Terry Blount nails it!

HoneyBadger

HoneyBadger

I love short track racing (Taylor's Version)
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For years, I've heard the flawed logic that Cup drivers sell tickets to the Nationwide races. It's a theory I've never embraced (look in the stands), and even if it's true, it's still shortsighted gain.

If the Nationwide regulars were winning races, they would become stars. People would know them, follow them and become bigger fans of those drivers. It would help them gain sponsorship and add more cash in the pockets of guys who really need it.

This is the only sport -- heck, it's really the only major racing series -- in which the biggest stars at the top level compete regularly at the lower level, win races and act as if they accomplished some great thing.

And this isn't an indictment of Busch. I'd feel the same way about any Cup title contender who raced most of the Nationwide events and dominated the races with cars better than almost anyone else had on the track.

But Busch is the biggest offender, using his enormous talent to win race after race in far and away the best equipment in the series.

It's taking away from what could be a fun year in Nationwide, with more quality drivers competing for the title than ever before. But few people really see it.

What they see is the Cup star winning over and over, racing too many events in a league in which he doesn't belong.

http://espn.go.com/rpm/nascar/noteb...down/nascar-monday-rundown-auto-club-speedway
 
Man, I really thought we were beyond all of this crap. Guess not. :(

Blount needed to save this for a slow week. I think his story is going to get lost in real topics of discussion this week.

Other than this subject being good board fodder it doesn't play anymore in the NASCAR news as a hot topic.
 
PeopleAreStrange said:
It drives me crazy when a full-time Cup driver wins a NW race.
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get used to it, you are going to be crazy a long time.:) I think it is great to see how the regulars fare against the cup boys. If the regulars could find a racing job that paid as well as driving a Nationwide car, they wouldn't be in the series.
This week only one cup driver in the top 18 places.. Bush. Kinda blows away that media goofs article..but oh well some people are put on this earth to be a negative force.
 
They just did a segment on racehub on this.. Elliot Sadler was saying how the NW driver love racing against the Cup guys because in order to make it to the cup level you have to beat those guys. Its a good way to measure their talent or something like that.. I see everyone`s points really. In my opinion the cu guys should be only able to run a very limited NW schedule and not 2 races in a row or something like that.
 
StandOnIt said:
get used to it, you are going to be crazy a long time.:) I think it is great to see how the regulars fare against the cup boys. If the regulars could find a racing job that paid as well as driving a Nationwide car, they wouldn't be in the series.
This week only one cup driver in the top 18 places.. Bush. Kinda blows away that media goofs article..but oh well some people are put on this earth to be a negative force.
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And that one cup driver that finished in the top 18 took a win away from someone who belongs in the series. Top level drivers do not belong in the lower level series.
 
SlicedBread22 said:
They just did a segment on racehub on this.. Elliot Sadler was saying how the NW driver love racing against the Cup guys because in order to make it to the cup level you have to beat those guys. Its a good way to measure their talent or something like that.. I see everyone`s points really. In my opinion the cu guys should be only able to run a very limited NW schedule and not 2 races in a row or something like that.
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If he says anything different he would be fined.So do you really expect him to say anything different? I don't.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
Man, I really thought we were beyond all of this crap. Guess not. :(

Blount needed to save this crap for a slow week. I think his story is going to get lost in real topics of discussion this week.
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I thought the era of Cup drivers running Nationwide was coming to an end. Guess not. :(

Blount is correct though. Kyle Busch wins a minor league race and the performances of guys like Larson and Hornish is ignored. Instead of talking about how well Larson ran at Bristol, the media talks about how Kyle Busch is the greatest driver ever because he made a move at the end of the race to hold off a rookie in a minor league race - ironically, he made the same "dirty" move that he whined and sniveled about after Homestead. Instead of talking about how strong Hornish has been in Nationwide, they're talking about how Kyle is so great and Hornish is a terrible driver because he let a Cup driver with superior equipment beat him in a minor league race.

The minor league drivers are there for a reason. Most are there to learn. They make mistakes. Kyle Busch is there to win races and boost his ego. And every time he wins a Nationwide race, the media acts like it's some great accomplishment that a Cup driver beat a rookie in a minor league race. It'd be like the San Francisco 49ers celebrating in the locker room and being hailed as the greatest football team of all time after beating the Virginia Tech college football team.

Larson should've been the story at Bristol. A rookie who almost won a Nationwide race and lost only to a Cup Series superstar (who's been held up to us by the media as the greatest thing to ever step inside the ****pit of a racecar) who was in superior equipment. Instead the story was, the rookie was stupid because he let that Cup driver in superior equipment shove him in to the wall.
 
Kyle Bush built his own cars to run last year, remember..KBM? hell of a lot of work to boost one's ego. Gibbs wants his cars to finish first..they wouldn't sell Kyle any of their chassis, he had to build his own. They weren't fast. Kyle and Gibbs racing are doing the nationwide this year. how come you aren't dishing Kesolowski? he is running the nationwide? Hornish is leading the Nationwide..has won over 300,00 bucks so far this year. If his cut is 40% of the winnings, he has made over 120 thou in 5 starts. You think that dude behind the word processor knows anything? What does Hornish need to learn...guess he shouldn't be there either..ol pro and all..has been driver.

Sam Hornish Jr. - #12
1st in Nationwide Series - 210 points - 1 wins - 5 starts - $316,875
Recent races​

Place Points Time​
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30 days ago 12:34 PM (CST)​
 
Dale Earnhardt Sr raced in 136 Nationwide/Busch races over 13 years, etc etc etc etc. Cup guys running in the Nationwide/Busch series is nothing new.
 
PeopleAreStrange said:
And that one cup driver that finished in the top 18 took a win away from someone who belongs in the series. Top level drivers do not belong in the lower level series.
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So , what do you make of guys like Regan Smith , Sam Hornish , Elliott Sadler , and the rest of the guys with cup experience ? Shoot em all?
 
I have said it here before and my opinion hasn't changed...I think the cup guys help push the younger guys in Nationwide to be a better racer. I think they learn a lot from racing against the cup guys. But I don't know if the cup guys draw any extra fans to a Nationwide race.
 
StandOnIt said:
Kyle Bush built his own cars to run last year, remember..KBM? hell of a lot of work to boost one's ego. Gibbs wants his cars to finish first..they wouldn't sell Kyle any of their chassis, he had to build his own. They weren't fast. Kyle and Gibbs racing are doing the nationwide this year. how come you aren't dishing Kesolowski? he is running the nationwide? Hornish is leading the Nationwide..has won over 300,00 bucks so far this year. If his cut is 40% of the winnings, he has made over 120 thou in 5 starts. You think that dude behind the word processor knows anything? What does Hornish need to learn...guess he shouldn't be there either..ol pro and all..has been driver.

Sam Hornish Jr. - #12
1st in Nationwide Series - 210 points - 1 wins - 5 starts - $316,875
Recent races

Place Points Time​
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30 days ago 12:34 PM (CST)​
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Kyle Busch gets the negative press because he's the worst offender. He's won more races in Nationwide while running the Cup Series than anyone and he's run countless full seasons in Nationwide. And the media praise of Busch's Nationwide success is criticized because you have people in the media, when Kyle wins a minor league race, who basically combine all his wins in all divisions when writing and talking about him to inflate his "greatness". I have never seen the media talk about any other driver and say they have 96 wins (by combining their wins in all three divisions). Hell, I've never seen the media do that at all in regards to any athlete. Do you see NFL Network talking about Ray Lewis' career statistics and including his high school and college sacks and tackles? Do you see ESPN say Peyton Manning's actually the all-time NFL touchdown leader because of touchdowns he threw in high school and college?
 
Nitro Dude said:
I have said it here before and my opinion hasn't changed...I think the cup guys help push the younger guys in Nationwide to be a better racer. I think they learn a lot from racing against the cup guys. But I don't know if the cup guys draw any extra fans to a Nationwide race.
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Look at the stands. They aren't. I think it's having the opposite impact in fact. Why buy a Nationwide ticket to see the Cup drivers race when you already have Cup tickets? It's a consequence of NASCAR wanting to run Nationwide and Trucks with Cup each week. It costs NASCAR more money and it costs the networks more money if there's a standalone Nationwide or Truck race. If they only have to be at one track, it's less staff, less manpower for everyone. That's ultimately what it boils down to.

So, yes, I'm sure it's profitable for NASCAR to have the Cup drivers win all the Nationwide races at Cup tracks. But bringing in more fans? I doubt that. The Nationwide Series is and has been declining for a decade now.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Kyle Busch gets the negative press because he's the worst offender. He's won more races in Nationwide while running the Cup Series than anyone and he's run countless full seasons in Nationwide. And the media praise of Busch's Nationwide success is criticized because you have people in the media, when Kyle wins a minor league race, who basically combine all his wins in all divisions when writing and talking about him to inflate his "greatness". I have never seen the media talk about any other driver and say they have 96 wins (by combining their wins in all three divisions). Hell, I've never seen the media do that at all in regards to any athlete. Do you see NFL Network talking about Ray Lewis' career statistics and including his high school and college sacks and tackles? Do you see ESPN say Peyton Manning's actually the all-time NFL touchdown leader because of touchdowns he threw in high school and college?
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because it's still impressive. Harvick, Edwards, etc, etc, haven't matched Kyles stats and they were all in top equipment as well.
 
StewartHaas-Gibbs Racing said:
because it's still impressive. Harvick, Edwards, etc, etc, haven't matched Kyles stats and they were all in top equipment as well.
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Harvick's only run two full seasons - and both times, he won the championship. That's for more impressive than what Kyle's done. If you're a Cup driver running almost the entire Nationwide AND Truck schedule in top-tier equipment, it's a given that you're going to rack up a lot of wins. Kyle runs A LOT more Nationwide and Truck races than every other Cup driver - verifiable fact. Edwards doesn't run Trucks and Harvick only runs a handful of Truck races. Kyle's the guy who was praised by the media for going out of his way to run three races in three different states on the same weekend. No other driver goes that far out of their way to win minor league races.

PS, I'm a Harvick fan and even I had problems with Harvick running the entire 2006 Busch Series schedule. I felt back then that it was opening up Pandora's Box and it did.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Harvick's only run two full seasons - and both times, he won the championship. That's for more impressive than what Kyle's done. If you're a Cup driver running almost the entire Nationwide AND Truck schedule in top-tier equipment, it's a given that you're going to rack up a lot of wins. Kyle runs A LOT more Nationwide and Truck races than every other Cup driver - verifiable fact. Edwards doesn't run Trucks and Harvick only runs a handful of Truck races. Kyle's the guy who was praised by the media for going out of his way to run three races in three different states on the same weekend. No other driver goes that far out of their way to win minor league races.

PS, I'm a Harvick fan and even I had problems with Harvick running the entire 2006 Busch Series schedule. I felt back then that it was opening up Pandora's Box and it did.
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2007
Harvick - 26 starts - 6 wins
Kyle - 19 starts - 4 wins

2008
Harvick - 22 starts - 0 wins
Kyle - 30 starts - 10 wins

2010
Harvick - 28 starts - 3 wins
Kyle - 29 starts - 13 wins
 
StewartHaas-Gibbs Racing said:
2007
Harvick - 26 starts - 6 wins
Kyle - 19 starts - 4 wins

2008
Harvick - 22 starts - 0 wins
Kyle - 30 starts - 10 wins
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Wasn't Harvick in his own car in 2008 Nationwide? How many wins did Kyle get in his own car last year? :)


2008 Truck Series
Kyle - 18 starts - 3 wins.
Harvick - 3 starts - 1 win.

2009 Trucks.
Kyle - 15 starts - 7 wins.
Harvick - 6 starts - 3 wins.

2010 Trucks
Kyle - 16 starts - 8 wins.

2011 Trucks
Kyle - 16 starts - 6 wins.




Like I said, verifiable fact that Kyle Busch runs more minor league races than any other Cup driver. That's why he gets the most criticism for it.
 
StewartHaas-Gibbs Racing said:
2010
Harvick - 28 starts - 3 wins
Kyle - 29 starts - 13 wins
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Smoke14 said:
Now you have done it. :)
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Now here come all the Kyle Busch fans to gang up. I already said I had a problem with Harvick running NW but y'all don't care. Also, in 2008, 2009 and 2010, Harvick ran his own car. Kyle was running Joe Gibbs cars. So, no Harvick wasn't in the best equipment in the series and yes, Kyle Busch was in, by miles, the best car in the series.

Notice how quickly Kyle Busch went back to racing for a Cup team in the minor league when he couldn't win in his own car?
 
I don't mind Cup guys racing in the NW series, but I am glad they can't race for the NW championship anymore. The Cup guys now no longer have motivation to run every single race on the NW schedule. 2010 was probably the breaking point for this, as only one race was one by a series regular that year (Justin Allgaier at Bristol), and it seemed like it was either Kyle Busch, Carl Edwards, or Brad Keselowski winning every week. The NW series felt like nothing more than a watered down version of Cup a few years ago, but seems to have once again found its own identity.
 
StewartHaas-Gibbs Racing said:
None but nobody at KHI won a Nationwide race in their first year either but brother Kurt picked up a win for KBM at least ;)
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Proving that the KBM cars weren't as bad as the KHI cars.

Kyle bought in to his own hype last year. Everyone in the media's been going around saying Kyle Busch is the greatest driver in NASCAR and has more talent than anyone to ever run the series. They've been saying he could take a 40th place team and win every race with it. Kyle bought in to his own hype and took his own car out there and got his ass whipped every week. Even worse, someone else got in the very same exact car and won two races. Then he got his ass whipped by some "pimply faced kid" at the Snowball after wrecking half the field. His ego took a hit so he went back to racing for Gibbs in Nationwide where he'd know he'd win just about every Nationwide race in.
 
I honestly just don't care if Cup guys run in the series because they always have. Cup guys running in their series isn't their problem. Not racing at smaller tracks in the same weekend as the trucks is their problem. In turn, this would also solve the so called problem of Cup guys running in the series.
 
That's one thing that impresses me about that Larson kid. I've talked to him before and done a story on him. He doesn't buy in to his own hype. Despite being a rookie sensation, he's got his head on his shoulders and his ego in check and he doesn't let the hype get to his brain.

Kyle Busch never had his ego in check, even back in 2001 when he was running Trucks at 16. Part of it was because he was way too young when he came in to NASCAR's upper leagues. He let the hype get to his head and that's part of why he's had meltdown after meltdown.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Proving that the KBM cars weren't as bad as the KHI cars.

Kyle bought in to his own hype last year. Everyone in the media's been going around saying Kyle Busch is the greatest driver in NASCAR and has more talent than anyone to ever run the series. They've been saying he could take a 40th place team and win every race with it. Kyle bought in to his own hype and took his own car out there and got his ass whipped every week. Even worse, someone else got in the very same exact car and won two races. Then he got his ass whipped by some "pimply faced kid" at the Snowball after wrecking half the field. His ego took a hit so he went back to racing for Gibbs in Nationwide where he'd know he'd win just about every Nationwide race in.
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Having 9 top 5s and 14 top 10s with 3 poles in 22 races in all of his own equipment is hardly getting his ass whipped.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
That's one thing that impresses me about that Larson kid. I've talked to him before and done a story on him. He doesn't buy in to his own hype. Despite being a rookie sensation, he's got his head on his shoulders and his ego in check and he doesn't let the hype get to his brain.

Kyle Busch never had his ego in check, even back in 2001 when he was running Trucks at 16. Part of it was because he was way too young when he came in to NASCAR's upper leagues. He let the hype get to his head and that's part of why he's had meltdown after meltdown.
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Egos make the sport fun. I'd rather see a ****y sob any day over another spokesman.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
That's one thing that impresses me about that Larson kid. I've talked to him before and done a story on him. He doesn't buy in to his own hype. Despite being a rookie sensation, he's got his head on his shoulders and his ego in check and he doesn't let the hype get to his brain.

Kyle Busch never had his ego in check, even back in 2001 when he was running Trucks at 16. Part of it was because he was way too young when he came in to NASCAR's upper leagues. He let the hype get to his head and that's part of why he's had meltdown after meltdown.
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Surely , you and every other reporter who interviews him ,each contribute to the hype that will eventually make him full of himself . Then , together , you will begin to tear him down. The legend begins.:(
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Kyle Busch gets the negative press because he's the worst offender. He's won more races in Nationwide while running the Cup Series than anyone and he's run countless full seasons in Nationwide. And the media praise of Busch's Nationwide success is criticized because you have people in the media, when Kyle wins a minor league race, who basically combine all his wins in all divisions when writing and talking about him to inflate his "greatness". I have never seen the media talk about any other driver and say they have 96 wins (by combining their wins in all three divisions). Hell, I've never seen the media do that at all in regards to any athlete. Do you see NFL Network talking about Ray Lewis' career statistics and including his high school and college sacks and tackles? Do you see ESPN say Peyton Manning's actually the all-time NFL touchdown leader because of touchdowns he threw in high school and college?
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Worst offender? what are you talking about. Cup drivers are free to race in any series they choose. So are any other NASCAR approved driver up or down, Bush for instance, is free to run an ARCA race if he chooses to as long as it doesn't violate his contract with Gibbs racing. So are any other NASCAR approved driver. You and Blount don't know squat. Who freakin cares about what stick and ball sports do. This is a racing forum, in case you forgot. You seem to believe just about any nonsense that some desk jockey can print to fill a page. Your like the a mini Bill O'riley, throw crap on the wall and see if it sticks. Can't wait for you to post Blount's next article when the pro's come to race at the next nationwide road course.
 
StandOnIt said:
Worst offender? what are you talking about. Cup drivers are free to race in any series they choose. So are any other NASCAR approved driver up or down, Bush for instance, is free to run an ARCA race if he chooses to as long as it doesn't violate his contract with Gibbs racing. So are any other NASCAR approved driver. You and Blount don't know squat. Who freakin cares about what stick and ball sports do. This is a racing forum, in case you forgot. You seem to believe just about any nonsense that some desk jockey can print to fill a page. Your like the a mini Bill O'riley, throw crap on the wall and see if it sticks. Can't wait for you to post Blount's next article when the pro's come to race at the next nationwide road course.
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I don't engage in pissing competitions. Want to hurl out attacks like "mini Bill O'Reilly"? Take that bull**** to the Podium. In the mean time, eat a taco.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
I don't engage in pissing competitions. Want to hurl out attacks like "mini Bill O'Reilly"? Take that bull**** to the Podium. In the mean time, eat a taco.
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No reason to be mad Andy . That's what happens in the real world .People disagree with you .
 
Oddly enough, when actual FACTS get posted, the discussion immediately gets led away from those facts. Do you know why? I do ;)
 
There is a paved short track near where I live and once a year , the track brings in a Nascar driver or two to compete . They've had Reutiman , David Reagan , Bill Elliott , and many more . They pay these guys to come in , pay all of their expenses,etc. The local drivers donate , prepare and crew a top flight ride . The local sponsors get on board with a few bucks to help out. All of this is for the drivers and fans to have the privilege of seeing a Nascar driver race the local guys . Naturally , it is the only race all year that sells out .
 
ted@economy said:
There is a paved short track near where I live and once a year , the track brings in a Nascar driver or two to compete . They've had Reutiman , David Reagan , Bill Elliott , and many more . They pay these guys to come in , pay all of their expenses,etc. The local drivers donate , prepare and crew a top flight ride . The local sponsors get on board with a few bucks to help out. All of this is for the drivers and fans to have the privilege of seeing a Nascar driver race the local guys . Naturally , it is the only race all year that sells out .
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Wait just a minute! So you're trying to tell us having a big named driver in a less than popular/smaller race helps sell tickets? People want to see that???? You don't say!?
 
Terry Blount is arguing that NASCAR should be more like Baseball with their minor league system. Terry Blount couldn't be more wrong.

This is auto racing. You show up with a car, you race. End of story.
 
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