan, I hate to finish under caution like that because it would have been a very exciting finish. Would have liked to have seen Jr. join that two consecutive 500 wins list.

But from a safety standpoint I understand why it happened.
 
kymartin6 said:
I just can't stand it a minute longer. I swore I wasn't going to post in response to your post. Being a longtime Mark Martin fan, when I read what you said...... I just knew there there was someone out there that remembered and felt the same. I saw beating a dead horse and knew that was right...... what's over is over, we can never go back. But....... that doesn't mean we don't remember.......... and still believe Mark was screwed over 2 times........ What really burns my butt about '90......... and the carb spacer....... all the crew chiefs in the garage were questioned and not a one of them except Kirk Shelmerdine said it would make a difference. Karma to Kirk because he hasn't done a thing as far as his 'driving' career.............. That's about all I have to say....... I could say a whole more but I've already said more than I intended. Just couldn't resist.........
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what was the cause of marks bad karma, driving for the devil?
 
BOWTIE GUY said:
what was the cause of marks bad karma, driving for the devil?
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LOL............ I figured I would piss off a Bowtie fanatic.......... ;) It's all good....... Mark didn't have bad Karma...... in fact his luck couldn't have been better....... He and Jack needed each other at the time. Mark made a really good living driving for Jack........ and ........ Jack had a good driver that was so loyal he knew Mark wouldn't leave. It was an accomodation that worked for both. Mark might have done better had he established a reputation and moved on to different team ........ but....... Jack gave him his second lease on life and he didn't forget it. Jack...... he might have the reputation of being a tight ass..... but...... you know........ he must have a fairly good relationship with his drivers and crew because it seems like most of 'em stay for years........ past when others are gone.
 
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