Nascar just isn't popular with the gereral popualtion

R Clarence said:
Thinkin’ most the rasslin’ crowd know it’s fake.

Still a lot of folks watchin’ the NASCAR product thinkin’ it’s real racin’.
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I'm one of them! I'm stupid enough and gullible enough to actually believe (gasp) the racers are racing.

I have a long way to go to be as cynical, as one-note, and as condescending as you are. I hope I never get there, as that would be pretty miserable for me.
 
LewTheShoe said:
I'm one of them! I'm stupid enough and gullible enough to actually believe (gasp) the racers are racing.

I have a long way to go to be as cynical, as one-note, and as condescending as you are. I hope I never get there, as that would be pretty miserable for me.
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I wouldn't say you are stupid but you have a good dose of Pollyanna in you.
 
Everyone who talks to the camera mentions a sponsor's name. I realize nothing happens without the sponsors but the non race fan might have a lower tolerance for advertising.
 
Zerkfitting said:
Everyone who talks to the camera mentions a sponsor's name. I realize nothing happens without the sponsors but the non race fan might have a lower tolerance for advertising.
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C'mon, in this day when almost everything in sports, pro or so-called amateur, is sponsored? TV coverage of all other sports is chock full of sponsor 'shout-outs', just made by the broadcast team instead of the players. Stadiums; pre-game, half-time, post-game coverage; official everything of teams, stadiums, leagues; etc. Soccer teams have had sponsor logos for decades. The NBA is going to have sponsor logos on their uniforms next season.

If that's the only thing keeping casual viewers from becoming dedicated fans, NASCAR is in great shape. If it's not, the other sports will soon be fighting the same (non-)issue.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
C'mon, in this day when almost everything in sports, pro or so-called amateur, is sponsored? TV coverage of all other sports is chock full of sponsor 'shout-outs', just made by the broadcast team instead of the players. Stadiums; pre-game, half-time, post-game coverage; official everything of teams, stadiums, leagues; etc. Soccer teams have had sponsor logos for decades. The NBA is going to have sponsor logos on their uniforms next season.
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Other sports don't have players listing sponsor names are when they are interviewed. I realize the sponsors are the most important part of a race team but I get annoyed when a driver recites what is displayed on his fire suit before he says anything I'd like to hear.
 
Zerkfitting said:
Other sports don't have players listing sponsor names are when they are interviewed. I realize the sponsors are the most important part of a race team but I get annoyed when a driver recites what is displayed on his fire suit before he says anything I'd like to hear.
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I'm sure they're virtually required to mention the sponsors' names in interviews but what really bothers me is that fake sip of (insert beverage here) right as the camera comes on. There is only so much fake I can take.
 
Barbara Charles said:
There are several threads addressing this issue you may want to peruse Brigeton. Among other reasons, the redneck image of Nascar an the fact that young people are not interested in cars as in years gone by.
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As someone who's primary interest is open wheel racing... (But Ill watch most anything on wheels but drag racing...)

Some things I think that hold Nascar back:

1: The failure to shed the redneck image. It seemed like some progress was made in the early 2000's but Nascar seemed to double down on their "southern bootlegger roots". WTF?? They were a bunch of Florida beach racers...

2: Failure to at least maintain a "stock" look to the cars. They only vaguely resemble the cars they are supposed to be. V8 supercars and DTM do a far better job making their race cars at least physically resemble the ones they are based on.

2b: Failure to update the cars - move up to at least a V8 supercars level of technology. The visibly backwards tech is doing nothing for the series. It is not a selling point.

3: The constant fiddling of the points/championship format. Not the only series to do that the past 10 years but surely the most egregious offender. The fans don't like it in any series - and it just makes it harder for casuals to pick up. As to what that format should be - that's a thread war all on its own...

4: The "sponsor speak" is just over the top, drivers in other race series have sponsors and mention them, but not nearly to the same level. Nascar is in a league of its own. It comes across as overly artificial and is not a selling point to the casuals.

My $0.02, worth what you paid for it...

.
 
TwoZero said:
As someone who's primary interest is open wheel racing... (But Ill watch most anything on wheels but drag racing...)

Some things I think that hold Nascar back:

1: The failure to shed the redneck image. It seemed like some progress was made in the early 2000's but Nascar seemed to double down on their "southern bootlegger roots". WTF?? They were a bunch of Florida beach racers...

2: Failure to at least maintain a "stock" look to the cars. They only vaguely resemble the cars they are supposed to be. V8 supercars and DTM do a far better job making their race cars at least physically resemble the ones they are based on.

2b: Failure to update the cars - move up to at least a V8 supercars level of technology. The visibly backwards tech is doing nothing for the series. It is not a selling point.

3: The constant fiddling of the points/championship format. Not the only series to do that the past 10 years but surely the most egregious offender. The fans don't like it in any series - and it just makes it harder for casuals to pick up. As to what that format should be - that's a thread war all on its own...

4: The "sponsor speak" is just over the top, drivers in other race series have sponsors and mention them, but not nearly to the same level. Nascar is in a league of its own. It comes across as overly artificial and is not a selling point to the casuals.

My $0.02, worth what you paid for it...

.
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My $0.02 cents reply:

1: Yes

2: Yes to DTM-like cars and more tech. Let the fans see what the driver sees in terms of tach, speed, braking, fuel, etc.

3: Threads abound on this one. Too much fiddling with the system and too often has created a mess of a system that turns off people willing to give the sport a try. They've created an elaborate mousetrap instead of using the KISS philosophy.

4: Agree, but I'm not sure that can necessarily be changed.
 
@NJJammer : As Larry Mac has said on several occasions, Nascar is a sponsor-driven sport, which distinguishes it from other sports. These sponsors want to get their monies' worth. As long as the scramble for sponsorship money remains as difficult as it has become, this aspect of the sport will remain (probably forever).
 
Barbara Charles said:
@NJJammer : As Larry Mac has said on several occasions, Nascar is a sponsor-driven sport, which distinguishes it from other sports. These sponsors want to get their monies' worth. As long as the scramble for sponsorship money remains as difficult as it has become, this aspect of the sport will remain (probably forever).
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Racing - no matter where, is sponsor driven. But other series have not gone off the deep end with sponsor speak the way Nascar has.

The post race driver interviews in F1, WEC, DTM, Blancpain GT, V8 supercars etc... are night and day compared to Nascar drivers.

And they are just as dependent on sponsors to run their operations.

.
 
TwoZero said:
Racing - no matter where, is sponsor driven. But other series have not gone off the deep end with sponsor speak the way Nascar has.

The post race driver interviews in F1, WEC, DTM, Blancpain GT, V8 supercars etc... are night and day compared to Nascar drivers.

And they are just as dependent on sponsors to run their operations.

.
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I notice none of those other series regular field 35+ cars. Maybe sponsors feel getting their names mentioned so often makes NASCAR support a good bargain.

I'm with you on your other three points, esp. regarding the technologies used. NASCAR has long been more about selling what's in the showrooms than about developing new technologies. But it could at least keep up with what's at the dealers. I know, I know, there's the argument about keeping the series emphasis on driver skills over engineering ones, but there's plenty of wiggle room there. Otherwise, they might as well rip out the power steering and EFI, and go back to carbs and muscling the cars through the curves.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
I notice none of those other series regular field 35+ cars. Maybe sponsors feel getting their names mentioned so often makes NASCAR support a good bargain.

...
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The cost to run those cars are much more than a cup car. If Nascar did new rules that mandated an upgrade of new cup cars to V8 supercar tech levels, the field would shrink. Probably to 30-35 cars.

I think that there is an argument to be made that aside from the aesthetics of seeing 35+ cars - Nascar could easily shrink the field down to 30 cars , and from a competition point of view, nobody would notice the difference.

And Nascar is very much its own animal in the racing world.

.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
C'mon, in this day when almost everything in sports, pro or so-called amateur, is sponsored? TV coverage of all other sports is chock full of sponsor 'shout-outs', just made by the broadcast team instead of the players. Stadiums; pre-game, half-time, post-game coverage; official everything of teams, stadiums, leagues; etc. Soccer teams have had sponsor logos for decades. The NBA is going to have sponsor logos on their uniforms next season.

If that's the only thing keeping casual viewers from becoming dedicated fans, NASCAR is in great shape. If it's not, the other sports will soon be fighting the same (non-)issue.
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Maybe if Nascar had a guaranteed fracas after each stage sponsored by Extendze more casual fans would tune in.
 
You're new here. Give it some time. If you think this one is stupid, you ain't seen nuthin' yet.

For example, try this currently popular goodie: https://racing-forums.com/threads/f...-are-killing-nascar.57652/page-2#post-1104025

Or this recent classic: https://racing-forums.com/threads/nascar-fans-offended-by-monster-girls.57263/

Or the absolute brilliance that was: https://racing-forums.com/threads/i-wouldnt-mind-seeing-a-scriptd-rivarly-in-the-booth.56966/

In the Cup Series of Stupid Discussions, this one wouldn't qualify for a K&N race.
 
seventh angel said:
What kind of stupid is this thread?

NASCAR is reported as the top motorsport in America, and rivals other top sports in viewership...
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IDK how many viewers MLB, NBA and NFL get each week when their games are played but I would have to think the sum total would far exceed Nascar. Keep in mind there were races last year that didn't even draw 3 million viewers.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
You're new here. Give it some time. If you think this one is stupid, you ain't seen nuthin' yet.

For example, try this currently popular goodie: https://racing-forums.com/threads/f...-are-killing-nascar.57652/page-2#post-1104025

Or this recent classic: https://racing-forums.com/threads/nascar-fans-offended-by-monster-girls.57263/

Or the absolute brilliance that was: https://racing-forums.com/threads/i-wouldnt-mind-seeing-a-scriptd-rivarly-in-the-booth.56966/

In the Cup Series of Stupid Discussions, this one wouldn't qualify for a K&N race.
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I would be interested in seventh angel posting some viewership numbers for Cup and mainline stick and ball sports as it would seem to me that each week most leagues would draw more total viewers.
 
I suspect you wouldn't need totals. Any reasonably decent MNF game (Pats and Steelers, for example) would outdraw some triple-header race weekends.

But so what? Do we care if it's popular with the general public? TV sports networks are starving for content (at least, that's the only way I can explain MMA); auto racing isn't in danger of not having a home. Sponsor declines may result in driving 'lesser' cars, but some of us have expressed a preference for less engineering in the sport already.

The current state still beats watching edited replays of lopside multi-lap leads on Wide World.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
I suspect you wouldn't need totals. Any reasonably decent MNF game (Pats and Steelers, for example) would outdraw some triple-header race weekends.

But so what? Do we care if it's popular with the general public? TV sports networks are starving for content (at least, that's the only way I can explain MMA); auto racing isn't in danger of not having a home. Sponsor declines may result in driving 'lesser' cars, but some of us have expressed a preference for less engineering in the sport already.

The current state still beats watching edited replays of lopside multi-lap leads on Wide World.
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I figured it the same way you did but was musing about this comment: "NASCAR is reported as the top motorsport in America, and rivals other top sports in viewership..."
 
NJJammer said:
I'm sure they're virtually required to mention the sponsors' names in interviews but what really bothers me is that fake sip of (insert beverage here) right as the camera comes on. There is only so much fake I can take.
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I'm still waiting for someone to burp after taking a swig - that would sell the fake swig.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
Maybe if Nascar had a guaranteed fracas after each stage sponsored by Extendze more casual fans would tune in.
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Hi there. My colleagues and I have actually analyzed this very topic. On an average weekend, we found that in 2016, the combined audience of NASCAR over the course of a weekend when NASCAR is on FOX or NBC usually meets or exceeds the combined audience of all of the following sports on TV over the course of a week. In other words, one weekend of NASCAR (Cup, Trucks, XFINITY) is roughly equivalent in viewership to anywhere between 2-3 nationally televised NBA games, 5-6 MLB games, 8-10 NHL games, and around 10 EPL events.
 
Matt Stallknecht said:
Hi there. My colleagues and I have actually analyzed this very topic. On an average weekend, we found that in 2016, the combined audience of NASCAR over the course of a weekend when NASCAR is on FOX or NBC usually meets or exceeds the combined audience of all of the following sports on TV over the course of a week. In other words, one weekend of NASCAR (Cup, Trucks, XFINITY) is roughly equivalent in viewership to anywhere between 2-3 nationally televised NBA games, 5-6 MLB games, 8-10 NHL games, and around 10 EPL events.
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On an average weekend, how many NBA, MLB, and NHL games are nationally televised? NASCAR's numbers don't look so good if there are more than 2-3 national NBA games. Regardless, I'm pretty sure there are several regionally televised games each weekend. If the stats leave those regional games out, it looks like apples and oranges to me.

Does that 'one weekend of NASCAR' include practice and qualifying across all three series, just the three races themselves, or all content including pre-race, post-race, and 'filler' shows between P and Q sessions? Similarly, do the numbers for the other sports also include just the games, or other content too?
 
I figure if there were 20 televised NBA games in a 7 day period and the average viewership was 500,000 that would equal 10 million viewers. The only cup race I am aware of that gets that many viewers is the Daytona 500.

It is like the claim that NASCAR has better attendance then the sporting world. If NASCAR had 100,000 people attend each race they would have yearly attendance of 3.6 million. The Chicago Blackhawks, Toronto Maple Leafs and Montreal Canadiens average roughly 20,000 fans per game each year for 41 regular season home games. That represents about 2.5 millions fans in stands alone plus there are 27 other teams to add to that total.

If numbers are cherry picked and no context is added they aren't worth a whole lot.
 
Reck said:
I dont think this is something new. It has been this way from the start.

NASCAR isn't a sport that the vast majority gravitate to. This sport peaked during the early to mid 00s. That was as popular as NASCAR ever got and will ever be.
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Yep....totally agree, everyone who was anyone was jumping on the Nascar bandwagon back then. Seats were non existent, tracks were adding seats every year in fact, and it was still hard to get tickets. Nascar peaked, but it will always have a following, as much as we bitch and complain about it we sure would all miss it if we didn't have it.
 
Everything goes in cycles.

I enjoy being able to go to any race and not worry about it selling out. I've had a lot of non-NASCAR friends who I've taken to the track for a weekend who became fans. Usually starts with people asking why I love NASCAR so much and that they don't get it, I just invite them along for a weekend at the track and they are usually sold. I went to Texas three times a year when I lived there and would always get a bunch of free tickets to the summer truck / Indy race and just bring anyone along who wanted to camp, party and watch racing.
 
Mopardh9 said:
Yep....totally agree, everyone who was anyone was jumping on the Nascar bandwagon back then. Seats were non existent, tracks were adding seats every year in fact, and it was still hard to get tickets. Nascar peaked, but it will always have a following, as much as we bitch and complain about it we sure would all miss it if we didn't have it.
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Absolutely as NASCAR will always have a presence. As time goes on and less money flows in there will probably be less races and less series and smaller fields and I am OK with that. In reality I enjoyed NASCAR much more before it was swamped by money, engineers and debilitating aero.
 
Cholo said:
Everything goes in cycles.

I enjoy being able to go to any race and not worry about it selling out. I've had a lot of non-NASCAR friends who I've taken to the track for a weekend who became fans. Usually starts with people asking why I love NASCAR so much and that they don't get it, I just invite them along for a weekend at the track and they are usually sold. I went to Texas three times a year when I lived there and would always get a bunch of free tickets to the summer truck / Indy race and just bring anyone along who wanted to camp, party and watch racing.
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It is funny how things change as despite the massive seat reductions you could walk up to the ticket window 5 minutes before 35 races and get tickets.

I was always in favor of the tracks giving away a certain amount of tickets as getting people to the track is the best way to make a fan.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
...

It is like the claim that NASCAR has better attendance then the sporting world. If NASCAR had 100,000 people attend each race they would have yearly attendance of 3.6 million. ...
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I've seen those numbers several times in reliable media outlets. The problem is, they aren't NASCAR attendance numbers, they're MOTORSPORTS attendance numbers. NASCAR, IndyCar, IMSA, NHRA, ARCA, all the feeder and regional series sanctions by those bodies, local tracks, all the two-wheeled series, snowmobiles, riding mowers, others I'm probably not even aware of.

People see those 'Motorsports attendance' numbers and treat them as if motorsports and Cup-level auto racing are the same thing. Cup may be the largest individual slice of the pie, but I doubt even NASCAR as a whole ,all series, all levels, draws the majority of motorsports attendees. When you take all forms of motorsports into account, attendance in the low millions seems reasonable.
 
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It was getting close to being really big but then nascar decided to go crazy and alienate the base thinking they were going to get all these new fans. I.E. back when they pushed the start times back to like 3 o clock for even east coast races and creating the stupid chase. They even gave California that second date. Then the worst part was they kept wanting to get the "Young Fan" Thinking that ment putting kids in cars that did not deserve it. Funny how they are still chasing that young fan like much of T.V. these days but the young fan does not even watch tv.
 
Halbert said:
It was getting close to being really big but then nascar decided to go crazy and alienate the base thinking they were going to get all these new fans. I.E. back when they pushed the start times back to like 3 o clock for even east coast races and creating the stupid chase. They even gave California that second date. Then the worst part was they kept wanting to get the "Young Fan" Thinking that ment putting kids in cars that did not deserve it. Funny how they are still chasing that young fan like much of T.V. these days but the young fan does not even watch tv.
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True!
 
I don't like the term "general population" but I think I understand what you were going for.

I think we (I shall speak for all of you because I can) that "we" already knew that.

I am on another message board and every time I post about Kurt, I get ****. It's no big deal, I still love me some Nascar.
 
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