# 31 ----winless champ ---even closer now !

FenderBumper said:
No, but a split championship would make for better arguments. :D
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We already have that. There's the 'Real Championship' as defined and followed by some racing-forum members and then there is the actual real championship that will be presented in Homestead.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
We already have that. There's the 'Real Championship' as defined and followed by some racing-forum members and then there is the actual real championship that will be presented in Homestead.
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Well there you go. Homestead gets in the way of good arguments.

SPLIT THE CHAMPIONSHIP......SPLIT THE CHAMPIONSHIP......SPLIT THE CHAMPIONSHIP......
 
Lets try this..

SPLIT THE CHAMPIONSHIP SO DALE CAN WIN..........SPLIT THE CHAMPIONSHIP SO DALE CAN WIN..........SPLIT THE CHAMPIONSHIP SO DALE CAN WIN..........
 
FenderBumper said:
IMO, there's no way to balance wins vs consistency every year.

Split the championship money between wins champ and points champ. If you're good enough, you win the unified championship and don't share the stage with anyone. That would pretty much guarantee 1 championship battle won't be settled until the last race is over.
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Interesting concept. Kinda like having to win both the AP and Coaches' Poll titles to be the unanimous champion in college football for so long. I didn't like it for football, but I don't think I'd mind it in racing.
 
PushRodV8 said:
I wonder how many fans are truly fans of the chase? I can't think of a single diehard fan that likes it.
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I've watched this sport for over 20 years, I don't know if I say I like it but this sport has gone thru so many changes so I don't really care either way as long as the racing is good. How many championships someone wins doesn't matter to me.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
We already have that. There's the 'Real Championship' as defined and followed by some racing-forum members and then there is the actual real championship that will be presented in Homestead.
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I haven't been able to break it to em, kind of like a youngster finding out about Santa Claus.
 
SlicedBread22 said:
:rolleyes:

Man.. how old were u when the chase came around? Like 9? 10 years old? Chances are the only reason u hate it because ur Dad does lol... do u even remember watching NASCAR before then? U were a child. You can say whatever u want but you know as well as I do that you've spend the majority of your time as a fan hating the product but likely still watching every single race... it must be tiring.. I mean you've spent nearly half your life hating something you love because of something you have no control over.
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Slice going HAM.

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Lazyking said:
I've watched this sport for over 20 years, I don't know if I say I like it but this sport has gone thru so many changes so I don't really care either way as long as the racing is good. How many championships someone wins doesn't matter to me.
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Championships are good... but not enough to act like a lot of these guys do. I've never seen people hate something so much that they love and continue to watch week in and week out.

We don't watch this sport a year at a time.. we watch a week at a time, even a lap at a time... most love the racing every week but dont like the results they get and blame it on the chase or some other thing that could have been avoided had the drivers they wanted to had better finishes. There is no farce championships. There never will be. The driver who wins will earn it. Whether they win 5 or 6 times this year or none at all. The path to success doesn't matter, it's the end result that goes in the record books. How many of you have cheered your driver on after running 10th all day and taking two tires on a GWC on their way to victory lane? Did they deserve it? Hell yes they did!

For me... it's all about

"Did you see that move?!"

or

"He just took him out!"

"Green! Green! Green!"

whether it's..

"and he wins over the dominant driver of the day on a GWC by .005 at the line"

or

"..and after a 500 mile race with 2 cautions and 3 leaders he beat the entire field by 17 seconds on his way to victory lane."


Just watch the damn races and enjoy it people. It's awesome!
 
FenderBumper said:
Matt won only 1 race in 2003, and Newman won 8. Newman was the real champion.
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Nice, but the discontent then doesn't compare to the current discontent for obvious reasons.
 
Nathan_259 said:
I will admit, I like the racing more than I dislike the Chase. That's why I keep watching.
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Absolutely. I think anyone that dislikes this Chase but is still watching NASCAR would agree with you.

As I've said before, I love NASCAR - if I didn't, I wouldn't be watching it every week. The fact that I love it doesn't make it immune to criticism, though. I'm not just gonna pretend that I like every single thing about it if I don't, and I can dislike certain aspects of it while still liking it overall and without being totally miserable about it. Most people here seem to understand that. There are maybe one or two that don't. Oh well. You can't win 'em all.

To those that are tired of hearing all the anti-Chase talk, this is the very first year for this brand new format. The debate will most likely rage on until the format changes, and then we'll spar with each other about that. It is what it is.
 
Anothing amusing angle to all this is the fact that Newman was Penske's guy back in '03 and Roger was pretty vocal about how he felt that wins should be more important, and I believe he was a big supporter of bringing in the Chase.

Fast forward to now, and Penske's guys are sitting with all the wins but the fact is Newman could still walk away champ with none. If that were to happen, well that irony would just be downright delicious.
 
If it happens it happens, the thing for whatever reason has rewarded teams who have kept their noses clean and finished the race in good order. The winner is getting all the glory, but after the smoke clears, there they are, still in it to win it.
 
3wideinturn1 said:
Anothing amusing angle to all this is the fact that Newman was Penske's guy back in '03 and Roger was pretty vocal about how he felt that wins should be more important, and I believe he was a big supporter of bringing in the Chase.

Fast forward to now, and Penske's guys are sitting with all the wins but the fact is Newman could still walk away champ with none. If that were to happen, well that irony would just be downright delicious.
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Alot of ironies lately.

I almost want that to happen. Only draw back is that 3 other much deserving drivers get the short end.
 
if.... #31 advances & wins title........he'll have ta outrun all 3 other finalists at homestead. no points racin.
3 top tier guys who managed ta get into final 4 ........and want title too !

anybody actually stop & think how difficult that will be if it happens ?
 
hawg dawg said:
if.... #31 advances & wins title........he'll have ta outrun all 3 other finalists at homestead. no points racin.
3 top tier guys who managed ta get into final 4 ........and want title too !

anybody actually stop & think how difficult that will be if it happens ?
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Head to head, that would be a feat, yes.

But chances are that at least 1 or 2 of the 4 will have issues.

On a head to head battle, Newman doesn't have a prayers chance.
 
hawg dawg said:
if.... #31 advances & wins title........he'll have ta outrun all 3 other finalists at homestead. no points racin.
3 top tier guys who managed ta get into final 4 ........and want title too !

anybody actually stop & think how difficult that will be if it happens ?
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sure, but just getting to the final four is something that sponsors like. CAT car looks good getting all the attention it is getting..it has been years since that happened. millions of CAT power vehicles out there.
 
Reck said:
Head to head, that would be a feat, yes.

But chances are that at least 1 or 2 of the 4 will have issues.

On a head to head battle, Newman doesn't have a prayers chance.
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nhra excuse now huh ! ha! at least that's a new one ! :D
 
On a head to head battle, Newman doesn't have a prayers chance.

Been hearing that all year long, but he is in second place. Go figure.
 
StandOnIt said:
sure, but just getting to the final four is something that sponsors like. CAT car looks good getting all the attention it is getting..it has been years since that happened. millions of CAT power vehicles out there.
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quicken loans too...on car yesterday ...reupped for '15 too.
 
StandOnIt said:
On a head to head battle, Newman doesn't have a prayers chance.

Been hearing that all year long, but he is in second place. Go figure.
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Over 33 races... I doubt he'll pull it off without every other driver having issues if he makes the final 4... unless the final 4 consists the 11, 20, 31, and 99.. stranger things have happened but if Joey, Brad, Harvick, or Jeff are in there with him chances are he wont win the cup.
 
FenderBumper said:
Matt won only 1 race in 2003, and Newman won 8. Newman was the real champion.
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So Kenseth was the "real champion" last year?

I don't think there's a way to make the majority happy here. I really don't. Here's food for thought.

In the NFL we have 12 playoff teams.
In the NBA/NHL we have 16 playoff teams
In MLB we have 10 playoff teams (that's pretty random)
And in European soccer they have... ZERO!

None. Just a champion and people who took 2nd-20th

So technically this NASCAR Chase is extremely American.
NASCAR through 2003 had a more traditional European model.
 
Turn5ive said:
So Kenseth was the "real champion" last year?

I don't think there's a way to make the majority happy here. I really don't. Here's food for thought.

In the NFL we have 12 playoff teams.
In the NBA/NHL we have 16 playoff teams
In MLB we have 10 playoff teams (that's pretty random)
And in European soccer they have... ZERO!

None. Just a champion and people who took 2nd-20th

So technically this NASCAR Chase is extremely American.
NASCAR through 2003 had a more traditional European model.
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He never said that Kenseth should have been the real champion, and I don't think that's his opinion, as 6 wins isn't much less than 7.
 
Personally I don't like the idea of NASCAR using a system like the F1 system, where only drivers at the front earn points, cause then the underfunded teams wouldn't earn anything, when they're also racing for position.
 
SlicedBread22 said:
Over 33 races... I doubt he'll pull it off without every other driver having issues if he makes the final 4... unless the final 4 consists the 11, 20, 31, and 99.. stranger things have happened but if Joey, Brad, Harvick, or Jeff are in there with him chances are he wont win the cup.
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He is sitting in second in the second round of eliminations, I don't think there is a soul here that thought that would happen, so predict away, I don't have a clue at this point.
 
Nathan_259 said:
Personally I don't like the idea of NASCAR using a system like the F1 system, where only drivers at the front earn points, cause then the underfunded teams wouldn't earn anything, when they're also racing for position.
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31 different drivers declared for Cup points with 16+ Cup starts have a Top 10 so that would be very rare. Otherwise, they could go by highest finishing position or average finish.
 
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