Mark Martin won the 2007 Daytona 500

This race summed up Mark Martin. Late in the race Darrell Waltrip said "Mark Martin is driving the race of his life". Someone else took home the trophy.
 
Joe Weatherly won the September '63 race in Moyock. NASCAR ruled when he passed Jarrett all he did was get back on the lead lap. He was already on the lead lap. NASCAR gave the race to the 11. Damn near had a riot in the parking lot after the race.
 
Well.... as long as we are rehashing how Mark got screwed out of the '90 Championship.... (and I truely believe he was.... because Nascar and the car owners had a hard-on for Jack Roush when he tried to enter Cup) .... when Mark was docked those 46 points for having the carb spacer bolted on instead of welded, the whole garage was polled to see if they thought it was an advantage.... not a single person said yes except Richard ''Crying towel'' Childress and Kirk Shelmerdine.... Fast forward to the Fall Charlotte race........ Earnhardt left the pits with no lugnuts on both left side wheels..... they fell off in turn 1..... Nascar allowed Chocolate Myers and another pit guy take 2 tires.... a 4 way lug wrench and a jack down there when the car should have been loaded on a rollback..... The rules said no work to be done on the car except in the pits or in the garage.... (I guess the rules didn't pertain to Big E and Childress)... What a flagrant ''in your face'' move. Earnhardt finished 25th..... running at the end.... scored 88 points ....... when he should have been in the garage...... I can't tell you what lap this happened on..... I wish I could...... I know Jimmy Spencer finished 41st and scored 40 points...... that's a 48 point difference and Mark lost the Championship by 26....... No matter how many years have passed..... there is no statute of limitations on getting screwed over...... even after 26 years this crap still gravels the hell outta' me....... Always will...... Mark may have moved on and let it go..... but..... us fans who took it so serious never will.......



That's my take on it.......
 
kymartin6 said:
Well.... as long as we are rehashing how Mark got screwed out of the '90 Championship.... (and I truely believe he was.... because Nascar and the car owners had a hard-on for Jack Roush when he tried to enter Cup) .... when Mark was docked those 46 points for having the carb spacer bolted on instead of welded, the whole garage was polled to see if they thought it was an advantage.... not a single person said yes except Richard ''Crying towel'' Childress and Kirk Shelmerdine.... Fast forward to the Fall Charlotte race........ Earnhardt left the pits with no lugnuts on both left side wheels..... they fell off in turn 1..... Nascar allowed Chocolate Myers and another pit guy take 2 tires.... a 4 way lug wrench and a jack down there when the car should have been loaded on a rollback..... The rules said no work to be done on the car except in the pits or in the garage.... (I guess the rules didn't pertain to Big E and Childress)... What a flagrant ''in your face'' move. Earnhardt finished 25th..... running at the end.... scored 88 points ....... when he should have been in the garage...... I can't tell you what lap this happened on..... I wish I could...... I know Jimmy Spencer finished 41st and scored 40 points...... that's a 48 point difference and Mark lost the Championship by 26....... No matter how many years have passed..... there is no statute of limitations on getting screwed over...... even after 26 years this crap still gravels the hell outta' me....... Always will...... Mark may have moved on and let it go..... but..... us fans who took it so serious never will.......



That's my take on it.......
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well he didn't make it to turn one the wheels came off at the end of pit road. nascar was caught off guard with someone leaving the pits to work on a car. even if the 3 car would have been on a roll back he still would of been able to put the tires back on and get back in the race and gain points.
 
BOWTIE GUY said:
well he didn't make it to turn one the wheels came off at the end of pit road. nascar was caught off guard with someone leaving the pits to work on a car. even if the 3 car would have been on a roll back he still would of been able to put the tires back on and get back in the race and gain points.
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Pulling it on a rollback with no tires would have destroyed the front suspension........


why would Nascar be caught so ''off gaurd'' to have not told them to get their butts off the racing surface immediately and report to the trailer? It was a rule that was not enforced because of it being Earnhardt and Childress.....
 
And they did it specifically to screw Martin.

I seen it! I seen it!
 
kymartin6 said:
Well.... as long as we are rehashing how Mark got screwed out of the '90 Championship.... (and I truely believe he was.... because Nascar and the car owners had a hard-on for Jack Roush when he tried to enter Cup) .... when Mark was docked those 46 points for having the carb spacer bolted on instead of welded, the whole garage was polled to see if they thought it was an advantage.... not a single person said yes except Richard ''Crying towel'' Childress and Kirk Shelmerdine.... Fast forward to the Fall Charlotte race........ Earnhardt left the pits with no lugnuts on both left side wheels..... they fell off in turn 1..... Nascar allowed Chocolate Myers and another pit guy take 2 tires.... a 4 way lug wrench and a jack down there when the car should have been loaded on a rollback..... The rules said no work to be done on the car except in the pits or in the garage.... (I guess the rules didn't pertain to Big E and Childress)... What a flagrant ''in your face'' move. Earnhardt finished 25th..... running at the end.... scored 88 points ....... when he should have been in the garage...... I can't tell you what lap this happened on..... I wish I could...... I know Jimmy Spencer finished 41st and scored 40 points...... that's a 48 point difference and Mark lost the Championship by 26....... No matter how many years have passed..... there is no statute of limitations on getting screwed over...... even after 26 years this crap still gravels the hell outta' me....... Always will...... Mark may have moved on and let it go..... but..... us fans who took it so serious never will.......



That's my take on it.......
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I'm with you pretty much. BUT, when I think about it wouldn't NASCAR have had someone put tires on it anyway to make it easier to move? And since tires were on it, it would have then been raceable? I agree there should have been SOME kind of penalty but I doubt they would have just hooked the winch line to it and drug it up on the rollback when all they would have had to do it put a couple tires on it and not destroyed the car and possibly the rollback bed?

But I agree it was BS they got to saunter down there, put tires on it, and continue on like nothing happened. RCR got blessed like that in the day.
 
This thread makes me sooo sad! Thank heavens I wear a bowtie and know the difference between a bolt and a weld.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
Please, don't bring that back too. ;)

I think that falls under the 'Mark Martin won the 1990 Championship Thread'.
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It's too late! Those Blue Ovalers already did it! You know the story. 46pts., everybody hated the poor cat in the hat, blah, blah, blah. It makes my eyes hurt just reading it!;)
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
You're right.

Instead of a Harley J. Earl and a Sprint Cup Trophy, he should have two Sprint Cup Trophies (2010 and 2015).
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I'll bite...why would Kev be a cup champ in '10? 48 was clearly best when it counted.
 
Ford 222 said:
I'll bite...why would Kev be a cup champ in '10? 48 was clearly best when it counted.
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Clearly the best? He won the title because Denny had to pit for fuel while dominating Phoenix. I wouldn't say that's "best when it counted". And Harvick led the regular points all season. That was probably jimmies one fluke title
 
DaBiff1618 said:
Clearly the best? He won the title because Denny had to pit for fuel while dominating Phoenix. I wouldn't say that's "best when it counted". And Harvick led the regular points all season. That was probably jimmies one fluke title
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If Denny was best when it counted he woulda conserved fuel or the team woulda been on a winning strategy. #48 bested them :idunno:

History books
 
Ford 222 said:
I'll bite...why would Kev be a cup champ in '10? 48 was clearly best when it counted.
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Did you even watch NASCAR then? Kevin Harvick DOMINATED the entire 36 race season. If they had a legitimate championship format, he would have won the championship by like 300 or 400 points. And the single biggest problem with that championship format was that it turned NASCAR into a 10 race season with that "season" that didn't resemble the regular season in any way (Dover and Loudon are Chase races, there isn't a road course in the Chase and there's only one short track in the Chase, LOL).

I don't think anyone can deny anymore that the old Chase format favored Jimmie Johnson. Not intentionally, but in terms of how it played out. He didn't win the championship under the 36 race format (though had a legitimate shot in 2002, but I won't talk about that, another damn year Mark Martin should've won the championship and didn't :mad:) and he hasn't even been a factor in the new Chase format.

ChexOrWrex said:
If Denny was best when it counted he woulda conserved fuel or the team woulda been on a winning strategy. #48 bested them :idunno:

History books
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Hamlin should've won the championship, under the Chase format. He had a meltdown after Phoenix, in spite of being the points leader, and then performed the most epic choke job I've ever seen in NASCAR at Miami. Johnson got pretty lucky.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Hamlin should've won the championship, under the Chase format. He had a meltdown after Phoenix, in spite of being the points leader, and then performed the most epic choke job I've ever seen in NASCAR at Miami. Johnson got pretty lucky.
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Not the first time a driver has choked or been taken out of a championship near the end of a season & wont be the last. Thats racin
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Did you even watch NASCAR then? Kevin Harvick DOMINATED the entire season. If they had a legitimate championship format, he would have won the championship by like 300 or 400 points.
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Correct ... about 5 or 6 races before season's end.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Not the first time a driver has choked or been taken out of a championship near the end of a season & wont be the last. Thats racin
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You're letting your Hendrick fanboy come out. In no legitimate scenario should Jimmie Johnson have won the 2010 championship. And under the crap points system of 2010, he won solely because Denny Hamlin pulled a Kyle Busch.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
You're letting your Hendrick fanboy come out. In no legitimate scenario should Jimmie Johnson have won the 2010 championship. And under the crap points system of 2010, he won solely because Denny Hamlin pulled a Kyle Busch.
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He did the best givin the format 6 times. Check the history books. Denny hasnt done the best yet in any format.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Is this your final answer for 2014? Because you ran around all last year screaming about how Jeff Gordon was the real champion.
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Gordon scored the most points in 2014 & woulda won with an older format. Same goes for a few other seasons. But he was not the real champion.

There was another Gordon fan on here claiming Gordon was a real 7 time champ.
 
ChexOrWrex said:
Gordon scored the most points in 2014 & woulda won with an older format. Same goes for a few other seasons. But he was not the real champion.

There was another Gordon fan on here claiming Gordon was a real 7 time champ.
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Personally, I have defended the playoff because I like the format at an entertainment value. And I still think it's a solid format, but Kyle Busch winning the championship after missing 11 races will never sit well with me. And, if Tony Stewart somehow makes the Chase this year, I'll be quite perturbed.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Let's explore the evidence.

Here's the conclusion of the 2006 Daytona 500, where the caution is thrown just moments before Jimmie Johnson comes to the line to score the victory.



Here's the finish of the fall race at Talladega that same year, just months before Mark Martin got boned. Notice how NASCAR throws the caution in the middle of a battle for the win.



Now, let's fast forward to this random Talladega race in 2012 finishing ... under caution.



Here's the finish of the 2014 Daytona 500, with a situation identical to the conclusion of the 2007 Daytona 500. Notice what happens here? Yep, a caution flag.



One year later, the Daytona 500 again finishes ...... under caution



Here's the first piece of evidence filed by NASCAR this weekend, the Brennan Poole screw job.



And then Sunday's finish, where NASCAR throws the caution like 100 feet away from the checkered flag.



I'm sure there are plenty more piece of evidence to support my case.

I rest my case.
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And you can probably find as much or more evidence that he won or improved his position when maybe he shouldn't have. Just face it the book said that he didn't win. End of story. That is the only thing that counts.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Did you even watch NASCAR then? Kevin Harvick DOMINATED the entire 36 race season. If they had a legitimate championship format, he would have won the championship by like 300 or 400 points. And the single biggest problem with that championship format was that it turned NASCAR into a 10 race season with that "season" that didn't resemble the regular season in any way (Dover and Loudon are Chase races, there isn't a road course in the Chase and there's only one short track in the Chase, LOL).
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Did you?

Jimmie had 6 wins to Kev's 3, 17 T5s to Kevs 16, and 1315 laps led to Kev's 357 or something.
 
Ford 222 said:
Did you?

Jimmie had 6 wins to Kev's 3, 17 T5s to Kevs 16, and 1315 laps led to Kev's 357 or something.
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Kevin Harvick had 26 top 10 finishes, finished on the lead lap in 32 of 36 races and an average finish of 8.7, Jimmie Johnson's average finish was 12.2.

Spin it all you want, Harvick was consistent as hell and would have run away with the championship under the Winston Cup points format.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Kevin Harvick had 26 top 10 finishes, finished on the lead lap in 32 of 36 races and an average finish of 8.7, Jimmie Johnson's average finish was 12.2.

Spin it all you want, Harvick was consistent as hell and would have run away with the championship under the Winston Cup points format.
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Spin what? Johnson won the stats that mattered. And the title within the rules at the time.
 
Ford 222 said:
Spin what? Johnson won the stats that mattered. And the title within the rules at the time.
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And Kevin Harvick won the stats that mattered in 2014 and won the title within the rules at the time.

You started this with an asinine statement. No matter what stats you use, no matter how you try to spin it, no matter what formats you look at, Kevin Harvick is a champion. You can either accept that Kevin Harvick would've won it in 2010 and 2015 if the Chase hadn't existed or accept that he won the championship in 2014.

I didn't like the old Chase, but I never ran around saying Jimmie Johnson wasn't a legitimate champion. And, for the most part, not many people did. Only Jeff Gordon fans did.

I say Mark Martin won the 1990 NASCAR Winston Cup Series Championship because history, which has been well documented in this thread, has proven that Mark Martin got totally boned by NASCAR on multiple occassions.

The one and only reason I do not like the new Chase format, which I defended up until last September, is because the format alone opens the door to an illegitimate champion. It has nothing to do with Kyle Busch winning, or Kevin Harvick not winning. If Tony Stewart wins the championship this year, I will be every bit as outraged as I was last year.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
And Kevin Harvick won the stats that mattered in 2014 and won the title within the rules at the time.

You started this with an asinine statement. No matter what stats you use, no matter how you try to spin it, no matter what formats you look at, Kevin Harvick is a champion. You can either accept that Kevin Harvick would've won it in 2010 and 2015 if the Chase hadn't existed or accept that he won the championship in 2014.

I didn't like the old Chase, but I never ran around saying Jimmie Johnson wasn't a legitimate champion. And, for the most part, not many people did. Only Jeff Gordon fans did.

I say Mark Martin won the 1990 NASCAR Winston Cup Series Championship because history, which has been well documented in this thread, has proven that Mark Martin got totally boned by NASCAR on multiple occassions.

The one and only reason I do not like the new Chase format, which I defended up until last September, is because the format alone opens the door to an illegitimate champion. It has nothing to do with Kyle Busch winning, or Kevin Harvick not winning. If Tony Stewart wins the championship this year, I will be every bit as outraged as I was last year.
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As an old Gordo fan, Jimmie is def a legit champion. He would've gotten his somehow, someway, regardless of format. The other active drivers simply don't compar.
 
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