Should the drivers know where the scoring loops are?

Should the drivers know where the scoring loops are on pit road?

  • Yes; they should know so they maintain pit road speed.

    Votes: 13 52.0%

  • No; they should not know where they can get away with speeding.

    Votes: 12 48.0%
  • Total voters
    25
HoneyBadger

HoneyBadger

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Simple question, should the drivers know where the scoring loops are?

Everyone knows my thought. Rules are rules.
 
It's amazing that a decorated reporter like Andy doesn't understand the importance of letting drivers know where pit road ends.
 
Yes. If not conspiracy theories will take only over. Secrecy usually is not a good thing.
 
Some will claim I am advocating unsafe procedures, but the manipulation allows for exploitation by the best. Besides with 83 foot loops there is little room manipulation. If that still sounds dangerous shorten them down to something like 50 foot and tighten up the parameters of manipulation.



But we must have easily enforced concrete rules that are open or common knowledge to insure demonstrated fairness. Without an open transparent system, many races will be tainted with the worst kind of controversy.
 
It doesn't matter what the pit road speed limit is . Drivers need to be right at the max in order not to lose any advantage given them by a good stop by their pit crew . When a pit stop is measured in tenths of a second , the driver's in/out time is critical . Saying they are allowed to be 5mph over the limit is redundant , noone in his right mind would give up that 5mph advantage and just drive the speed limit .
 
They are given a layout of pit road, including scoring loops, each and every Friday before the race weekend. Pocono was no different. Nothing has changed recently. This has been occurring for a long, long time.
 
I don't think NASCAR should be required to give them the layout of the timing loops on pit road, all thats required is a Clear marking of where pit road starts and ends with a set speed between. I don't think NASCAR should give them the variance either that just makes for another grey area and more confusion.
It is the TEAMS RESPONSIBILITY to work within the parameters of the rules and how best to take advantage of them. Apparently some where caught with their pants down after changes where made at Pocono. They should have checked and questioned if there where changes in the timing loops.
There's some crewchiefs who have some explaining to the Boss today.
 
Funny how nascar's new maps didn't work either. JJ said he waited until his rear bumper passed the pit exit painted line before speeding up, but he still got a penalty. Since I trust JJ and Chad's professionalism more than I do NASCAR and the track, I'm going with a misplaced pit exit line or transponder loop and not retarded CC's and drivers.
 
According to Bob Dillner who who was interviewed by the high heeled Krista Voda on speedcenter.....


NASCAR said a map was available with all of the scoring lines provided prior to the event. It was also common knowledge that the lines had been changed.


About 50% of the teams did review the maps prior. No one from the 48 team chose to review these prior to the event.


I do trust the competence of the 48 team, and many others who were penalized. To many mistakes to believe they all screwed up. But the words of the NASCAR officials as reported from Dillner to the high heeled Voda differ.



I just know I liked them heels....
 
From: http://www.jayski.com/cupnews.htm

NASCAR confident in pit road timing system: When it came to pit road, all Sunday's Pocono 400 presented by #NASCAR lacked was a fleet of cop cars with flashing lights and sirens. All told, NASCAR handed out 22 pit road speeding penalties, with most offenders clocked too fast at the exit from pit road. That easily eclipsed the Sprint Cup Series record of 14 speeding penalties at Kansas in 2006. #48-Jimmie Johnson was convinced there was something wrong with the final segment (or timing loop) on pit road. Nothing wrong, says NASCAR, just different. NASCAR measures pit road speed from the yellow line at the entrance to pit road to the yellow line at the exit. The full distance is divided into segments, and drivers must average the speed limit (plus a tolerance of 4.99 mph) through each segment.
The 2.5-mile race track was repaved this year, and pit road was lengthened. The number of segments grew from 10 to 11, and the length of the final segment increased from 56 to 83 feet. NASCAR provides specific information on the pit road configuration to any team that wants it. The changes from one year to the next, however, seems to have confounded more than one driver/crew chief combination, but NASCAR stood by the accuracy of its measurements.
"Our position is like it's always been -- yellow line to yellow line," said Robin Pemberton, NASCAR's vice president of competition. "This track's gone under a lot of reconfiguration since last year. It's all brand-new pit road, all brand-new loops. Positions have been changed since last year. Sections are smaller than they were last year throughout pit road -- and actually, the last section's a little bit bigger. But the bottom line is, every week when we go into a race track, there's maps that are printed back here for the crew chiefs to come get. Some choose to get 'em, some choose to measure their own lines, and some go off of last year's measurements."(NASCAR Wire Service)(6-11-2012)
 
Anyone have a list of which drivers earned pit road speeding penalty's and how many they earned?

I know:
JJ had 3
Ruetti had 3
Who else?
 
Some teams figured it out and some messed up. And not all of the penalties occurred in the last segment.

But I doubt that facts will get in the way of the tin foil hat crew's assertion that evil NASCAR is part of a JFK style cover up.
 
Greg said:
It was also common knowledge that the lines had been changed.
Click to expand...
I find it hard to believe it was "common knowledge" that the timing lines were moved or another one added. Was this brought up in the drivers meeting? If not, why not?
IMHO this is a case of na$car covering it's hiney.
 
Anyone have a list of which drivers earned pit road speeding penalty's and how many they earned?

I know:
JJ had 2
Ruetti had 3
Travis Kavil 4
AJ Allmendinger 2
Brad K 2
Kyle B 1
Harvick 1

There where 22 among 13 drivers.....that means 30 drivers had No Problem.
Who else had a speeding penalty?
 
List of pit road speeding penalties from the Pocono 400:
Travis Kvapil, too fast exiting on lap 3
AJ Allmendinger, too fast exiting on lap 3
Martin Truex Jr., too fast exiting on lap 4
AJ Allmendinger, too fast exiting on lap 7 (while serving penalty)
Clint Bowyer, too fast exiting on lap 17
Brad Keselowski, too fast exiting on lap 32
Jeff Gordon, too fast entering on lap 41
Jimmie Johnson, too fast exiting on lap 42
Kevin Harvick, too fast exiting on lap 42
David Reutimann, too fast entering on lap 42
Kyle Busch, too fast exiting on lap 43
Jimmie Johnson, too fast exiting on lap 43 (while serving penalty)
Travis Kvapil, too fast exiting on lap 45
David Reutimann, too fast exiting on lap 45 (while serving penalty)
Travis Kvapil, too fast exiting on lap 48 (while serving penalty)
David Ragan, too fast exiting on lap 48
Jeff Burton, too fast exiting on lap 67
JJ Yeley, too fast exiting on lap 69
Travis Kvapil, too fast exiting on lap 79
David Reutimann, too fast exiting on lap 106
Aric Almirola, too fast exiting on lap 125
Brad Keselowski, too fast exiting on lap 129​
 
SST55 said:
I find it hard to believe it was "common knowledge" that the timing lines were moved or another one added. Was this brought up in the drivers meeting? If not, why not?
IMHO this is a case of na$car covering it's hiney.
Click to expand...

During the race coverage one of the pit reporters actually went and got a map from the NASCAR hauler and showed it on camera. I'd say that was Common Knowledge and NASCAR was hiding nothing!

Geez do they have to hold the drivers hands and give them a map when they go wee wee?
 
Thanks DP! It's Monday I have a minor hangover and my memory is a lil fuzzy.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
List of pit road speeding penalties from the Pocono 400:​
Travis Kvapil, too fast exiting on lap 3​
AJ Allmendinger, too fast exiting on lap 3​
Martin Truex Jr., too fast exiting on lap 4​
AJ Allmendinger, too fast exiting on lap 7 (while serving penalty)​
Clint Bowyer, too fast exiting on lap 17​
Brad Keselowski, too fast exiting on lap 32​
Jeff Gordon, too fast entering on lap 41​
Jimmie Johnson, too fast exiting on lap 42​
Kevin Harvick, too fast exiting on lap 42​
David Reutimann, too fast entering on lap 42​
Kyle Busch, too fast exiting on lap 43​
Jimmie Johnson, too fast exiting on lap 43 (while serving penalty)​
Travis Kvapil, too fast exiting on lap 45​
David Reutimann, too fast exiting on lap 45 (while serving penalty)​
Travis Kvapil, too fast exiting on lap 48 (while serving penalty)​
David Ragan, too fast exiting on lap 48​
Jeff Burton, too fast exiting on lap 67​
JJ Yeley, too fast exiting on lap 69​
Travis Kvapil, too fast exiting on lap 79​
David Reutimann, too fast exiting on lap 106​
Aric Almirola, too fast exiting on lap 125​
Brad Keselowski, too fast exiting on lap 129​
Click to expand...

IMO, that list says it all. If teams don't pick up line maps unless nascar announces a change, they should make damn sure they announce the change. Also, teams were still getting penalized right to the end of the race.
 
FenderBumper said:
It's amazing that a decorated reporter like Andy doesn't understand the importance of letting drivers know where pit road ends.
Click to expand...
That's not what's at question though. Begining and end are fine, but whene they start putting timing loops at different places on pit road itself, that's where the problem is usually lies. Basically, the orange cone at the entrance and the white line at the exit should be IT, and nothing else.
 
VaDirt said:
That's not what's at question though. Begining and end are fine, but whene they start putting timing loops at different places on pit road itself, that's where the problem is usually lies. Basically, the orange cone at the entrance and the white line at the exit should be IT, and nothing else.
Click to expand...
Not trying to shoot down your idea but how are they to measure speed accurately then? I don't think that using separate radar guns is even possible. You can't measure from the time that they enter until they leave pit road because they are stopped for part of the time. Personally I think the scoring loops are the best answer.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
Not trying to shoot down your idea but how are they to measure speed accurately then? I don't think that using separate radar guns is even possible. You can't measure from the time that they enter until they leave pit road because they are stopped for part of the time. Personally I think the scoring loops are the best answer.
Click to expand...
A couple of randomly placed loops, or even telemetry. No one should ever be able to speed up and break the speed limit because they know where the timing loops are. I know they obviously can't simply time start to finish of pit road, but the speed limit needs to encompass all of pit road.
 
Not tryin to start anything , but I new a week ago the Jimmy was going to get a couple os speeding penalties this week . Robin/Randy /Ryan called me and told me . I think .
 
FenderBumper said:
It's amazing that a decorated reporter like Andy doesn't understand the importance of letting drivers know where pit road ends.
Click to expand...

It's amazing how simple you're being and not reading every single post I've made on the subject. The drivers know where pit road starts and ends. They know the speed limit. They know what their tachometer reads at proper pace speed. That's all they need to know.
 
Matthew2470 said:
Some teams figured it out and some messed up. And not all of the penalties occurred in the last segment.

But I doubt that facts will get in the way of the tin foil hat crew's assertion that evil NASCAR is part of a JFK style cover up.
Click to expand...

We all know it was a conspiracy to keep Brad Keselowski from winning....








:sarcasm:
 
Got to disagree Andy . Every time they got a guy for speeding , he used to say "Where was I speeding ? " Now they tell him . Exactly where , and exactly by how much . There is absolutely no room to argue.
 
Dale Earnhardt Jr.'s solution to managing it was simple, too: Go slow.

"They just told me about it and said be careful, so I was extra careful," he said. "I was probably ridiculously slow coming onto pit road, but I just don't want to get popped. I get burned on TV and by the fan base whenever we do anything stupid on pit road such as miss our stall. That takes me about a year and half to get over in a lot of people's eyes, so I can't make too many mistakes on pit road."
 
Here's a look at every race this season and the number of speeding penalties assessed:
• Dover: 2
• Coke 600: 5
• Darlington: 1
• Talladega: 3
• Richmond: 1
• Kansas: 1
• Texas: 4
• Martinsville: 4
• Fontana: 5
• Bristol: 7
• Las Vegas: 6
• Phoenix: 1
• Daytona: 3
PRE-POCONO SEASON TOTAL: 43
POCONO: 22​
 
Whatever the reason for the substantial increase in pit lane speed violations, we do know that there are is a constant between the races - - the drivers. There are different tracks, NASCAR places the sensors at different places, and pit lane lines are repainted. I tend to believe that it was one of the variables that caused the problem Sunday. I do not believe that all those drivers got together and decided to just go faster on pit lane at Pocono. There have been occasions when NASCAR has determined that the end of pit lane would be the second white line across the lane which is just stupid. If there is more than one line at the entyrance or exit, paint over the extra lines to avoid confusion. I do not know if it was the case at Pocono.
 
ted@economy said:
Got to disagree Andy . Every time they got a guy for speeding , he used to say "Where was I speeding ? " Now they tell him . Exactly where , and exactly by how much . There is absolutely no room to argue.
Click to expand...

There is room to argue. If you're speeding on pit road, that's that. The problem is the drivers know where the scoring loops are and are speeding between the loops. This time, they were caught and in large numbers.

You can't blame that on scoring loops, NASCAR, the networks or anything. That's the drivers pushing the limits and, yes, breaking the rules. They got caught and NASCAR shouldn't make concessions so they get away with it next time.
 
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