Rate The Race: Homestead Championship Race

Zerkfitting said:
It was a great race. Most of the contenders were up front all day. Edwards and Lagano did what they had to do, it was a racing incident. And Johnson pulled off a win. I felt bad for Larson who lead so much with one of his best runs of the season.
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Last year @Allenbaba mentioned that the 4 champ contenders would all be allowed something a little extra in order for all of them to run well so I am assuming it was the same deal this year. Maybe he can shed some light on this when he has time.
 
LouieLouie said:
I'm going with 6.5. The race was pretty boring all night long until the fantom caution came out with 15 laps to go.
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From what some people have said I would be crazy not to go back and watch a replay of the race but they way you and others make it sound the last 30 laps or so is all that is needed. I think YouTube has it pretty well covered and will stick with that as it works for discussing specific incidents.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
Last year @Allenbaba mentioned that the 4 champ contenders would all be allowed something a little extra in order for all of them to run well so I am assuming it was the same deal this year. Maybe he can shed some light on this when he has time.
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The 48 got called back to the inspection station after having passed earlier. Something about a post-inspection "adjustment" that Chadmeister fixed with a razor blade.

Something extra to the extra?
 
LewTheShoe said:
People who think it's wrong to throw a yellow when a car spins or smacks the wall hard are watching the wrong sport. I am baffled by people claiming that is "Nascar manipulation." WTF do they expect? Do they hope to see Lupton get T-boned by a car at full speed?
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gnomesayin said:
If I am wrong, please feel free to correct me. Lupton did not spin or smack the wall hard, or even close. He had a flat tire, got a little loose in the corner, and was well under control out of the racing groove driving toward the pits on the back stretch. If this is the standard, why didn't Kyle Busch's apparent (whether it turned out to be real or not) flat tire issue bring out the yellow?
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Lupton lost control and took a long sideways slide through turn 2 in front of oncoming traffic. He was exactly in the racing groove and he was sideways. IMO that warrants an immediate caution to slow on-coming cars, who are at speed and racing for position. Once the caution lights are on, it doesn't matter that he regained control and got to the bottom of the track. Check at 3:09 of the race broadcast. (I didn't say Lupton hit the wall. That was Blaney in a separate incident. That is why I used the word "or" in my post.)

You are scraping the bottom of the barrel about the Kyle Busch incident. There was no incident. He just pulled off the track into the pits. How could that merit a yellow? This comment reveals a lack of objectivity, and IMO reduces your credibility.

Last year in this race there was a questionable debris caution late in the race. That was a year ago. Yesterday there was a debris caution with ~96 laps to go, and TV did not show the debris. The Lupton incident yesterday was an appropriate yellow flag.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
Last year @Allenbaba mentioned that the 4 champ contenders would all be allowed something a little extra in order for all of them to run well so I am assuming it was the same deal this year. Maybe he can shed some light on this when he has time.
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I don't know much about this year, but I do know a little about last year's Miami race, and the 4 finalists were definitely at a small advantage. Nothing MAJOR that would guarantee a 1, 2, 3, 4 finish...but an advantage nonetheless. I'd really rather not get into specifics...but I will give you an analogy. Imagine going to med school to become a surgeon. There's a final exam coming up where you'll be asked to perform a surgery. Could be removing a gallbladder, kidney, appendix, tumor whatever. You have to be prepared for any situation that might come up. Behind the scenes....4 star students were told they'd be removing a kidney. Those students would still need to study hard, and still need to actually perform the surgery without incident. But......I think most people would consider those students at an advantage.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
The Chase made this race entertaining. No doubt about that. It's amazing that the final four ran so close for most of the day. While I'm not a fan of the format in the slightest, it was a memorable event for years to come.
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As I said in an earlier post @Allenbaba mentioned last year the 4 chase cars were given something extra which would account for them all running well and close together if that held true this year. Brian France loves pack racing and thinks we all do too and also likes games 7 moments so it sounds like that was provided yesterday but at what cost?
 
LewTheShoe said:
Lupton lost control and took a long sideways slide through turn 2 in front of oncoming traffic.
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This is why I specified that I did not have a recording of the race to refer to. If this is accurate and my recollection was wrong, I would be more inclined to agree with you on that specific incident.

LewTheShoe said:
This comment reveals a lack of objectivity, and IMO reduces your credibility.
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I don't appreciate that, and it's not necessary. Taken in context, my argument was about consistent standards of officiating. If NASCAR establishes a highly cautious approach and issues preventative cautions because of potential danger, I am fine with that as long as the application remains steady and not shrouded in the mystery of "we do what we think is right in each individual instance". I only brought up the Busch incident because to everyone's eyes at that moment, it looked like he had a tire down and barely saved it from hitting the wall. If that were the case, he had traffic behind him, and something could have gone very wrong very quickly. I also brought up the Stenhouse wreck, because I don't think the considerable delay in throwing the yellow there could possibly square with a safety-first, preventative approach. It appears more like just what I said. Sometimes they are itching for a caution, and sometimes they'd really, really rather not have to throw one.
 
gnomesayin said:
Come on, you're obviously a very smart guy. I don't have a recording of the race to refer to, but this what I saw and what I remember happening. If I am wrong, please feel free to correct me. Lupton did not spin or smack the wall hard, or even close. He had a flat tire, got a little loose in the corner, and was well under control out of the racing groove driving toward the pits on the back stretch. If this is the standard, why didn't Kyle Busch's apparent (whether it turned out to be real or not) flat tire issue bring out the yellow? How many flat tires with no spin and no debris bring out the yellow? Do you truly believe it isn't selective, and that NASCAR isn't looking for a caution sometimes and determined not to have one others? They clearly didn't want the final caution for Stenhouse (who spun and smacked the wall) and delayed as long as they reasonably could before issuing it. This is what people are tired of, the obvious subjectivity. They aren't officiating races, they are directing them like it's a story.
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Some folks are very protective of Nascar and enjoy it at a whole different level than most others so anytime Nascar's shenanigans are mentioned they go completely tilt as it is akin to a personal insult. A lot of people like Nascar racing and don't care for some of the rules and the chase but are loyal to Nascar and will stay with the series regardless. Some people point out the obvious and are incredulous by the regular manipulations but the worst of it is that millions of fans just walked away never to return.

Your comment about Nascar control directing events as opposed to being consistent and doing the right thing rings true. In fact it is almost like Steven Spielberg is in charge of when to call a caution and when not to based on what will lead to the most drama. There is more integrity in pick up hockey and basketball games with no officiating then there is in Nascar.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
If I have any complaint about the yellow policies, it's their inconsistency. I think Lupton's flat was treated the same way other tire issues were handled yesterday. What I didn't like was the slow trigger on Stenhouse's serving of all the wall he could eat.

No, I don't think Lupton's tire merited a caution, but I do think it was treated the same way as other similar incidents. None of Blaney's wall-brushes were worth a yellow (in my opinion), but nobody's complaining about those. I guess it only counts as 'manipulation' if it happens late in the race?
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The problem can't be boiled down to 1 race or just part of a race as Nascar's manipulations and inconsistencies are systemic and have existed for many years. It would probably be easier to get rid of corruption in Mexico then get Nascar on the track to integrity.
 
aunty dive said:
The 48 got called back to the inspection station after having passed earlier. Something about a post-inspection "adjustment" that Chadmeister fixed with a razor blade.

Something extra to the extra?
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If all 4 cars are equally allocated something extra and someone takes liberties with that and gives themselves an extra advantage being penalized makes sense. Obviously the penalty to the 48 was inconsequential anyway.
 
This race earns 9.5 from me. Homestead is a fabulous track that produces great side-by-side racing in multiple grooves. The top lane right at the wall is very fast but very difficult to execute. Kyle Larson was masterful yesterday. He deserved to win, but he just got beat on the last restart. If he had won, I'd score the race higher.

Homestead is right up there with Darlington and Atlanta for producing intense, competitive, skill-based racing. And the current aero rules really work here, with the cars able to race close together without the dreaded aero push dominating the race. The worn out asphalt eats tires. Can't wait to see if the teams get fewer tires next year, as that could add interesting strategy problems. And the championship situation certainly added drama and excitement to the equation. Congrats to JJ for his 7th Cup title. He has had an amazing career.

SMH at the comments in this thread about this being a boring race. Nascar can be criticized for many things, but boring racing at Homestead is not one of them, IMO.
 
LewTheShoe said:
Lupton lost control and took a long sideways slide through turn 2 in front of oncoming traffic. He was exactly in the racing groove and he was sideways. IMO that warrants an immediate caution to slow on-coming cars, who are at speed and racing for position. Once the caution lights are on, it doesn't matter that he regained control and got to the bottom of the track. Check at 3:09 of the race broadcast. (I didn't say Lupton hit the wall. That was Blaney in a separate incident. That is why I used the word "or" in my post.)

You are scraping the bottom of the barrel about the Kyle Busch incident. There was no incident. He just pulled off the track into the pits. How could that merit a yellow? This comment reveals a lack of objectivity, and IMO reduces your credibility.

Last year in this race there was a questionable debris caution late in the race. That was a year ago. Yesterday there was a debris caution with ~96 laps to go, and TV did not show the debris. The Lupton incident yesterday was an appropriate yellow flag.
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"This comment reveals a lack of objectivity, and IMO reduces your credibility."

pot-kettle-2.jpg
 
Allenbaba said:
I don't know much about this year, but I do know a little about last year's Miami race, and the 4 finalists were definitely at a small advantage. Nothing MAJOR that would guarantee a 1, 2, 3, 4 finish...but an advantage nonetheless. I'd really rather not get into specifics...but I will give you an analogy. Imagine going to med school to become a surgeon. There's a final exam coming up where you'll be asked to perform a surgery. Could be removing a gallbladder, kidney, appendix, tumor whatever. You have to be prepared for any situation that might come up. Behind the scenes....4 star students were told they'd be removing a kidney. Those students would still need to study hard, and still need to actually perform the surgery without incident. But......I think most people would consider those students at an advantage.
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What you said makes sense as it isn't like the finalists are lapping the field but are able to remain close together in the top 6-7 for most of the race. I appreciate you weighing in.
 
gnomesayin said:
This is why I specified that I did not have a recording of the race to refer to. If this is accurate and my recollection was wrong, I would be more inclined to agree with you on that specific incident.



I don't appreciate that, and it's not necessary. Taken in context, my argument was about consistent standards of officiating. If NASCAR establishes a highly cautious approach and issues preventative cautions because of potential danger, I am fine with that as long as the application remains steady and not shrouded in the mystery of "we do what we think is right in each individual instance". I only brought up the Busch incident because to everyone's eyes at that moment, it looked like he had a tire down and barely saved it from hitting the wall. If that were the case, he had traffic behind him, and something could have gone very wrong very quickly. I also brought up the Stenhouse wreck, because I don't think the considerable delay in throwing the yellow there could possibly square with a safety-first, preventative approach. It appears more like just what I said. Sometimes they are itching for a caution, and sometimes they'd really, really rather not have to throw one.
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Don't take offense as Lew gives me the "This comment reveals a lack of objectivity, and IMO reduces your credibility" sermon at least once a week. In fact I am kind of jealous that you are horning in on my territory!
 
Sure you could just watch the last 60 lap run to the finish, since that contained the big battles for the championship lead while Larson just checked out. But if you like the race for the race itself and not the chase you owe it to yourself to watch the first half where Edwards and Larson really went at it while taking it to the field and JJ drove up from last to 5th. Maybe the championship 4 had something extra, I dunno, but it sure wasn't enough by itself to overpower a 42 car and driver perfectly tailored to this racetrack and I think that says a lot.
 
Acs said:
Sure you could just watch the last 60 lap run to the finish, since that contained the big battles for the championship lead while Larson just checked out. But if you like the race for the race itself and not the chase you owe it to yourself to watch the first half where Edwards and Larson really went at it while taking it to the field and JJ drove up from last to 5th. Maybe the championship 4 had something extra, I dunno, but it sure wasn't enough by itself to overpower a 42 car and driver perfectly tailored to this racetrack and I think that says a lot.
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IDK if I will watch a replay or not as but it sounds like more people liked the race then didn't. As far as JJ driving from the back to the front goes he has done it before and actually seems to light a fire under his belly.
 
4.8 because of the winner. Wonder since he had to start in the rear for the unapproved modifications if there will be fines or penalties.
 
How much is enough? First we just had the chase. Then we added more people to the chase. Then we added a few more. Then we decided we needed eliminations and a game seven every year. Now we need a caution with ten to go every year. Brain is convinced we not only need a game seven moment every year, but we need a game seven with the bases loaded in the 9th moment every year....
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
The problem can't be boiled down to 1 race or just part of a race as Nascar's manipulations and inconsistencies are systemic and have existed for many years. It would probably be easier to get rid of corruption in Mexico then get Nascar on the track to integrity.
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The problem that all sports have is 'consistency ' in their calls . Sports , by it's very nature is inconsistent . Fans want perfect calls in imperfect situations . Ain't gonna happen . Can't happen . Good luck with that .
 
ted@economy said:
The problem that all sports have is 'consistency ' in their calls . Sports , by it's very nature is inconsistent . Fans want perfect calls in imperfect situations . Ain't gonna happen . Can't happen . Good luck with that .
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Some officials call games a little tighter than others but overall the rules are applied evenly. Nascar fans don't want perfection more than competency when it comes to calling cautions as for the last few years some of them are used for race management and what is caution today may not be tomorrow.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
Some officials call games a little tighter than others but overall the rules are applied evenly. Nascar fans don't want perfection more than competency when it comes to calling cautions as for the last few years some of them are used for race management and what is caution today may not be tomorrow.
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I watched some of that crap during the World Series . Super slow motion replays , five or six different angles , trying to get it perfect . I didn't see anyone satisfied 'rules evenly applied ' , I only saw the need for computer assisted perfection . I guess I am the only one left who can live with ' judgement calls' .
 
ted@economy said:
I watched some of that crap during the World Series . Super slow motion replays , five or six different angles , trying to get it perfect . I didn't see anyone satisfied 'rules evenly applied ' , I only saw the need for computer assisted perfection . I guess I am the only one left who can live with ' judgement calls' .
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There is nothing wrong with making a judgement call but unfortunately the Nascar officials in charge of calling cautions have none. The drivers have complained about bogus cautions and insiders have stated what goes on but the overwhelming evidence is what we can see with our own eyes. I believe you have said that you can't say Nascar has never called an improper caution or not thrown the yellow when necessary only that you have never seen this occur. Please correct me if I am wrong in that statement as I do not want to put words in your mouth.

Probably the most egregious abuse of the caution flag this year was when one wasn't called. That case involved JLo driving around track with a jack wedged under his vehicle and according to you and Nascar that doesn't represent a serious safety hazard for drivers, fans, team members and track workers. For some reason a tire loose on pit road at the Glen is a safety hazard and worthy of a caution. There are many of examples of this sort of thing but if you don't see it then you just don't see it.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
There is nothing wrong with making a judgement call but unfortunately the Nascar officials in charge of calling cautions have none. The drivers have complained about bogus cautions and insiders have stated what goes on but the overwhelming evidence is what we can see with our own eyes. I believe you have said that you can't say Nascar has never called an improper caution or not thrown the yellow when necessary only that you have never seen this occur. Please correct me if I am wrong in that statement as I do not want to put words in your mouth.

Probably the most egregious abuse of the caution flag this year was when one wasn't called. That case involved JLo driving around track with a jack wedged under his vehicle and according to you and Nascar that doesn't represent a serious safety hazard for drivers, fans, team members and track workers. For some reason a tire loose on pit road at the Glen is a safety hazard and worthy of a caution. There are many of examples of this sort of thing but if you don't see it then you just don't see it.
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Again ...appealing judgement calls seems futile . It can only lead to rule books that detail every possible scenario , multiple camera angles , multiple slo- mo reviews , appeals to the commissioner , and on , and on , and on . No doubt , this is what the new fans want , and that's fine . It's just not for me , and it's not racin . The famous 'pass in the grass' would likely not have passed muster in today's world .
 
ted@economy said:
I watched some of that crap during the World Series . Super slow motion replays , five or six different angles , trying to get it perfect . I didn't see anyone satisfied 'rules evenly applied ' , I only saw the need for computer assisted perfection . I guess I am the only one left who can live with ' judgement calls' .
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I have nothing against judgement calls as long as their called consistently.

Some sports have multiple games each weekend, requiring multiple officiating crews. It's understandable that the judgement calls made by one crew don't match the calls made by another; that's what having judgement is all about. NASCAR, on the other hand, had only one crew per series. It should be easy for them to be consistent race to race, but they can't even make the same judgement call about cautions within the same race.
 
Allenbaba said:
I don't know much about this year, but I do know a little about last year's Miami race, and the 4 finalists were definitely at a small advantage. Nothing MAJOR that would guarantee a 1, 2, 3, 4 finish...but an advantage nonetheless. I'd really rather not get into specifics...but I will give you an analogy. Imagine going to med school to become a surgeon. There's a final exam coming up where you'll be asked to perform a surgery. Could be removing a gallbladder, kidney, appendix, tumor whatever. You have to be prepared for any situation that might come up. Behind the scenes....4 star students were told they'd be removing a kidney. Those students would still need to study hard, and still need to actually perform the surgery without incident. But......I think most people would consider those students at an advantage.
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The stuff you post here sometimes makes me very concerned about the extent of manipulation that goes on in these races. My reading of your comment is that they tell the Chasers on the side something like, 'btw, we may not get a chance to inspect component X this week,' which would give the Chasers the ability to make alterations to that part outside the scope of normal rules. I was thinking how it strains credibility that the Chasers have won the Homestead race the last three years, and this partially explains it. I would have to guess someone is going to blow the lid off this someday, and NASCAR will regret it. We've had team-specific scandals in other sports, but I can't recall a major sport where such manipulation has come from the very top. It could destroy NASCAR.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
Some officials call games a little tighter than others but overall the rules are applied evenly. Nascar fans don't want perfection more than competency when it comes to calling cautions as for the last few years some of them are used for race management and what is caution today may not be tomorrow.
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Ridiculous. I am often frustrated by Nascar officiating with inconsistencies or apparent incorrect calls. However, it is absurd to pretend that things are rosy in other sports, where inconsistencies, incorrect calls, and vacillating rules are frequent. Just today, I'm pretty sure the Houston Texans would agree.

Given the environment where stick-and-ball officials work - with relatively small spaces to monitor, stoppages of action every few seconds, video review to help get it right - they often do a downright poor job. If I were to decide between remaining a fan or walking away based on officiating, I wouldn't have any sports left.
 
For what is worth I really enjoyed it - just finished watching the race replay.
Really pleased with the result
Felt sorry for Edwards as he'd looked good all race though but guess he did admit it was half his fault. super attitude shown by him afterwards.
You've got a great sport here and I really enjoyed my first full season :)
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
Some officials call games a little tighter than others but overall the rules are applied evenly. Nascar fans don't want perfection more than competency when it comes to calling cautions as for the last few years some of them are used for race management and what is caution today may not be tomorrow.
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You're being driven off the point and maybe it's because some would rather cloud the issue and find ways to argue around it. The bulk of complaints about inconsistent NASCAR officiating aren't in the manner of "Damn those stupid NASCAR officials! Those dummies don't have a clue what they're doing and what should be a caution and what shouldn't be. Officials in other sports are so much better and more consistent."

The criticism is about deliberate inconsistency and manipulation, applying the rules differently in different situations with a desired course or outcome in mind. To the extent that this is reasonably suspected in other sports, it draws widespread criticism. Yet if we steer the conversation back to that, those determined to take NASCAR's side will say there is no direct hard evidence of that. Of course there isn't, how stupid would they have to be? So we just keep talking past each other.
 
gnomesayin said:
The criticism is about deliberate inconsistency and manipulation, applying the rules differently in different situations with a desired course or outcome in mind. To the extent that this is reasonably suspected in other sports, it draws widespread criticism. Yet if we steer the conversation back to that, those determined to take NASCAR's side will say there is no direct hard evidence of that. Of course there isn't, how stupid would they have to be? So we just keep talking past each other.
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I think this is a very good comment. It needs to go one step further. To me, what chaps my ass is cheap shots directed at particular drivers or teams, at car owners, at Nascar generally as a sport, or at Nascar specifically as a sanctioning body. So I would add to the above post, "OTOH, those determined to rip on Nascar see deliberate manipulation and malfeasance even in places and decisions where objectively it does not exist." With that addition, the post would take aim at both extremes of fans wearing blinders.

For example, I read the Homestead Race Thread. Sprinkled through the thread are posts claiming Nascar is obviously trying to hand the win to one particular driver, but no one says which driver or why or how. WTF? Such cheap shots are out of order.

There are posters who cry manipulation about every debris caution and most cautions involving single-car accidents. I've been called a Nascar apologist for disagreeing in particular instances. WTF?

On Sunday's race, there was a debris caution with 96 laps to go, and I have questioned that as TV never showed the cause. But no one cares about that one, as it did not alter the outcome, so everyone is riled up about the Lupton incident. Not the most serious spin of the year, but a half spin and long slide out of control with oncoming traffic is usually going to produce a Nascar yellow flag. Criticism on the Stenhouse incident is warranted IMO, but the angst over the Lupton deal is over the top.
 
^ Sometimes realist is confused with apologist.

Half of last Sunday's tinfoil was purchased to enable NASCAR fixing to favor Johnson. The other half deflected gamma rays sufficient to allow NASCAR to thwart number 7.

If it were actually possible to control a race winning conspiracy, The Golden Child would be the guy tied with his old man and The King.
 
I am not going to rate the race..... everyone has a different perspective....

I AM going to rate Carl's character after the ''incident'' as a 10...... hardly ever do you see that in a moment of intense emotion..... he elevated my respect for him....
 
LewTheShoe said:
I think this is a very good comment. It needs to go one step further. To me, what chaps my ass is cheap shots directed at particular drivers or teams, at car owners, at Nascar generally as a sport, or at Nascar specifically as a sanctioning body. So I would add to the above post, "OTOH, those determined to rip on Nascar see deliberate manipulation and malfeasance even in places and decisions where objectively it does not exist." With that addition, the post would take aim at both extremes of fans wearing blinders.

For example, I read the Homestead Race Thread. Sprinkled through the thread are posts claiming Nascar is obviously trying to hand the win to one particular driver, but no one says which driver or why or how. WTF? Such cheap shots are out of order.

There are posters who cry manipulation about every debris caution and most cautions involving single-car accidents. I've been called a Nascar apologist for disagreeing in particular instances. WTF?

On Sunday's race, there was a debris caution with 96 laps to go, and I have questioned that as TV never showed the cause. But no one cares about that one, as it did not alter the outcome, so everyone is riled up about the Lupton incident. Not the most serious spin of the year, but a half spin and long slide out of control with oncoming traffic is usually going to produce a Nascar yellow flag. Criticism on the Stenhouse incident is warranted IMO, but the angst over the Lupton deal is over the top.
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I think there are several schools of thought and at one extreme are the few that believe Nascar is a sport with rules and regs evenly applied not counting for the inevitable human error. At the other end are the people that believe Nascar determines race winners and favors certain drivers over others.

Another group sees Nascar's deficiencies but says it is all out of their control and seeing cars going anti-clockwise trumps things like the chase, caution clock and giving unearned laps back.

The last group are those that lambaste Nascar for their shortsightedness, manipulation and the idiotic leader just to name a few. Many of these people have watched Nascar for 30-40 years and cannot believe what has happened to a once great series. This can be a rowdy "take back Nascar" bunch that feel they are on good ground based upon the decimation of fans in stands, viewers from home and overall lack of interest in the series.

I think there is room for everyone and if there is a topic or conversation I am not interested in I just take a pass. Being on the forum should be enjoyable and nothing here should cause chapped lips, chapped a$$es or anger.
 
^ Cheap shot. Perfect example.
 
LewTheShoe said:
I think this is a very good comment. It needs to go one step further. To me, what chaps my ass is cheap shots directed at particular drivers or teams, at car owners, at Nascar generally as a sport, or at Nascar specifically as a sanctioning body. So I would add to the above post, "OTOH, those determined to rip on Nascar see deliberate manipulation and malfeasance even in places and decisions where objectively it does not exist." With that addition, the post would take aim at both extremes of fans wearing blinders.
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I would not disagree with that sentiment. I too read and hear a lot of unsupported claims that NASCAR is doing X during a race to favor X driver, and it gets tiresome when there is no actual evidence that is the case. Sometimes these sorts of comments aren't made with any more weight behind them than a drunk fan at the ballpark shouting about how the ump has it out for their team. Still, there is unfocused anger among a considerable portion of the fanbase, because it is widely believed among fans and even participants that NASCAR uses cautions to 'manage' races, and their motivations are sometimes obvious but other times murky. Drivers haven't, teams haven't, but NASCAR as a sanctioning body have made themselves an easy target for this IMO.

I will be honest and say that I have zero trust in the current NASCAR leadership and their integrity. I'm not sure what level of manipulation could be exposed that would surprise me. However, I try to only make accusations when in my judgment there is specific evidence, and I don't like impugning drivers and teams with this stuff whether I like them or not. I'll criticize drivers for their actions and behavior, not for being an unwitting participant in a system they don't control. On the other hand, NASCAR is very much in control, and they fight transparency more than any major sports organization I'm aware of, and I pay attention to many. I don't have any problem speaking truth as I see it to that power.
 
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