Street Races?

I think that was discussed a long time ago and the weight of these cars would tear up the street
 
Spotter22 said:
I think that was discussed a long time ago and the weight of these cars would tear up the street
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Yeah you need a lighter car for sure. But I do believe a street course is what this sport needs most. Attendance is always top notch for Indy and F1 at them
 
The last time I remember Nascar racing on street course was with the Xfinity (Busch) series in Mexico City. They did it for 4 years.went to Canada at the time also. Now they have full time series in both countries.
 
StandOnIt said:
The last time I remember Nascar racing on street course was with the Xfinity (Busch) series in Mexico City. They did it for 4 years.went to Canada at the time also. Now they have full time series in both countries.
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Hermanos Rodriguez and Gilles Villeneuve are stretching it as far as "street course" goes...both public parks and still built up to FIA Grade 1 standards. They don't differ much, if at all, from other permanent racing venues.
 
This smells like a NASCAR exec telling an NBC Sports journo to put the article out as a feeler.

To give this thing the time of day for a second, where would they even do a street race? The last thing they want to do is take away from some of their current events.

They're already in Fontana (ISC facility) and Michigan (ISC facility). That knocks out Belle Isle and Long Beach. They wouldn't do a Miami event due to Homestead (another ISC facility).
 
kkfan91 said:
It can be done

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The tweeters and race raters would have a field day with this. Single-file in under a lap and one pass on camera in the final two laps. Considering how well they receive races at New Hampshire, Pocono, IMS, etc. and fawn over the idea of plate racing at intermediates we're supposed to believe they'll love a strung-out, slow, super technical race like this?
 
kkfan91 said:
Um that is NASCAR
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It's been better in recent years.

I'm just reminded of I think it was the first time Nationwide raced at Elkhart Lake, and the 2nd half of that race was effectively one long caution period. Toronto has a reputation of being a tight track with the potential for yellow-filled crashfests for INDYCARS! Imagine stock cars where drivers don't mind bumping the guy in front of them out of the way.
 
Privateer said:
It's been better in recent years.

I'm just reminded of I think it was the first time Nationwide raced at Elkhart Lake, and the 2nd half of that race was effectively one long caution period. Toronto has a reputation of being a tight track with the potential for yellow-filled crashfests for INDYCARS! Imagine stock cars where drivers don't mind bumping the guy in front of them out of the way.
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Huh?
upload_2018-6-19_12-44-7.png

http://racing-reference.info/tracks/Road_America
 
Nate Ryan:
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Absolutely. It’s the best avenue for getting into some major metropolitan areas where NASCAR belongs (Seattle, New York, perhaps Denver) but has little chance of gaining a foothold with a permanent facility. It would add a wrinkle to the right-turn racing that has delivered some great action for the past decade at the two road-course stops in Cup. And despite there being a lack of current momentum, there is past evidence it’s worked for lower stock-car series in cities as large as Los Angeles in the past.
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Seattle - does anyone out there like racing? Honest question. The Northwest in general doesn't have much. There's also this nice track down in Portland that's right there in the city just about. Also, New York was granted a street race by Formula One to TV power player Leo Hindery, and nothing came of it.

Dustin Long:
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It would be a good move to get into markets the sport doesn’t race in now, but the key question is what will the racing be like? For those who imagine it would be beating and banging on a tight circuit, well, there’s less of that now on short tracks, in part, because of how little contact damages fenders and can create tire rubs. Open up the fenders then that could encourage the type of racing.
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Good technical answer.

Daniel McFadin:
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Please? There’s precedent for it with the old NASCAR Southwest Tour holding three races in the streets of Los Angeles from 1998-2000. I sincerely believe a stock car race on a street course would be a better product than IndyCar could ever provide. With the close quarters, it would encourage more beating and banging and there’s no pesky penalties for “avoidable contact.” Like this year’s Roval race, let’s just try it once.
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First, any street race that lasted 3 years and then went away is a sign the finances didn't work out, and there's a long list of races that didn't work out. It also costs $10 million to build the facility for one weekend.


You want beating and banging, NASCAR doesn't do local yellows, we're going to have one long caution flag the 2nd half of the race. I like stock cars road racing, it's why I believe Trans-Am as a series can work, but how NASCAR drivers race and how the NASCAR race gets officiated would have to change unless you want the race to become a tedious bore.

Dan Beaver:
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Absolutely. NASCAR’s schedule is already among the most diverse in all sports.
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???

It's less diverse than USAC Silver Crowns.
 
StandOnIt said:
Huh?
View attachment 35154
http://racing-reference.info/tracks/Road_America
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Saturday, June 19, 2010 at Road America, Elkhart Lake, WI
50 laps on a 4.048 mile road course (202.4 miles)

Time of race: 2:57:17
Average Speed: 68.501 mph
Pole Speed: 108.076 mph

Yellow flag at lap 28.
Green flag at lap 30.
Caution flag at lap 31.
Green flag at lap 34.
Caution flag at lap 38.
Green flag at lap 39.
Caution flag at lap 40.
Green flag at lap 42.
Caution flag at lap 46.
Green flag at lap 48.
Checkered flag at lap 50.

That's hell.

I think there have been a couple that have also suffered from green-white-checkered hell.
 
Privateer said:
Saturday, June 19, 2010 at Road America, Elkhart Lake, WI
50 laps on a 4.048 mile road course (202.4 miles)

Time of race: 2:57:17
Average Speed: 68.501 mph
Pole Speed: 108.076 mph

Yellow flag at lap 28.
Green flag at lap 30.
Caution flag at lap 31.
Green flag at lap 34.
Caution flag at lap 38.
Green flag at lap 39.
Caution flag at lap 40.
Green flag at lap 42.
Caution flag at lap 46.
Green flag at lap 48.
Checkered flag at lap 50.

That's hell.

I think there have been a couple that have also suffered from green-white-checkered hell.
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In your world Bud, I agree to disagree, especially in recent years. Road courses have been some of the better traces
 
For the record that Toronto race I posted had 3 cautions for 7 laps...out of 35
 
The aforementioned Los Angeles street race NASCAR ran for a few years in the 1990s:


Circuit Gilles Villeneueve was a street course and NASCAR did fine there.
 
Privateer said:
Seattle - does anyone out there like racing? Honest question. The Northwest in general doesn't have much. There's also this nice track down in Portland that's right there in the city just about.
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Portland had a K&N West race several years ago and it was an enormous draw. 40,000 or something like that IIRC. Fans show up to the short tracks up there. A NASCAR race in Portland would be huge.

Privateer said:
This smells like a NASCAR exec telling an NBC Sports journo to put the article out as a feeler.

To give this thing the time of day for a second, where would they even do a street race? The last thing they want to do is take away from some of their current events.

They're already in Fontana (ISC facility) and Michigan (ISC facility). That knocks out Belle Isle and Long Beach. They wouldn't do a Miami event due to Homestead (another ISC facility).
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It gives you the option to race in Denver, New York, Seattle, Portland and Minneapolis/St. Paul.
 
I'd rather see IMSA bring a street race to Phoenix or Vegas than NASCAR, but I'm not opposed to a street race if it gets rid of a cookie cutter date.
 
Somebody must have been bored during the off week to come up with this.

I do not like street races. They are typically boring in IndyCar. It's a shame tney use those instead of some of the better road course tracks.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
It gives you the option to race in Denver, New York, Seattle, Portland and Minneapolis/St. Paul.
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Pikes Peak?

Lime Rock?

There's a Portland permanent road course facility right across the river from the city, and it's been there for 58 years. Building a street course in Portland would be the height of insanity when street course events cost $10 million (source: Trackside has mentioned the number several times) to setup over 8 or so weeks.

Anyone that mentions New York I question if they follow industry news much at all. If NASCAR wanted to have a race there, their best bet was the proposed 3/4-mile oval on Staten Island which was blown in a fiasco of a public meeting. Since then there was a failed Formula One race after it was given 5 years' worth of postponements and a Formula E race which was a Mickey Mouse track design completely unsuitable for Formula One, let alone stock car racing, and where no one attending knew or cared who won as humorously described by Parker Kligerman. https://nascar.nbcsports.com/2017/0...tending-a-race-is-an-out-of-focus-experience/

If NASCAR goes this direction, which I expect they will for monetary reasons and because I suspect this was put out as a feeler, it just signals to me they have given up partially on their product. I watch Indycar, I watch Long Beach, Belle Isle, Toronto. They're all big events and are important for business reasons being in large cities, but don't sit and lie to me that they're good racing events compared to other alternatives. If NASCAR actually wants to go this route, to put on a good event they need to completely change their road racing practices from a driving and officiating perspective.
 
Privateer said:
Pikes Peak?

Lime Rock?

There's a Portland permanent road course facility right across the river from the city, and it's been there for 58 years. Building a street course in Portland would be the height of insanity when street course events cost $10 million (source: Trackside has mentioned the number several times) to setup over 8 or so weeks.

Anyone that mentions New York I question if they follow industry news much at all. If NASCAR wanted to have a race there, their best bet was the proposed 3/4-mile oval on Staten Island which was blown in a fiasco of a public meeting. Since then there was a failed Formula One race after it was given 5 years' worth of postponements and a Formula E race which was a Mickey Mouse track design completely unsuitable for Formula One, let alone stock car racing, and where no one attending knew or cared who won as humorously described by Parker Kligerman. https://nascar.nbcsports.com/2017/0...tending-a-race-is-an-out-of-focus-experience/

If NASCAR goes this direction, which I expect they will for monetary reasons and because I suspect this was put out as a feeler, it just signals to me they have given up partially on their product. I watch Indycar, I watch Long Beach, Belle Isle, Toronto. They're all big events and are important for business reasons being in large cities, but don't sit and lie to me that they're good racing events compared to other alternatives. If NASCAR actually wants to go this route, to put on a good event they need to completely change their road racing practices from a driving and officiating perspective.
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I agree about Portland.

As for New York, I'd say run some XFINITY or Truck races in New Jersey, but that's so close to Dover it won't happen.
 
The thing is dont have street courses that are boring or flat, there are some many interesting unconventional things that could be tried with public roads as a race course. Heck when I drive around my area I will think of how it make a cool race track, though probably more for rally then anything else.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
I agree about Portland.

As for New York, I'd say run some XFINITY or Truck races in New Jersey, but that's so close to Dover it won't happen.
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Also NJMP is in South Jersey aka East Philadelphia, it's not a New York suburb.
 
kkfan91 said:
The thing is dont have street courses that are boring or flat, there are some many interesting unconventional things that could be tried with public roads as a race course. Heck when I drive around my area I will think of how it make a cool race track, though probably more for rally then anything else.
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That course they had in Baltimore produced some A+++ racing in IndyCar. I wanted to see stock cars on that so bad.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
That course they had in Baltimore produced some A+++ racing in IndyCar. I wanted to see stock cars on that so bad.
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Politicians killed that one as what they were fine with in year 1 did not become fine in year 3, which is something else you have to deal with in street races that you don't with permanent facilities.

Some of them are not bad. I think St. Petersburg is a good course and it's a good event. But most of them "you want to be right downtown, you want to be right by landmarks", chances are open space is very restricted and so your course is effectively forced on you. Monaco for example today is so unsuitable for F1 cars and it has a lot of after the fact chicanes added to it just to slow the cars down instead of being real passing opportunities. F1 has to have Monaco most feel, but it's become a significant turnoff for a percentage of their fanbase and after this year's race it has even reached the drivers where Lewis Hamilton wants to talk to Prince Albert about redesigning the track.
 
kkfan91 said:
Also NJMP is in South Jersey aka East Philadelphia, it's not a New York suburb.
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Definitely a Philadelphia suburb, but not too far from New York. I feel like that's as close as you're going to get though, unless you do a street race in some ****hole like Secaucus or the Meadowlands.
 
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