Interest builds around possible changes to NASCAR schedule

RayinTX said:
Not sure if serious and it sounds crazy but I realize my home track is one of if not the worst on the schedule...so if the new car and another year of weather/racing on the asphalt doesn't improve the racing, why not?
Click to expand...
Texas is the track that needed the superspeedway treatment, not the Peach State Abomination.
 
Revman said:
You are trying to say a lot I think, but you never answered my question. Why dirt? Spare me the BS commentary on my relationship with this sport this time, or ignore this post altogether. Your call.
Click to expand...

Your question is comically abstract and elicits nothing to think about. I gave you some specific points to consider that are answerable, since you are lost on the subject and seeking answers. You engaged with none of them.

You wear your fandom on your sleeve, which is fine, and enjoy getting reactions to it when they are the reactions you want. I provided Toyota-specific examples to attempt to reach you where you are. It's hardly an insult to cite Toyota's growing expansion into dirt racing.

I may even agree that the current version of the Cup car shouldn't be racing on dirt. I'm skeptical, but willing to let them try at least a couple times before taking a position.
 
DewChaser988 said:
Problem is most don't have the infrastructure for Cup.

You know what happened the last time Cup raced at a new track without the infrastructure to support it? Kentucky 2011 happened
Click to expand...
There's a perfectly fine dirt track right across the street from Charlotte Motor Speedway... If it's good enough for World Of Outlaws, it's good enough for one BS gimmick Cup race a year.
 
gnomesayin said:
Your question is comically abstract and elicits nothing to think about. I gave you some specific points to consider that are answerable, since you are lost on the subject and seeking answers. You engaged with none of them.

You wear your fandom on your sleeve, which is fine, and enjoy getting reactions to it when they are the reactions you want. I provided Toyota-specific examples to attempt to reach you where you are. It's hardly an insult to cite Toyota's growing expansion into dirt racing.

I may even agree that the current version of the Cup car shouldn't be racing on dirt. I'm skeptical, but willing to let them try at least a couple times before taking a position.
Click to expand...
I am simply asking about origins of dirt racing. That is all. Spare me your BS. I am truly not interested. Have a great day.
 
DewChaser988 said:
Unlike him, I do recognize that dirt has a place. I just don't think modern Cup belongs on dirt
Click to expand...
Him understands that dirt has its place. I am just curious about how it all started and why....
 
Well, the best that I can tell, here is how dirt started. Makes sense why The King sees it as a step backwards...

"In the 1920s and 30s, dirt track racing became the dominant form of automobile racing in the United States due to the abundance of thoroughbred horse racing tracks."--axeladdict.com

So, it was easier and cheaper to race on the existing horse tracks. I also read that NASCAR left dirt because the cars became more specialized.

I do understand that dirt racing is a different discipline, but why do we need a different discipline? I won't be watching the Yankees play whiffle ball any time soon I don't think.

I see some reservation about this weekend....I am really perplexed about what NASCAR is doing here. I get last year's experiment, but don't know about this year. I will say this....I absolutely love the idea of a race on Easter night. Love it. I will also say that I am absolutely going to watch, and keep an open mind to all of this....
 
Revman said:
Well, the best that I can tell, here is how dirt started. Makes sense why The King sees it as a step backwards...

"In the 1920s and 30s, dirt track racing became the dominant form of automobile racing in the United States due to the abundance of thoroughbred horse racing tracks."--axeladdict.com

So, it was easier and cheaper to race on the existing horse tracks. I also read that NASCAR left dirt because the cars became more specialized.

I do understand that dirt racing is a different discipline, but why do we need a different discipline? I won't be watching the Yankees play whiffle ball any time soon I don't think.

I see some reservation about this weekend....I am really perplexed about what NASCAR is doing here. I get last year's experiment, but don't know about this year. I will say this....I absolutely love the idea of a race on Easter night. Love it. I will also say that I am absolutely going to watch, and keep an open mind to all of this....
Click to expand...
Good deal, terribly long time to get to that point, but yeah.
 
Revman said:
I am simply asking about origins of dirt racing. That is all. Spare me your BS. I am truly not interested. Have a great day.
Click to expand...

You're avoiding the relevant topic of why Toyota is not just involved in dirt track racing, but increasing its support for it every year. All while posting tedious encyclopedia snippets.

I don't need your instruction, and it's laughable that you think you're leading the discussion.
 
gnomesayin said:
You're avoiding the relevant topic of why Toyota is not just involved in dirt track racing, but increasing its support for it every year. All while posting tedious encyclopedia snippets.

I don't need your instruction, and it's laughable that you think you're leading the discussion.
Click to expand...
reading this.... Im confused. Why is Toyota involved in dirt racing and why is the support increasing? I hypothesize that dirt track racing is actually becoming a really popular form of racing and while considered a niche sport it could have sizeable fan support to grow out of that?
 
Snappy D said:
reading this.... Im confused. Why is Toyota involved in dirt racing and why is the support increasing? I hypothesize that dirt track racing is actually becoming a really popular form of racing and while considered a niche sport it could have sizeable fan support to grow out of that?
Click to expand...

This is true, but it is also evident that Toyota views dirt racing as a valuable development tool, both in terms of their technology and bringing drivers through their ladder.

If @Revman wants to know "why do we need a different discipline", maybe he should ask David Wilson why a significant part of the TRD budget is being used for dirt midget and sprint car racing the next time he calls a meeting over there.
 
Revman said:
I am really perplexed about what NASCAR is doing here.
Click to expand...
This is SMI's idea, not NASCAR's. What they're doing is trying to make more money than what they make with the paved spring race.

Incidentally, almost any question about professional or televised sports that begins, "Why...?" can be correctly answered with "Because money."
 
Last edited:
gnomesayin said:
This is true, but it is also evident that Toyota views dirt racing as a valuable development tool, both in terms of their technology and bringing drivers through their ladder.

If @Revman wants to know "why do we need a different discipline", maybe he should ask David Wilson why a significant part of the TRD budget is being used for dirt midget and sprint car racing the next time he calls a meeting over there.
Click to expand...
Ah got ya. tying it to driver development.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
This is SMI's idea, not NASCAR's. What they're doing is trying to make more money than what they make with the paved spring race.

Incidentally, almost any question about professional or televised sports that begins, "Why...?" can be correctly answered with "Because money."
Click to expand...
Any form of sport on TV or professional is a business. I love your post here....
 
Snappy D said:
Any form of sport on TV or professional is a business. I love your post here....
Click to expand...
I used the phrase "professional or televised" because that includes college football and basketbell. There are some naïve viewers who buy into that 'amateur' / 'student athlete' / 'love of the game' bull. The suits in Indianapolis have their facial muscles Botox'ed to get that out with a straight face.
 
Looking through the Cup schedule, I just don't understand the logic behind a lot of these dates/times, specifically in April. Is there a reason why we're running short tracks back-to-back-to-back? Is there a reason why we're running night races in early/mid April in Virginia/Tennessee? Is there a reason why Bristol is Sunday night instead of Saturday night?

I feel like the majority of night races should occur between Memorial Day and Labor Day, but after the World 600, we don't run at night again until August 27th.
 
Revman said:
I am simply asking about origins of dirt racing. That is all. Spare me your BS. I am truly not interested. Have a great day.
Click to expand...
The "history of dirt racing"?
That's where racing started. There were very few paved roads anywhere in the country, let alone racing venues. It's really as simple as that.
Do you have a more specific question?
 
2 Sweet said:
Is there a reason why Bristol is Sunday night instead of Saturday night?
Click to expand...

Saturday night is a proven loser in terms of TV viewership. Essentially any race that occurs on Saturday night would attract 10-25% higher viewership if held on Sunday afternoon, which is why there has been a reduction in Saturday night races in recent years. My guess is that Fox and NASCAR want to test Sunday night. It's a night race because it is now understood that the dirt surface will hold up better in the evening (this is common knowledge in dirt racing, and yes, they should have known this last year).

Anyway, it likely all comes down to what Fox prefers more than any other factor.
 
Dr_B_UNC said:
There's a perfectly fine dirt track right across the street from Charlotte Motor Speedway... If it's good enough for World Of Outlaws, it's good enough for one BS gimmick Cup race a year.
Click to expand...
That place only holds 10-12k.
 
I wouldnt hate a sprinkle of a Prime Time Sunday Night race on the schedule. For me personally, It'd be a nice segway into the work week...curled up in bed watching a race. I'd bet Sunday Night Racing will be investigated when the race lengths are inevitably trimmed... you might be able to do a 300 mile race if it starts at 7pm Eastern time and end at a decent time for viewers. Sunday Night Football on NBC usually ends between 10-1030pm my time ( CST)
 
NASCAR has been trying to " improve " their product since Winston stepped away.
It seemed to work fine for all those years, and then the illusion of upgrading the product was pitched to the fans. Almost 20 years of Gimmickry later , and the outcome is still being " improved"...
 
MRM said:
That place only holds 10-12k.
Click to expand...
And? If NASCAR wants to set us back 40 years, embrace it. All the money is in TV anyways... Besides, as Nashville showed us last year, 40k sold out looks way better than 60k sprinkled across 120k capacity.
 
Dr_B_UNC said:
And? If NASCAR wants to set us back 40 years, embrace it. All the money is in TV anyways... Besides, as Nashville showed us last year, 40k sold out looks way better than 60k sprinkled across 120k capacity.
Click to expand...
They might be setting your "us" back 40 years lol.
 
MRM said:
That place only holds 10-12k.
Click to expand...
I thought about that too. They could easily double the capacity and I wonder how much more, or less that would cost than bringing in and removing the dirt each year at Bristol. The speedway says it seats 14,000, so maybe they could expand to 30,000? I am pretty sure the WOO Finals has sold out a number of times so they could use some of the extra seating for that event too.
 
DIDIT said:
I wonder how much more, or less that would cost than bringing in and removing the dirt each year at Bristol.
Click to expand...
SMI is doing it wrong. They should handle it like hockey rink / basketball court. Leave the dirt in place and cover it with hardwood planks. Waxing the snot out of that will guarantee a return to a one-groove smash-em-up.
 
DIDIT said:
I thought about that too. They could easily double the capacity and I wonder how much more, or less that would cost than bringing in and removing the dirt each year at Bristol. The speedway says it seats 14,000, so maybe they could expand to 30,000? I am pretty sure the WOO Finals has sold out a number of times so they could use some of the extra seating for that event too.
Click to expand...
Problem is the dirt track may have no room to expand
 
gnomesayin said:
You're avoiding the relevant topic of why Toyota is not just involved in dirt track racing, but increasing its support for it every year. All while posting tedious encyclopedia snippets.

I don't need your instruction, and it's laughable that you think you're leading the discussion.
Click to expand...
I know why Toyota is in dirt racing--because that is a source of talent and WE have the Toyota Driver Development Program aka TD2 if you are keeping score. WE go where the talent is. I asked about the history of dirt racing in an attempt to understand why it is a part of our sport now, and you chose to take the opportunity go off on my passion for Toyota and the sport. Kindly, knock it off.
 
gnomesayin said:
This is true, but it is also evident that Toyota views dirt racing as a valuable development tool, both in terms of their technology and bringing drivers through their ladder.

If @Revman wants to know "why do we need a different discipline", maybe he should ask David Wilson why a significant part of the TRD budget is being used for dirt midget and sprint car racing the next time he calls a meeting over there.
Click to expand...
Dirt at the Cup level has nothing to do with developing drivers. They have developed by then. I was asking about the history of dirt, and why it should be considered part of our sport now. Stuff the attitude about my Toyota passion and demeaning tone. I asked a freaking question. Again, kindly knock it off.
 
DIDIT said:
Interesting, why do we need road courses? Isn't short track racing a different discipline that super speedways?
What do you consider the right discipline for NASCAR?
Click to expand...
Fair point. However, the history of dirt is about it being cheap as they used horse tracks. Perhaps, The King considers this a step backwards because cheap is no longer part of the racing equation. The sport has money. No need to shortcut it?

IMO....stock car racing is about an attempt at relevancy to the road car. We don't driver on dirt anymore. I am not sure that it is the right discipline for NASCAR....even though it once may have been....
 
Last edited:
Revman said:
I know why Toyota is in dirt racing--because that is a source of talent and WE have the Toyota Driver Development Program aka TD2 if you are keeping score. WE go where the talent is. I asked about the history of dirt racing in an attempt to understand why it is a part of our sport now, and you chose to take the opportunity go off on my passion for Toyota and the sport. Kindly, knock it off.
Click to expand...

Hey, that's a good answer. Honestly, I don't believe a cursory history lesson is going to provide you with any answers on that front.

It's not that dirt racing at the Cup level is about driver development. You're correct about that. It's that if you seek to understand why dirt racing is a source and accelerator of exceptional talent, you can learn more about its virtues, which could provide some of those "Why?" answers. I pointed out that Toyota has made it a particular focus because that is a fact that would ostensibly interest a Toyota fan.

I think we both engaged in the demeaning tone. I was ribbing at first, then it accelerated. Glad to stop when provided a genuine response.
 
Last edited:
Revman said:
Dirt at the Cup level has nothing to do with developing drivers. They have developed by then. I was asking about the history of dirt, and why it should be considered part of our sport now. Stuff the attitude about my Toyota passion and demeaning tone. I asked a freaking question. Again, kindly knock it off.
Click to expand...
Oh B.S.. Larson, Bell, Briscoe, Friesen, Dillion, Creed Buescher and many more would all have something to say about that. It helped get them where they are. Many of them continue to race Midgets, and mini sprints and more to this day to keep sharp
 
gnomesayin said:
Hey, that's a good answer. Honestly, I don't believe a cursory history lesson is going to provide you with any answers on that front.

It's not that dirt racing at the Cup level is about driver development. You're correct about that. It's that if you seek to understand why dirt racing is a source and accelerator of talent, you can learn more about its virtues, which could provide some of those "Why?" answers.

I think we both engaged in the demeaning tone. I was ribbing at first, then it accelerated. Glad to stop when provided a genuine response.
Click to expand...
Fair enough. I totally get dirt as a source of driver development as it requires car control, etc....and that it is a cheaper proposition to run a dirt track (I think?). Sounds like a great starting point for potential talent....but should it be at the top level? I don't think so. It just doesn't fit with where the sport is IMO. In fairness, I do like the nuances of reading the track....drying, etc...and I think the track grooming is fascinating. I haven't bailed on this discipline....and I am doing my best to prepare myself to appreciate what I see Sunday.
 
StandOnIt said:
Oh B.S.. Larson, Bell, Briscoe, Friesen, Dillion, Creed Buescher and many more would all have something to say about that. It helped get them where they are. Many of them continue to race Midgets, and mini sprints and more to this day to keep sharp
Click to expand...
Watch the freaking thread. Drivers have developed by that point. I appreciate what dirt does for a driver working his/her way up....I just don't think it has a place at the top level.
 
Revman said:
Watch the freaking thread. Drivers have developed by that point. I appreciate what dirt does for a driver working his/her way up....I just don't think it has a place at the top level.
Click to expand...
Drivers continue to develop, or they don't stay around...Use your brain
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom