Enough Is Enough Full Season Championship.

I can't think of a better way to crown a champion than most wins for the season.

The argument is that SVG could win with RC's alone. If that happens, let it be. The other drivers have to step up their game.

Imagine if winning races was the primary goal, not points. We'd see some awesome battles and we'd be able to tell who the best drivers are.

I know there are downsides, but I can't think of a better solution.

Stage breaks would be gone in this scenario too, which is another thing that has mixed opinions by fans.

Maybe Carl Edwards would come out of retirement.
 
In dirt High Limit sprints, they award passing points from where you start to where you finish in addition to finishing positions. 1 point for each car a driver passes. The Top 3 finishers on the podium get bonus points. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure it out. -2 starting from 50 points on down, starting positions are listed after qualifying for passing points.
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From AI. They gave me three other ones when I went back and corrected them after I saw what you posted. Yikes. I'm afraid to ask them about USAC points now. I do know they award passing points.
 
JJ_14 said:
I can't think of a better way to crown a champion than most wins for the season.

The argument is that SVG could win with RC's alone. If that happens, let it be. The other drivers have to step up their game.

Imagine if winning races was the primary goal, not points. We'd see some awesome battles and we'd be able to tell who the best drivers are.

I know there are downsides, but I can't think of a better solution.

Stage breaks would be gone in this scenario too, which is another thing that has mixed opinions by fans.

Maybe Carl Edwards would come out of retirement.
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The best solution is giving the winner a shhit ton more points. That makes winning more important but also makes sure the champion is someone good all season also. Its literally not that hard a concept.
 
I think something similar to High Limit below keeps the points race closer. The top 3 gets separation from the field. I think it would work pretty well in Nascar because in Nascar historically, there are only about 5 cars competing for the title. The hail Mary win and you are in has created more of a confusing mess than any genuine entertainment value. Fans could learn this part pretty quickly. Stage points make it a bit more complicated, but not terrible.
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I asked ChatGPT for a points system that rewarded winning and has harsh penalties for running in the back. This is what I got:

🏁 “Victory Weight” Points System (VWPS)
1. Race Finish Points
Position
1st 60 +20 bonus points over 2nd
2nd 40
3rd 36
4th 33
5th 30
6th 28
7th 26
8th 24
9th 22
10th 20
11th 18
12th 17
13th 16
14th 15
15th 14
16th 13
17th 12
18th 11
19th 10
20th 9
21st 8
22nd 7
23rd 6
24th 5
25th 4
26th–30th 3
31st–35th 2
36th–40th 0

2. Bonus Points
Stage Win +3
Pole +2
Led a Lap +1
Led the Most Laps +3
Clean Sweep (won all stages + race) +5 additional bonus

So, a perfect day (pole, all stages, most laps, race win) nets 74 points — versus maybe 15–20 for a midpacker.

3. Penalty Scale for DNFs
Late DNF (≥90% distance): 0 points taken away from race total

Medium-Late DNF (50%-90% distance): 3 points taken away from race total

Early DNF (<50% distance): 5 points taken away from race total


That can swing a playoff picture fast if a contender has two crashes in three weeks.
 
Blaze said:
The best solution is giving the winner a shhit ton more points. That makes winning more important but also makes sure the champion is someone good all season also. Its literally not that hard a concept.
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That makes sense too. I think the current format has some issues, though I rarely give it much thought. But I kind of wish race wins were rewarded more.
 
JJ_14 said:
That makes sense too. I think the current format has some issues, though I rarely give it much thought. But I kind of wish race wins were rewarded more.
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Same. Its why I want them to get more points. They should always leave the weekend with the most points. If 2nd place wins both stages, right now they can leave with more than the winner. That's a big issue. So bump up the winners points to an unreachable amount for 2nd place.
 
MRM said:
Get rid of them at all tracks. We know they are built-in commercial breaks. But it takes away a lot of strategy at a lot of races.
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i keep saying that they should give out stage points, but dont stop the dam race to give them out.green flag pit stop are way better.
 
Blaze said:
Same. Its why I want them to get more points. They should always leave the weekend with the most points. If 2nd place wins both stages, right now they can leave with more than the winner. That's a big issue. So bump up the winners points to an unreachable amount for 2nd place.
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stage points are the reason sometimes drivers who only win the race don't earn the most points. Easy to lower the stage points and lose the playoff points.
 
StandOnIt said:
stage points are the reason sometimes drivers who only win the race don't earn the most points. Easy to lower the stage points and lose the playoff points.
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Lowering stage points could maybe work as well. But then you probably need to change who gets them as well. If you keep it at top 10, you can't really lower it. But if you go say only top 5 then 5-4-3-2-1 works.
 
Just give them to the top 5, as most of the time the top five are usually in the top five at race end. Another bonus that gives the winner more of an advantage most of the time and it wouldn't be a killer if they are short pitting the stage and going for the win.
 
Blaze said:
But would someone push it to gain a position if 6th to 10th? Knowing they get the same amount of points if they move up just that one spot.
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In the old days a lot of them wouldn't "push it" that way anyway until later in the race than that anyway. A great example of this is none other than Mark Martin who has been vocal about the points. It would be a balance of taking care of your stuff vs track position for those positions especially.
 
Blaze said:
But would someone push it to gain a position if 6th to 10th? Knowing they get the same amount of points if they move up just that one spot.
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Yeah that's possible, but also possible instead of hanging in there for one point, they pit early, flip the stage and gain positions for the restart. Couple that with goodyear creating tires with fall off it could get interesting with plenty of movement/passing etc.
 
It's always Kez from the top rope it seems. It sums up perfectly how the playoff system has flipped the script from what was to what is.
 
StandOnIt said:
It's always Kez from the top rope it seems. It sums up perfectly how the playoff system has flipped the script from what was to what is.
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"Big event feel" is as ambiguous as "Game 7 moments." Kez is a great talker. I like him, but does he understand that the last couple of races could become meaningless? I will go to the same number of races as I always have....maybe more, but I would be less inclined to by tickets to late season races not knowing if there would be any greater significance. Those of use that do not attend all 36 point paying races will not buy 36 races worth of tickets to see a champion crowned.
 
Let’s have a full season championship but with a podium finish. I’m sorta over binary zero sum thing. Hand out silver and bronze and kill the playoff. Also this thread has gone on a while so why not bitch about some new contentious thing 😬
 
Revman said:
"Big event feel" is as ambiguous as "Game 7 moments." Kez is a great talker. I like him, but does he understand that the last couple of races could become meaningless? I will go to the same number of races as I always have....maybe more, but I would be less inclined to by tickets to late season races not knowing if there would be any greater significance. Those of use that do not attend all 36 point paying races will not buy 36 races worth of tickets to see a champion crowned.
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The concept that guaranteeing close championship battles for the last 2.5 months of the season would elevate interest in those races is a proven failure, so this is all moot. The fatal flaw in your thinking is that an individual race becomes "meaningless" because the season championship has been decided. Cup races always have meaning. Their importance is not solely or even primarily determined by the state of the season points standings when they occur.
 
gnomesayin said:
The concept that guaranteeing close championship battles for the last 2.5 months of the season would elevate interest in those races is a proven failure, so this is all moot. The fatal flaw in your thinking is that an individual race becomes "meaningless" because the season championship has been decided. Cup races always have meaning. Their importance is not solely or even primarily attached to the state of the season points standings when they occur.
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True....then who gives three ****s about the championship format?
 
RaceCritter said:
Let’s have a full season championship but with a podium finish. I’m sorta over binary zero sum thing. Hand out silver and bronze and kill the playoff. Also this thread has gone on a while so why not bitch about some new contentious thing 😬
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Because @StandOnIt is bracing for an off-season dealing with a Denny Hamlin and/or Toyota win. Bait is hard to resist. Speaking from experience.
 
I'm not looking forward to listening to every other word being about the playoffs instead of the race at Talladega. The fake hype / forced game 7' moments are an artificial clown show. Fake points, fudged up competition. Yesterday another out of the playoff driver won the race and was mostly ignored after a win in favor of playoff points hype. Another example of the distortion that fans are being forced to swallow this make believe nonsense. Next up, drivers will be wearing +2, -6 on their racing suits.
 
Revman said:
"Big event feel" is as ambiguous as "Game 7 moments." Kez is a great talker. I like him, but does he understand that the last couple of races could become meaningless? I will go to the same number of races as I always have....maybe more, but I would be less inclined to by tickets to late season races not knowing if there would be any greater significance. Those of use that do not attend all 36 point paying races will not buy 36 races worth of tickets to see a champion crowned.
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Why would the last couple of races become meaningless? I feel the first 26 races are meaningless now if I’m being 100.
 
StandOnIt said:
Next up, drivers will be wearing +2, -6 on their racing suits.
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Hey that's a good idea. Also, why do the cars have these meaningless numbers on them? Why does Chase Elliott drive the #9 car and Ryan Blaney #12? Who cares about that? Elliott should be driving the -23 car today.
 
Jorge De Guzman said:
Why would the last couple of races become meaningless? I feel the first 26 races are meaningless now if I’m being 100.
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They wiped out 2/3's of the field after the first points fudge it up. They won't be mentioned again unless they run into a playoff driver or they wreck.
 
gnomesayin said:
Hey that's a good idea. Also, why do the cars have these meaningless numbers on them? Why does Chase Elliott drive the #9 car and Ryan Blaney #12? Who cares about that? Elliott should be driving the -23 car today.
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As long as the numbers are red and they blink, I would be OK with it. #bEcAUsE pLaoFFs
 
gnomesayin said:
The concept that guaranteeing close championship battles for the last 2.5 months of the season would elevate interest in those races is a proven failure
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How do you know this is a failure? There is no side by side comparison in this environment. Isn’t it entirely possible that the result would be the same with a season long championship?

Kind of like letting me taste a Snickers bar and asking if I like it better than a Milky Way without letting me try the Milky Way.
 
DIDIT said:
How do you know this is a failure? There is no side by side comparison in this environment. Isn’t it entirely possible that the result would be the same with a season long championship?

Kind of like letting me taste a Snickers bar and asking if I like it better than a Milky Way without letting me try the Milky Way.
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That's entirely possible, but there won't be an 11th place Cup driver winning the lottery round, or two years in a row a dominate Truck driver loses the lottery round, one of those years the driver that won the championship only won one race the whole season, the last lottery race. This whole playoff B.S. was started years ago because of exactly to prevent this same thing happening.

Now, this year, Connor Zilisch with 10 wins in Xfinity, and Corey Heim also has 10 wins presently. What kind of a joke will it be once again, how excited will fans be if somebody else besides either one of them wins the championship? Are fans going to walk away with a good taste in their mouths after watching a whole season of racing to see it come down to that...once again?

How important IS the championship to suffer thru all of this playoff B.S. to watch these drivers get royally screwed?
And some people wonder why fans don't like the playoffs?
 
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