Brad Kesekowski on the Gen 6

StandOnIt said:
They have. Nobody is crazy enough to run 200 in the one on the right some changes have to be made

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Ok so let me ask u this then why do people always complain about the cars not being stock cars and they want to get back to stock car racing?
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
I think it would be really cool if Nascar raced something that bore a resemblance to what they manufactured as seeing them race 4 door cars with 4 or 6 cyl engines wouldn't bother me a bit. Have a body that looks like a stock model "souped up" for racing with similar body panels and engine sizes and I would become real interested real fast. The problem is that I would be the only one that would like that so the whole thing is just a pipe dream. Most people don't care that the cars Nascar uses are essentially spec racers.
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That's what I'm saying , just make the cars look more like showroom cars add a spoiler but still use the V8 in them ... I always get confused about people saying they want the old stock car back
 
BKez was on Race Hub Tuesday, and if I interpret his comments correctly, his complaint is about side force... the car relies on side force to stick in the corners, but when another car is to the right (like a restart), that side force suddenly goes away, so the inside car gets loose and spins.

That makes sense to me. We have seen that happen a thousand times, including Brad's crash at Kentucky. And we know that Nascar is researching aerodynamic configurations that have much less side force. That is the next big aero step, IMO.
 
StandOnIt said:
They have. Nobody is crazy enough to run 200 in the one on the right some changes have to be made

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Do they have to go 200 MPH. I don't think you could tell the difference between 200 and 170, without a stopwatch. Myself, I would sacrifice speed for better racing, to a point. What point, I don't know. It would depend on how good the racing is. Faster isn't always better, competition wise. If it were, people wouldn't have complained about Truex at the 600 last year.
 
True, faster isn't necessarily better, as it is I don't know of any series that doesn't have rules to limit speed. That went out a long time ago. The Penske Porsche with Donahue pretty much did that, still the fastest race car.
 
Yogisd1 said:
Do they have to go 200 MPH. I don't think you could tell the difference between 200 and 170, without a stopwatch. Myself, I would sacrifice speed for better racing, to a point. What point, I don't know. It would depend on how good the racing is. Faster isn't always better, competition wise. If it were, people wouldn't have complained about Truex at the 600 last year.
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That was an example of how close to a "real" 4 door sedan it really is. To some that isn't close enough. But to me, compared to looking like a 4 door grocery getter, or the race car on the right the 4 door doesn't do it for me. As far as 200 or 170 for the one on the left? Wouldn't make any difference to me. Personally I wish they could keep the speed, get it off the ground and let drivers use their brakes like the rest of us do to go slower.
 
LewTheShoe said:
BKez was on Race Hub Tuesday, and if I interpret his comments correctly, his complaint is about side force... the car relies on side force to stick in the corners, but when another car is to the right (like a restart), that side force suddenly goes away, so the inside car gets loose and spins.

That makes sense to me. We have seen that happen a thousand times, including Brad's crash at Kentucky. And we know that Nascar is researching aerodynamic configurations that have much less side force. That is the next big aero step, IMO.
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"if I interpret his comments correctly"

The door has been opened tantalizingly wide and there is much that could be said......
 
LewTheShoe said:
BKez was on Race Hub Tuesday, and if I interpret his comments correctly, his complaint is about side force... the car relies on side force to stick in the corners, but when another car is to the right (like a restart), that side force suddenly goes away, so the inside car gets loose and spins.

That makes sense to me. We have seen that happen a thousand times, including Brad's crash at Kentucky. And we know that Nascar is researching aerodynamic configurations that have much less side force. That is the next big aero step, IMO.
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They all say they have to get all they can on restarts because it is so hard to pass after they get strung out. Going three and four wide on restarts would make it really hard to figure out anything about Aero in those situations. Lack of side force isn't going to do anything there, probably make three wide worse.
 
I haven't been a Bucky Brad fan ever.

Until today.

Bravo Brad.
 
LewTheShoe said:
BKez was on Race Hub Tuesday, and if I interpret his comments correctly, his complaint is about side force... the car relies on side force to stick in the corners, but when another car is to the right (like a restart), that side force suddenly goes away, so the inside car gets loose and spins.

That makes sense to me. We have seen that happen a thousand times, including Brad's crash at Kentucky. And we know that Nascar is researching aerodynamic configurations that have much less side force. That is the next big aero step, IMO.
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I posted another clip over in Jr's splitter thread of back in 1974 at Daytona and they were racing three wide at around 190 without side skirts and flat sides, no splitter and a very small spoiler in the back, no shark fins on the top and bias ply tires. They had over 60 passes for the lead. Nobody got sucked around like Brad did and he wasn't running anywhere close to 190 when he went around.
 
Brad is saying what the drivers think, and we know it's true because we bitched about it while the race went on. Race was pretty boring this year, where last year it was pretty good.

And Penske hasn't fallen off that much. The 21 car won a race recently and many of those cars are prepared right beside the 2 and the 22.
 
StandOnIt said:
I posted another clip over in Jr's splitter thread of back in 1974 at Daytona and they were racing three wide at around 190 without side skirts and flat sides, no splitter and a very small spoiler in the back, no shark fins on the top and bias ply tires. They had over 60 passes for the lead. Nobody got sucked around like Brad did and he wasn't running anywhere close to 190 when he went around.
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That track is 2.5 miles with very large radius in the turns, plus 32 degrees of banking... not the same deal, not even close.
 
Team Penske said:
It will be fun to watch those that depend on down force when they don't have it. Same for side force.
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yeah I've been posting example after example from the early 70's with very little aero anything with great racing..They have a mess now, aero imbalance if you ask me. They have it some axis some they don't.
 
They have to all resemble each other closely or you have each team claiming the other makes have an advantage. The bitching was rediculous in the 90's.
 
Ford 222 said:
They have to all resemble each other closely or you have each team claiming the other makes have an advantage. The bitching was rediculous in the 90's.
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Maybe it was but the racing was great and the tracks were full as well as TV was up.
 
Ford 222 said:
The bitching was rediculous in the 90's.
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Revman said:
Actually, that was pretty cool IMO. Increased manufacturer rivalries.
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I don't agree with constant fiddling with car specs to spread around the trophies, like Nascar from the 60's through the 90's, and like in sports car racing today. Just yesterday, Aston Martin management was defending Balance of Performance changes (less weight and more power) that handed some wins to the slower, out-dated Aston Martin...

"Everyone’s got to get their chance to win every few years, otherwise they stop coming.”

I don't want to see this in Nascar again. Been there, done that.
 
LewTheShoe said:
I don't agree with constant fiddling with car specs to spread around the trophies, like Nascar from the 60's through the 90's, and like in sports car racing today. Just yesterday, Aston Martin management was defending Balance of Performance changes (less weight and more power) that handed some wins to the slower, out-dated Aston Martin...

"Everyone’s got to get their chance to win every few years, otherwise they stop coming.”

I don't want to see this in Nascar again. Been there, done that.
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Alternatively, however, we have cars that stamp the same aero footprint, go the same speed, and don't pass. The teams wanted the parity. They got it. Now, they bitch about aero. Today, just like in the 90's this is a constantly evolving process addressing competitiveness. This isn't working, really. We are relying on track bite to get the cars to pass. We are bitching. Why not make the bitching more interesting?
 
Revman said:
Alternatively, however, we have cars that stamp the same aero footprint, go the same speed, and don't pass. The teams wanted the parity. They got it. Now, they bitch about aero. Today, just like in the 90's this is a constantly evolving process addressing competitiveness. This isn't working, really. We are relying on track bite to get the cars to pass. We are bitching. Why not make the bitching more interesting?
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IDK what other racing series are like with respect to bitching but I know I don't see nearly as much of it with hockey and football. In general the Commissioners are disliked but that is par for the course and there is some trash talking amongst the fans but normally has to do with rivalries which apparently Nascar doesn't have. I love rivalry games as the atmosphere is electric and often times the game are too.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
IDK what other racing series are like with respect to bitching but I know I don't see nearly as much of it with hockey and football. In general the Commissioners are disliked but that is par for the course and there is some trash talking amongst the fans but normally has to do with rivalries which apparently Nascar doesn't have. I love rivalry games as the atmosphere is electric and often times the game are too.
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Since Toyota entered WRC (Rally Car), I have been on a message board learning. One or two guys bitch, but mostly they are happy when new members join. They want their sport to grow globally. They like it. They can't bitch about TV because basically, you follow online with WRC Plus....Highlights + a few live stages. Can't bitch about attendance because it's hard to count. Overall, the members are welcoming and are happy to educate. They are so passionate that they feel EVER other form of motorsport sucks.
 
Revman said:
Since Toyota entered WRC (Rally Car), I have been on a message board learning. One or two guys bitch, but mostly they are happy when new members join. They want their sport to grow globally. They like it. They can't bitch about TV because basically, you follow online with WRC Plus....Highlights + a few live stages. Can't bitch about attendance because it's hard to count. Overall, the members are welcoming and are happy to educate. They are so passionate that they feel EVER other form of motorsport sucks.
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That is good to know as chronic complaining must be more localized with Nascar fans. I have gone through many different bitching cycles with Nascar as back when the manufacturer was important to most fans there was always complaining about who had an advantage. During that time there was also chronic complaining that Nascar heavily favored GM and then when Bill & Ernie Elliott came along that stoked the fires even more as they were real good and real fast. Around 2003/4 years I noticed that some of the old fans had had enough and were complaining early and often. As more time went by a general disdain and loathing set in and there are few fans you hear that love, love, love Nascar and are enthused about its direction and future.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
That is good to know as chronic complaining must be more localized with Nascar fans. I have gone through many different bitching cycles with Nascar as back when the manufacturer was important to most fans there was always complaining about who had an advantage. During that time there was also chronic complaining that Nascar heavily favored GM and then when Bill & Ernie Elliott came along that stoked the fires even more as they were real good and real fast. Around 2003/4 years I noticed that some of the old fans had had enough and were complaining early and often. As more time went by a general disdain and loathing set in and there are few fans you hear that love, love, love Nascar and are enthused about its direction and future.
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Yeah, it's honestly refreshing to go over to the WRC site. Reminds me that it is possible for people to support and like a series. I think that NASCAR's "downfall" after its heyday coincided with the social media boom resulting in NASCAR struggling with how to handle "data" (fan input). Thus, they are listening to everybody and going in a million different directions. At the same time, the RTA has NASCAR's nuts in a vice to control costs, and drivers have a voice now as well. I think that fans feel that NASCAR is listening (kind of), and just spewing wish lists....and then changing those wish lists dependent on the success of their favorite driver. Kind of a mess, really. Relieved that it is pretty simple in my world. Hope that this thing moves in a direction where more people can be happy like the WRC.
 
LouieLouie said:
I prefer to call it NAPCAR. National Association of Prototype Car Auto Racing. lol jk. :sarcasm:
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Yeah, pretty sure somebody will flame the hell out of me for talking WRC, but one of the things that I think is awesome about it is that they threw away the box (essentially) in terms of car development. Four manufacturers.....open box....and the competition is tighter this year than in many I am told. Hmmmmm. The drivers are the glory boys, but the cars are center stage. Right up my alley. Really enjoying learning about what I think NASCAR has forgotten.....that the cars are just awesome. Need to get back to that, but before we do, we have to make them different IMO.
 
Revman said:
Yeah, pretty sure somebody will flame the hell out of me for talking WRC, but one of the things that I think is awesome about it is that they threw away the box (essentially) in terms of car development. Four manufacturers.....open box....and the competition is tighter this year than in many I am told. Hmmmmm. The drivers are the glory boys, but the cars are center stage. Right up my alley. Really enjoying learning about what I think NASCAR has forgotten.....that the cars are just awesome. Need to get back to that, but before we do, we have to make them different IMO.
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IMSA is kind of similar in that way. They have some really cool cars that look like the showroom models. My only gripe with IMSA is that most of their events are endurance events so I can't watch all the action, but I have been following a lot closer this year than in years past.
IMSA still has some other issues, but which series doesn't?
 
Good points and I think Nascar is a much easier topic for people to discuss that have technical minds because there is a lot of meat in that area. I used to belong to a forum that had a very technologically inclined member who could take difficult subjects and make them understandable and I for one enjoyed it. He knew his stuff and was not one of those heavy handed, devoid of personality and insufferable chaps that have inflated opinions of themselves.

With stick and ball there are so many more topics for the casual fan to discuss as there is always the subject of matchups, injuries, player movements, salary cap implications and so on and so on. Factor in that there are normally multiple games everyday you have a lot of fresh and ready made material. With Nascar you are not normally dealing with injuries or driver movements during the season and so little is known about salaries or operating budgets you can't really discuss them either.
 
LouieLouie said:
IMSA is kind of similar in that way. They have some really cool cars that look like the showroom models. My only gripe with IMSA is that most of their events are endurance events so I can't watch all the action, but I have been following a lot closer this year than in years past.
IMSA still has some other issues, but which series doesn't?
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Right with you....been following the GTD class with the Lexus RCF---TRD has heavy involvement here. Pretty cool, but I, like you, tend to follow casually due to the endurance nature of the deal.
 
LewTheShoe said:
You might think that of me, Aunty, but over at the hockey forum they just call me a hater 'cause I always make fun of that sport and all those who actually, you know, enjoy it.
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I don't think of you as heavy handed at all as the folks I was describing were quite knowledgeable and could speak about technical subjects on a level where the casual fan understood. I have not seen either of those attributes from you which is not to say you don't have them but perhaps have chosen not to show them to us.
 
LewTheShoe said:
I don't agree with constant fiddling with car specs to spread around the trophies, like Nascar from the 60's through the 90's, and like in sports car racing today. Just yesterday, Aston Martin management was defending Balance of Performance changes (less weight and more power) that handed some wins to the slower, out-dated Aston Martin...

"Everyone’s got to get their chance to win every few years, otherwise they stop coming.”

I don't want to see this in Nascar again. Been there, done that.
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"Le Mans was a separate case, but for the rest of the season the automatic BoP should take all of the politics and gameplay out of it. Then it comes truly down to the drivers and strategy on the day.

"There will always be some circuits that favour some type of car better than others, but that’s the beauty of the diversity of the sport.”
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It's only been one race so far but I thought the auto-BoP did pretty well too.
 
LouieLouie said:
IMSA is kind of similar in that way. They have some really cool cars that look like the showroom models. My only gripe with IMSA is that most of their events are endurance events so I can't watch all the action, but I have been following a lot closer this year than in years past.
IMSA still has some other issues, but which series doesn't?
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Most races are shorter than NASCAR races. There are the four big enduros but half of the races are 2:40 and then another two are 1:40 so that's two-thirds of the schedule.
 
Revman said:
Yeah, it's honestly refreshing to go over to the WRC site. Reminds me that it is possible for people to support and like a series. I think that NASCAR's "downfall" after its heyday coincided with the social media boom resulting in NASCAR struggling with how to handle "data" (fan input). Thus, they are listening to everybody and going in a million different directions. At the same time, the RTA has NASCAR's nuts in a vice to control costs, and drivers have a voice now as well. I think that fans feel that NASCAR is listening (kind of), and just spewing wish lists....and then changing those wish lists dependent on the success of their favorite driver. Kind of a mess, really. Relieved that it is pretty simple in my world. Hope that this thing moves in a direction where more people can be happy like the WRC.
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I can not imagine working in the Fan/Media Engagement Center and poring over all of the stuff that comes through there.
 
FLRacingFan said:
I can not imagine working in the Fan/Media Engagement Center and poring over all of the stuff that comes through there.
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It may not be that difficult as I suspect many of the responses are just angry rants that go straight into the circular file. However trying to figure out how to properly downsize the series and get it to a point where young people were interested would be a nightmare.
 
FLRacingFan said:
Most races are shorter than NASCAR races. There are the four big enduros but half of the races are 2:40 and then another two are 1:40 so that's two-thirds of the schedule.
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Damn good point.
 
FLRacingFan said:
Most races are shorter than NASCAR races. There are the four big enduros but half of the races are 2:40 and then another two are 1:40 so that's two-thirds of the schedule.
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I didn't realize that. I thought most events were 6 hours or more with the exception of Long Beach. Guess I need to pay closer attention to the schedule. Even with the endurance races, I am still a big fan of the 24 hours of Daytona. That is a really cool race.
 
The Rolex 24 for me is popular because it is the first race after a long dry spell. I'm not a fan of the recent car changes to the top tier getting away from the Daytona prototypes, and not a fan of so many different classes. But it takes what it takes to make up a field. I wish the TV would do a better job of coverage for it and the 12 hours of Sebring.
 
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