West
Speedoholic
WOW, they can't say no to that
F1 2023 News/Misc.
- Thread starter donthaveanickname
- Start date
WOW, they can't say no to that
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
MBS and the FIA pretty certainly want this to happen. I’m not sure what say FOM/Liberty and the teams have but this should be enough to shut up Domenicali and Toto and the like.
West
Speedoholic
It is Liberty's sandbox, and Cadillac/GM would fit in very nicely with their ongoing US expansion move.
West
Speedoholic
I suspect an agreement has already been reached with the parties that matter, as a company like GM probably wouldn't want to be part of any "failed" announcements.
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
I’d think so but the hesitation on the whole Andretti bid since it started has been on the F1 side, and their statement today was more lukewarm than from anyone else involved. I’d say the GM partnership makes it far more likely but there’s no such thing as a sure thing in the F1 world.
F1 says Andretti entry still needs our approval
Formula 1 has issued a lukewarm response to plans from Andretti to bring Cadillac into grand prix racing, insisting any decision will not just be down to the FIA.
www.motorsport.com
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
GM wouldn’t build their own PU at least from the start but would still be technically involved. They have a PU deal signed with someone already.
racer.com
www.motorsport.com
Andretti Cadillac has signed agreement with external PU supplier
The proposed Andretti Cadillac Racing Formula 1 entry has a signed agreement with an existing power unit supplier if it is successful, and would look to add General Motors’ expertise in future. And…
racer.com
Will Cadillac tie-up ease F1's resistance to Andretti's plans?
www.motorsport.com
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
I found it interesting that F1’s web site nor social accounts acknowledged the Andretti/Cadillac announcement while the FIA did.
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
Kiante
Team Owner
"Badging exercise."
Straight hypocrites.
Straight hypocrites.
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
Badging exercises on existing entries with zero technical involvement =
“Badging exercise” with new OEM who will actually provide technical support out of two different U.S. bases =
Kiante
Team Owner
Just say it.Badging exercises on existing entries with zero technical involvement =
“Badging exercise” with new OEM who will actually provide technical support out of two different U.S. bases =
"We don't want our money to be messed with."
Kiante
Team Owner
Red Bull Powertrains?Badging exercises on existing entries with zero technical involvement =
“Badging exercise” with new OEM who will actually provide technical support out of two different U.S. bases =
Red Bull?
Alpha Tauri?
Alpine is a badging exercise for Renault... Lol.
"We don't want Americans"
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
Ford slapping a badge on a “Red Bull Powertrain” = Good
Alfa Romeo slapping a badge on a Ferrari = Good
Aston Martin Red Bull TAG Heuer =
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
I should also add that Aston Martin F1 has little to do with the road car company, Racing Point team owner Larry Stroll rebranded the team when he bought a stake in Aston Martin the road car company.
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Everything I hate about F1 in 1 sentence
- Joined
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NASCAR Charters are a bargain. So far.
“The latest F1 contracts, agreed a few years ago, dictate that any newcomer has to pay a $200m anti-dilution fee, to be distributed among the existing teams to offset the drop in income of the prize fund being split between more than 10 competitors.
But as interest in F1 has increased in recent years, team bosses are now asking whether $200m is enough.
One senior insider pointed out that $200m effectively compensates the other teams for just over two years' loss of prize money, and suggested that a figure closer to $600-700m - representing more like five years - would be more appropriate.
Teams are also arguing that $200m significantly undervalues an F1 entry spot - and point to the recent establishment of a new franchise in the North American ice hockey league, the NHL, which cost a group from Seattle a $650m 'expansion fee', another name for a dilution fee.”
www.bbc.com
“The latest F1 contracts, agreed a few years ago, dictate that any newcomer has to pay a $200m anti-dilution fee, to be distributed among the existing teams to offset the drop in income of the prize fund being split between more than 10 competitors.
But as interest in F1 has increased in recent years, team bosses are now asking whether $200m is enough.
One senior insider pointed out that $200m effectively compensates the other teams for just over two years' loss of prize money, and suggested that a figure closer to $600-700m - representing more like five years - would be more appropriate.
Teams are also arguing that $200m significantly undervalues an F1 entry spot - and point to the recent establishment of a new franchise in the North American ice hockey league, the NHL, which cost a group from Seattle a $650m 'expansion fee', another name for a dilution fee.”
Formula 1: Andretti bid row reflects turbulent relationship among F1's powerbrokers
FIA president Mohammed Ben Sulayem's vocal support for the mooted Andretti team reflects a wider power struggle at the heart of F1, writes Andrew Benson.
www.bbc.com
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
This sucks.
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
The NHL expansion fee also gets you the expansion draft and regional TV rights. A fee of the same figure in F1 would get you…..?NASCAR Charters are a bargain. So far.
“The latest F1 contracts, agreed a few years ago, dictate that any newcomer has to pay a $200m anti-dilution fee, to be distributed among the existing teams to offset the drop in income of the prize fund being split between more than 10 competitors.
But as interest in F1 has increased in recent years, team bosses are now asking whether $200m is enough.
One senior insider pointed out that $200m effectively compensates the other teams for just over two years' loss of prize money, and suggested that a figure closer to $600-700m - representing more like five years - would be more appropriate.
Teams are also arguing that $200m significantly undervalues an F1 entry spot - and point to the recent establishment of a new franchise in the North American ice hockey league, the NHL, which cost a group from Seattle a $650m 'expansion fee', another name for a dilution fee.”
Formula 1: Andretti bid row reflects turbulent relationship among F1's powerbrokers
FIA president Mohammed Ben Sulayem's vocal support for the mooted Andretti team reflects a wider power struggle at the heart of F1, writes Andrew Benson.
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
This whole charade over complexity and technical involvement is just them throwing up more roadblocks, they couldn’t give a ****. They just don’t want anyone digging into their slice of the pie. Red Bull would gladly take American money from Ford to slap their name on a “Red Bull Powertrain”, and if Porsche ever actually join at some point (they’ve been teasing for over twenty years) it would be the same thing, with them just taking an Audi engine and rebranding it. The history of badging exercises in F1 is pretty well-documented.
I mean, Haas get to suck on the teat of Ferrari and Dallara, maybe they should pound sand to open up a spot then.
I mean, Haas get to suck on the teat of Ferrari and Dallara, maybe they should pound sand to open up a spot then.
West
Speedoholic
Maybe it's time to reboot this ol thingee ...
en.wikipedia.org
A1 Grand Prix - Wikipedia
donthaveanickname
Team Owner
America is experiencing an F1 boom like never before. An American team with an American manufacturer and likely an American driver would only boost the popularity of F1 in the states even more.
I can't believe they're trying everything in their power to prevent Andretti from entering.
West
Speedoholic
This is somewhat a legit concern. Smoke and Mirrors maybe by MA ...
"While there has been no confirmation from Andretti itself, teams believe that the plan is very simple; it is for the American operation to push on with a supply of Renault customer power units that will then be badged as Cadillac"
- motorsport.com
"While there has been no confirmation from Andretti itself, teams believe that the plan is very simple; it is for the American operation to push on with a supply of Renault customer power units that will then be badged as Cadillac"
- motorsport.com
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
They left the door open to build a PU down the road, and they’ve said they’ll be involved in technical capacities regardless.
Will Cadillac tie-up ease F1's resistance to Andretti's plans?
www.motorsport.com
West
Speedoholic
I read that, and that's why I believe this will happen once everyone is satisfied as to the Corporate involvement/commitment by GM, right now everyone is pissed at MA for not following proper channels and gloating through social media about his self-importance.They left the door open to build a PU down the road, and they’ve said they’ll be involved in technical capacities regardless.
Will Cadillac tie-up ease F1's resistance to Andretti's plans?
F1 is American owned after all.
FLRacingFan
Team Owner
It’s not about the technical involvement, that’s what they want you to think. It’s goalpost moving. This whole page is rife with branding and rebadging exercises. They simply do not want the pie to be divided into 11 slices and take part of their share.
Given that MBS just said last week the FIA is officially looking into opening up a process for new teams it doesn’t seem as though there has been anything formal for Andretti to follow. They’ve kept the FIA updated on their plans and that’s why they announced that last week ahead of the GM tie-up reveal. There’s no other indication of previous objective criteria that would’ve been able to be met for consideration.
And good on Andretti for doing it publicly, he’s winning the court of public opinion and showing what a farce the whole process is. DTS has made Team Principals into superstars so that but about self-importance is a bit rich.
West
Speedoholic
I doubt "public opinion" has any sway in these matters, he's just upsetting the club he's so desperate to join.
It will be interesting how this whole thing shakes out.
Another thing that comes to mind is how many American sponsors are already in F1 on other teams. I would think that they (the teams) would be afraid of losing money if they (sponsors) wanted to go to an American team in F1. Sad, it seems it comes down to money in more ways than one.
Kiante
Team Owner
He literally ticked off every box he was asked to do. Now, there are reports teams want an even bigger dilution fee from 200 to 500 or 600 million. (Literally goes against the Concorde agreement put in place about two years ago) The issue is that branding exercises are all up and down the F1 grid, but now that Andretti has the investors, (growing) infastructure, OEM, and a major sponsor to begin with. However, now teams want to say they are not serious enough to get the nod.
Hell, even Zak Brown voted against Andretti joining. *Sighs* From a business prespective, I understand, but you compete against this man in IndyCar on an annual basis. He knows what Michael brings to the table.
FIA and F1 needs to be put on notice about this non-sense. Yet, Williams is ****** floundering around and no has said a peep about them not improving or being more competitive.
West
Speedoholic
McLaren and Renault are in favour (apparently) - motorsport.com
"We know that McLaren and Alpine are supportive of what Andretti wants to do, believing the presence of another team will grow F1’s revenues enough to make up for the 10% hit everyone will take"
Don't get me wrong, I'm 100% infavour, Just speculating as to reasons, for or against ... as is everyone else. I suspect it will all be rainbows and lollypops soon enought.
Doc Austin
Back From The Dead
Make that "Ugly Americans."
West
Speedoholic
Looks like the guy read this thread and then formulated a video based on our thoughts and discussion
Doc Austin
Back From The Dead
It's a big club and you ain't in it.
Kiante
Team Owner
Y'all... I think Porsche did it:
Williams-Porsche possibly?
Williams-Porsche possibly?
donthaveanickname
Team Owner
F1 announces it will not replace Chinese GP in 2023
www.motorsport.com
Kiante
Team Owner
Gutting.F1 announces it will not replace Chinese GP in 2023
Sucks for Zhou, I know he was looking forward to racing at home.