Is the 47 as bad as we think?

Bobby Labonte certainly isn't the first former champion to hang around too long. Anybody remember Richard Petty's last few years? Or Darrell Waltrip struggling to make races in the #66 K-Mart car? Or Bill Elliott making laps with the Wood Brothers? Or Dale Jarrett at MWR? Just to name a few.

Remember Darrell in the DEI 1 car? Things like that make me think that maybe it is more the equipment these older champions end up in. Do I think Bobby is a championship caliber driver anymore? No, but I think given the right chance he can get it done and get good finishes. When Bobby was in the 51 at the last Michigan race he was actually practicing in the top 20. A loose track ended up taking him out.
 
Remember Darrell in the DEI 1 car? Things like that make me think that maybe it is more the equipment these older champions end up in. Do I think Bobby is a championship caliber driver anymore? No, but I think given the right chance he can get it done and get good finishes. When Bobby was in the 51 at the last Michigan race he was actually practicing in the top 20. A loose track ended up taking him out.
Yeah, I remember DW subbing for Steve Park, I remember he had some decent runs in that car. I would have loved to see Bobby Labonte get a similar shot subbing for Tony Stewart. It'd be interesting to see if he could still get it done in good equipment.
 
Yeah, I remember DW subbing for Steve Park, I remember he had some decent runs in that car. I would have loved to see Bobby Labonte get a similar shot subbing for Tony Stewart. It'd be interesting to see if he could still get it done in good equipment.

I agree so so much.
 
Welcome Meyhem
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he was not a great driver, he was a ok driver that won a championship because he drove for JGR.
I'd say he was better than ok, to put it in perspective who are the great drivers right now? Bobby has won 20+ races, as well as Cup, Busch and Iroc titles, the only drivers with more on their resume are Johnson, Gordon, Stewart. Matt Kenseth & Kurt Busch are great as well, is Bobby not on par with these two? The resume says he is. He's also accomplished more than Newman, Harvick, Kahne, Hamlin, Biffle, Burton & Edwards, guys who have driven top notch equipment their whole careers.

Also, let's not forget the guys he beat for that championship Dale Sr, Jarrett, Gordon, Stewart, Wallace, Elliot etc, so it was no fluke.

Should he retire? Probably. I'd like to see what he could do at this point in quality equipment, but I don't expect that will happen. So I'm hoping he drives the Truck Series next yr, shouldn't be a problem getting a top ride there. Maybe he could be the first driver to win the championship in all 3 of Nascar's top series.
 
I'd say he was better than ok, to put it in perspective who are the great drivers right now? Bobby has won 20+ races, as well as Cup, Busch and Iroc titles, the only drivers with more on their resume are Johnson, Gordon, Stewart. Matt Kenseth & Kurt Busch are great as well, is Bobby not on par with these two? The resume says he is. He's also accomplished more than Newman, Harvick, Kahne, Hamlin, Biffle, Burton & Edwards, guys who have driven top notch equipment their whole careers.

Also, let's not forget the guys he beat for that championship Dale Sr, Jarrett, Gordon, Stewart, Wallace, Elliot etc, so it was no fluke.

Should he retire? Probably. I'd like to see what he could do at this point in quality equipment, but I don't expect that will happen. So I'm hoping he drives the Truck Series next yr, shouldn't be a problem getting a top ride there. Maybe he could be the first driver to win the championship in all 3 of Nascar's top series.


I wouldn't oppose this idea. I'd just love to see him in victory lane again.
 
The 47 is as bad as we think.

I am the resident Bobby Labonte fan here in the forum. I have watched this team with some sick twisted optimism for the past 2 seasons and they are an absolute joke. 3 different car chiefs in 2 seasons. Look at Sonoma this year, they roll the car after the National Anthem to reveal it leaking fluid. It's an embarrassment.

Anyone who thinks Bobby was just an ok driver is out of their mind. As stated earlier he has more on his resume then 2/3 of the field we see weekly. He was more than an ok driver. For a stretch he was dominant. Is he just ok now? ,ost likely, but I would like to see one more shot at a good ride to see if he could drive up front.

It's funny to me that I am a Labonte fan because his driving style is nothing like what I actually like. I like Kyle's aggressive nature, but something about Bobby caught my attention a long time ago. He is just a decent guy who doesn't lean on guys, who never has a bad word to say about the other drivers, he just showed up and did his job.
 
The 47 is as bad as we think.

I am the resident Bobby Labonte fan here in the forum. I have watched this team with some sick twisted optimism for the past 2 seasons and they are an absolute joke. 3 different car chiefs in 2 seasons. Look at Sonoma this year, they roll the car after the National Anthem to reveal it leaking fluid. It's an embarrassment.

Anyone who thinks Bobby was just an ok driver is out of their mind. As stated earlier he has more on his resume then 2/3 of the field we see weekly. He was more than an ok driver. For a stretch he was dominant. Is he just ok now? ,ost likely, but I would like to see one more shot at a good ride to see if he could drive up front.

It's funny to me that I am a Labonte fan because his driving style is nothing like what I actually like. I like Kyle's aggressive nature, but something about Bobby caught my attention a long time ago. He is just a decent guy who doesn't lean on guys, who never has a bad word to say about the other drivers, he just showed up and did his job.

Good post sir . Don't give up on your driver.
 
Do we have to choose between the car being mediocre or the driver? I think both hit their peak a while back, although Bobby's was much higher and hasn't he fallen as far.
 
The 47 is as bad as we think.

I am the resident Bobby Labonte fan here in the forum. I have watched this team with some sick twisted optimism for the past 2 seasons and they are an absolute joke. 3 different car chiefs in 2 seasons. Look at Sonoma this year, they roll the car after the National Anthem to reveal it leaking fluid. It's an embarrassment.

Anyone who thinks Bobby was just an ok driver is out of their mind. As stated earlier he has more on his resume then 2/3 of the field we see weekly. He was more than an ok driver. For a stretch he was dominant. Is he just ok now? ,ost likely, but I would like to see one more shot at a good ride to see if he could drive up front.

It's funny to me that I am a Labonte fan because his driving style is nothing like what I actually like. I like Kyle's aggressive nature, but something about Bobby caught my attention a long time ago. He is just a decent guy who doesn't lean on guys, who never has a bad word to say about the other drivers, he just showed up and did his job.
His resume is better than 80-85% of the field. And to hear Tad say he thinks they should be a top 10 car every week is ridiculous, they're the 7th best Toyota car for cripes sake.
 
The 47 is as bad as we think.

I am the resident Bobby Labonte fan here in the forum. I have watched this team with some sick twisted optimism for the past 2 seasons and they are an absolute joke. 3 different car chiefs in 2 seasons. Look at Sonoma this year, they roll the car after the National Anthem to reveal it leaking fluid. It's an embarrassment.

Anyone who thinks Bobby was just an ok driver is out of their mind. As stated earlier he has more on his resume then 2/3 of the field we see weekly. He was more than an ok driver. For a stretch he was dominant. Is he just ok now? ,ost likely, but I would like to see one more shot at a good ride to see if he could drive up front.

It's funny to me that I am a Labonte fan because his driving style is nothing like what I actually like. I like Kyle's aggressive nature, but something about Bobby caught my attention a long time ago. He is just a decent guy who doesn't lean on guys, who never has a bad word to say about the other drivers, he just showed up and did his job.


I grew up a huge bobby fan both being from Corpus and all. Sadly I don't think Bobby's driving style fits today's cars. He was great at taking care of the car and tires. Now their is a dreaded aero push and tires are hard as a rock. Even in a top tier ride he may not perform as well as some of these younger guys who don't lift as much.
 
I disagree with you all.

While the car is not all mighty and powerful other drivers have proven that the car is capable of running in the top ten so I am going to still say Bobby is the one who cant keep up with the car.

He's the only driver who can spin multiple times in a single race. If he was such a good driver (which he was earlier in his career) he could at least handle a poor handling car. Or at least not make it spin more than once.
 
I disagree with you all.

While the car is not all mighty and powerful other drivers have proven that the car is capable of running in the top ten so I am going to still say Bobby is the one who cant keep up with the car.

He's the only driver who can spin multiple times in a single race. If he was such a good driver (which he was earlier in his career) he could at least handle a poor handling car. Or at least not make it spin more than once.


This hasn't been the case all year on ovals.
 
This hasn't been the case all year on ovals.

I dont necessarily mean just this year.

They did ok with Marcos in it.

If someone like Marcos who is not as experienced as Bobby is can run in the top 10 week in and week out I dont see why Bobby can at least run halfway decent.

I think some of you feel like they need to make up excuses for Bobby for some reason. Yeah he's a veteran and a champion but it doesn't change the fact he has fallen off a ton and that it may be him and not so much the car.
 
When Marcos was in the car, the team had a better engine package.. alliance with MWR I think.

I'll say it, Bobby is done but the car is bad.
 
NASCAR has turned into a sport about money, I mean all you have to do is look at the race results, always the same 10-15 cars at the back because of the equipment they get. It's not as good as teams like Hendrick, JGR, MWR, Roush and so on. Of course then there is drivers that are just plain bad (Patrick)are past there prime (Labonte) or are just plain unlucky/held back by there equipment (AJ). So yes, Labonte is bad because he is past his prime just like many others because once you get to the top, there no where to go but stay where you are.
 
NASCAR has turned into a sport about money, I mean all you have to do is look at the race results, always the same 10-15 cars at the back because of the equipment they get. It's not as good as teams like Hendrick, JGR, MWR, Roush and so on. Of course then there is drivers that are just plain bad (Patrick)are past there prime (Labonte) or are just plain unlucky/held back by there equipment (AJ). So yes, Labonte is bad because he is past his prime just like many others because once you get to the top, there no where to go but stay where you are.


I disargee in that Nascar has turned into a sport about money, It's always been that way.. At least the 20 years plus I've been watching Nascar. Even before that, guys would cut corners, cheat just to get ahead and alot of that was because they had the money to do that. Their have always been haves and half nots in the sport. I remember Rick Mast or Dave Marcis just riding around while Dale dominated the sport with a few others.
 
I dont necessarily mean just this year.

They did ok with Marcos in it.

If someone like Marcos who is not as experienced as Bobby is can run in the top 10 week in and week out I dont see why Bobby can at least run halfway decent.

I think some of you feel like they need to make up excuses for Bobby for some reason. Yeah he's a veteran and a champion but it doesn't change the fact he has fallen off a ton and that it may be him and not so much the car.
When did Marcos run in the top 10 wk in wk out when he was in the 47?? That never happened period. They were good on road courses, Ambrose is a lot better road racer than Bobby no question, but they were not a top 10 team. How did AJ do on the oval tracks he ran for JTG? He finished 19th and 22nd. Bobby finished 23rd in points last yr so AJ's results on those tracks are typical of what JTG can do.

I just don't see that it's all the driver, some of it is, but this is not a top 20 team, certainly not a single car op running their own chassis' and Triad motors.
 
When did Marcos run in the top 10 wk in wk out when he was in the 47?? That never happened period. They were good on road courses, Ambrose is a lot better road racer than Bobby no question, but they were not a top 10 team. How did AJ do on the oval tracks he ran for JTG? He finished 19th and 22nd. Bobby finished 23rd in points last yr so AJ's results on those tracks are typical of what JTG can do.

I just don't see that it's all the driver, some of it is, but this is not a top 20 team, certainly not a single car op running their own chassis' and Triad motors.

Slow buddy, relax.

No one is saying this team is a top 10 team in NASCAR. It isn't.

http://racing-reference.info/rquery?id=ambroma01&trk=t10&series=W

While maybe not week in and week out he did finish with top 5s and 10s while running with the 47 car.
 
Like I said, pretty sure it wasn't with Tirad motors lol.

That's fine but the times AJ has gotten into that car he top 10 once and top 20 the others. That's alot more than Bobby has done in the past few years. lol
 
I'm not trying to defend Bobby but that team is not up to par. IF Aj got the ride full time next year, He better make sure they get a better engine package or he'll do only slightly better then ole Bobby.
 
Slow buddy, relax.

No one is saying this team is a top 10 team in NASCAR. It isn't.

http://racing-reference.info/rquery?id=ambroma01&trk=t10&series=W

While maybe not week in and week out he did finish with top 5s and 10s while running with the 47 car.
You said wk in wk out, I was merely quoting you. Perhaps you should slow and relax before posting inaccurate information. Thanks.

What you may not realize is that the alliance w/ MWR was stronger when Ambrose was there, as MWR was looking to expand the team the resources available to JTG was reduced, which is why JTG bailed. It was cheaper for JTG to rent space at the MWR shop, rent equipment and benefit from the shared info of a multi car team. Why do you believe they walked away from MWR, a team that routinely has it's cars in the top 10? If they felt they were getting what they paid for i.e. equal equipment, then the obvious conclusion would be to remove the driver, not completely cut ties.

This also explains why they are currently in talks w/ RCR about joining up w/ them, a team that isn't as good as MWR.

"I don't see why we can't go back into our race shop and be better than we are now, because I don't think we can do any worse, to be honest with you."

--BRAD DAUGHERTY
 
You said wk in wk out, I was merely quoting you. Perhaps you should slow and relax before posting inaccurate information. Thanks.

What you may not realize is that the alliance w/ MWR was stronger when Ambrose was there, as MWR was looking to expand the team the resources available to JTG was reduced, which is why JTG bailed. It was cheaper for JTG to rent space at the MWR shop, rent equipment and benefit from the shared info of a multi car team. Why do you believe they walked away from MWR, a team that routinely has it's cars in the top 10? If they felt they were getting what they paid for i.e. equal equipment, then the obvious conclusion would be to remove the driver, not completely cut ties.

This also explains why they are currently in talks w/ RCR about joining up w/ them, a team that isn't as good as MWR.

"I don't see why we can't go back into our race shop and be better than we are now, because I don't think we can do any worse, to be honest with you."

--BRAD DAUGHERTY
Some folks on this forum seem to think that anyone who doesn't make the chase can't drive or is in crappy equipment . Fact is there is only room for twelve cars in the chase and it doesn't matter how good the rest are , they can't get in .There always have been mid pack cars and back markers in the field , and as long as they have 43 car fields , there always will be .Thank heavens for teams like JTG , RPM ,Front Row , Phoenix and Furniture Row , they keep trying and never give up , like the folks on the forum seem to think they should.
 
Some folks on this forum seem to think that anyone who doesn't make the chase can't drive or is in crappy equipment . Fact is there is only room for twelve cars in the chase and it doesn't matter how good the rest are , they can't get in .There always have been mid pack cars and back markers in the field , and as long as they have 43 car fields , there always will be .Thank heavens for teams like JTG , RPM ,Front Row , Phoenix and Furniture Row , they keep trying and never give up , like the folks on the forum seem to think they should.
Furniture Row isnt mid pack anymore ;)
 
I grew up a huge bobby fan both being from Corpus and all. Sadly I don't think Bobby's driving style fits today's cars. He was great at taking care of the car and tires. Now their is a dreaded aero push and tires are hard as a rock. Even in a top tier ride he may not perform as well as some of these younger guys who don't lift as much.

I would lean towards agreeing with you. Todays car can nearly have the doors beaten off of it and still be competitive. That makes me think that his tempered driving style is no longer effective. Still would like to see if he could compete on a better team.
 
How about that AJ guy eh? 14th at Atlanta.

So the driver does make a difference after all.
 
His resume is better than 80-85% of the field. And to hear Tad say he thinks they should be a top 10 car every week is ridiculous, they're the 7th best Toyota car for cripes sake.

Yep, they are barely even half a step above the BK Racing cars. That's pretty sad. Tad Geschickter is a joke, so is Daugherty.

Look, Bobby isn't the driver he once was, but that team is garbage no matter how you look at it. I think Bobby could still be a Chase contender if he raced for Hendrick or Gibbs, although the point is moot because you could say that about a lot of drivers.

How about that AJ guy eh? 14th at Atlanta.

So the driver does make a difference after all.

So what? Bobby managed a couple top tens last year. It doesn't matter who you put in the seat of that car, they will never be competitive under Triad.
 
Thank heavens for teams like JTG , RPM ,Front Row , Phoenix and Furniture Row , they keep trying and never give up , like the folks on the forum seem to think they should.

I couldn't agree more. I'm a lifelong Gordon/Hendrick fan, but everyone loves the underdogs. It was awesome seeing Bayne win at Daytona, Regan Smith at Darlington, David Ragan earlier this year, etc. I still have hope for RPM and Front Row. I've always liked Finch/Phoenix and I hope Harry Scott will make that team competitive. The sport needs these smaller underfunded teams; I just wish they had more of a chance to be consistently competitive.
 
So what? Bobby managed a couple top tens last year. It doesn't matter who you put in the seat of that car, they will never be competitive under Triad.

Point is at least AJ doesn't spin it 3 times a race and actually gets decent finishes.
 
How is being in the top 15 all night not competitive? it's not like AJ lucked into the finish. Yes, Triad motors blow.. the owners think too highly of themselves but AJ will overdrive the car and get the most out of it.. period. He may wreck, he'll have awful finishes but Bobby wasn't going to give the owners what they want out of it...

Whether they get a better engine package or not, I think it's best that all parties involved go in a different direction. Bitter Bobby fans at least got a champion driver. I like AJ but I doubt he ever achieves that.
 
I'm a big Bobby L fan.

I have the utmost respect for him as a racer and at least as much for him being a gentleman.

I've been a fan a long while
 
I don't have any problem with Labonte, I understand where he is at, I drove my big truck until I couldn't.
 
The 47 is as bad as we think.

I am the resident Bobby Labonte fan here in the forum. I have watched this team with some sick twisted optimism for the past 2 seasons and they are an absolute joke. 3 different car chiefs in 2 seasons. Look at Sonoma this year, they roll the car after the National Anthem to reveal it leaking fluid. It's an embarrassment.

Anyone who thinks Bobby was just an ok driver is out of their mind. As stated earlier he has more on his resume then 2/3 of the field we see weekly. He was more than an ok driver. For a stretch he was dominant. Is he just ok now? ,ost likely, but I would like to see one more shot at a good ride to see if he could drive up front.

It's funny to me that I am a Labonte fan because his driving style is nothing like what I actually like. I like Kyle's aggressive nature, but something about Bobby caught my attention a long time ago. He is just a decent guy who doesn't lean on guys, who never has a bad word to say about the other drivers, he just showed up and did his job.
Pretty much agree with all of this, but for one thing.....who did he piss off along the way to not get quality rides anymore? Seems since he left JGR, it was all downhill, why?
 
Pretty much agree with all of this, but for one thing.....who did he piss off along the way to not get quality rides anymore? Seems since he left JGR, it was all downhill, why?
He started to fall off since his last days at JGR and everyone saw that. He really shouldn't be driving in Cup anymore. I understand everyone loves him, but that shouldn't skew the fact that he simply isn't competitive anymore. Will be interesting to see what AJ does with the same equipment....
 
Point is at least AJ doesn't spin it 3 times a race and actually gets decent finishes.
He spun out at Michigan I remember that, but where else? He spun out a few times this year that's true, but to be fair a guy like Jimmie Johnson has spun out 3 times in the last couple races! Michigan practice, Michigan race, Atlanta race. Your point was again??

Oh and spinning out on his bicycle doesn't count.:biggrin:
 
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Pretty much agree with all of this, but for one thing.....who did he piss off along the way to not get quality rides anymore? Seems since he left JGR, it was all downhill, why?
Well I know he rejected Ganassi on two separate occasions, the first time he chose the 43 car over the 41 and the second time was even worse (if you can believe that) Bobby said he was in his car on his way to sign a contract w/ EGR to drive the 1 car, but then Hall of Fame called and offered the fully sponsored 96 car, the 1 car was not fully sponsored.

He's made bad choices and I think these yrs of driving subpar equipment has taken him out of the discussion for any quality rides. Either that or owners think he's just resting on his laurels trying to collect a paycheck.

As far as the JGR thing let's not forget that he had the 2004 season, a virtual lock for a chase berth stolen from him. Bobby was 6th in points coming off a stretch of 7 top tens and 4 top 5's in 11 races. When JD Gibbs decided he had had enough of Fatback McSwain and fired him w/ 8 races to go before the chase. He was replaced w/ Brandon Thomas. Who? Exactly! They recorded 0 top tens in those 8 races and missed the chase I'm thinking Bobby and JD's relationship soured after that.
 
Don't get me wrong I still think the 47 team is terrible and the owners thinking that they should be better is a total joke.

However AJ did have a solid finish and ran well all night at Atlanta. Every time he's in their car the performance seems to be better, so I think there's definitely something to be said for that. I'll be curious to see what a full season of AJ will do for that team.
 
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