The future of the WEC

FLRacingFan

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I see whats going on here, but I'm not biting the bait. Lol.
People underestimate Super GT. GT500 has tons of aero and legitimate tire wars. I don’t think they’d hold up in a real endurance race though. I do think LMH/LMDh is probably a bit heavier than necessary.

I’m pretty surprised about GT300 being quicker than GTE though.
 

FLRacingFan

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Kobayashi wins the hyperpole.

They’re all within a second of each other in Hypercar.

Alpine magically found speed suddenly? Or what’s the deal?
 

Doc Austin

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They’re all within a second of each other in Hypercar.

Alpine magically found speed suddenly? Or what’s the deal?
Alpine needs to win this race and go into the finale with a points advantage. People are not paying attention but if Alpine can win this championship, it could be the biggest title upset in endurance racing history.
 

Doc Austin

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Here's some old footage of the Toyota 7 prototype. In the beginning of the video is a lot of footage of the old Fuji with it's terrifying banked first turn.

 

Doc Austin

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The Fuji result was a little disappointing in that Toyota dominated, but the Alpine team kept themselves in the hunt for the driver's championship. The drivers of the No.8 Toyota and the No.36 Alpine are tied on 121 points each. It's all to play for and whichever car finishes higher will win the title. Compared to last year's blow out, at worst this season has been good between these two teams.

I have not seen the race yet, so all I can really comment on is what a good fight Alpine has put up. No matter how it shakes out from here, Alpine can be proud of what they have achieved this year.
 

donthaveanickname

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The Fuji result was a little disappointing in that Toyota dominated, but the Alpine team kept themselves in the hunt for the driver's championship. The drivers of the No.8 Toyota and the No.36 Alpine are tied on 121 points each. It's all to play for and whichever car finishes higher will win the title. Compared to last year's blow out, at worst this season has been good between these two teams.

I have not seen the race yet, so all I can really comment on is what a good fight Alpine has put up. No matter how it shakes out from here, Alpine can be proud of what they have achieved this year.
Doesn't this mean that Toyota will be massively disadvantaged at Bahrain so Alpine is the clear favorite?
 

Doc Austin

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Doesn't this mean that Toyota will be massively disadvantaged at Bahrain so Alpine is the clear favorite?
Or, being a French car with French drivers, and the French ACO making the rules, who really knows? We will see what they do with the BOP, if anything.
 

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I think they might have a shot at Bahrain, I think Jim is friends with the Crown Prince of Bahrain and said something about it making better financial sense than Fuji.
 

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That’s tough. Unless they come up with some money pretty quickly it’s quite possible we’ve seen the last of that program. I don’t think we’ll be seeing partial entries allowed next season.
 

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The real shame is the Glick was finally competitive and running away with Monza when they hit trouble. At that rate they could have been contenders for Bahrain and even next year. It would be a shame to lose them, but we have so many new cars coming it we have that to look forward to.
 

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That’s tough. Unless they come up with some money pretty quickly it’s quite possible we’ve seen the last of that program. I don’t think we’ll be seeing partial entries allowed next season.
Have turn-key customer cars waiting and I think that's what Jim and company are hanging their hats on. With only so many prototypes to go around, I feel as if someone will eventually cave on Glickenhaus. If Glickenhaus gets a customer, I can see them running a full season.

It sucks, Jim has honestly done a fine job with the program. Drivers and personnel alike have high-marks for the programme.
 

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That’s tough. Unless they come up with some money pretty quickly it’s quite possible we’ve seen the last of that program. I don’t think we’ll be seeing partial entries allowed next season.
I might be wrong but I think the best way to grow a series is to make it easier for the teams to race, not harder. I also can't see the sense of turning away good entries. Right now, we need every single car we can get.
 

FLRacingFan

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I might be wrong but I think the best way to grow a series is to make it easier for the teams to race, not harder. I also can't see the sense of turning away good entries. Right now, we need every single car we can get.
Growth won’t be an issue. They’ll be oversubscribed and turning away entries because they don’t have the capacity.
 

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Growth won’t be an issue. They’ll be oversubscribed and turning away entries because they don’t have the capacity.
I remain unconvinced we are going to have too many cars, but that would be a nice problem.

I'm not crazy about turning good entries away. If it ever does get that big just give the GT cars their own race like IMSA did with the GTP and lights in one race, and GTs in another.
 

FLRacingFan

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I remain unconvinced we are going to have too many cars, but that would be a nice problem.

I'm not crazy about turning good entries away. If it ever does get that big just give the GT cars their own race like IMSA did with the GTP and lights in one race, and GTs in another.
If they were to split races there’d still be the issue of freight capacity and paddock space. It’s quite possible the GT teams would no longer find it financially viable if they were no longer a part of the big show either. And the traffic is a key aspect to the racing.

They were already maxed out at 39 this year before G-Drive were run off and said that’s the highest they can go outside of Le Mans. The previous high was 36 in the first Super Season I think. They don’t take one-off entries anymore like when Audi and Porsche would run a third LMP1 car at Spa for Le Mans prep. I think Corvette did the same thing last year, and did a one-off at China several years ago too. Those things were possible when there was space but they’re going to prioritize everyone who can commit full-time from now on.
 

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Doing some quick math - in 2023 full season, 11 or 12 cars in Hypercar leaves 27 or 28 spots for LMP2 and GTE-Am. There are 27 combined in those two classes at Bahrain so if everyone comes back they’ll be pretty much maxed out again. Probably several entries turned away. If Glickenhaus come prove they have the funding for a full season they’ll take priority over prospective entries from the other two classes.

In 2024 full season, 17 to 20 entries in Hypercar leaves 19 to 22 spots open. That’s when LMP2 likely becomes a Le Mans-only class, and with GTE going away in favor of much more accessible GT3 that year they should easily fill out a GT3-Am grid.

Come 2024 for Le Mans I’d like to see something like 25 Hypercar, 10-15 LMP2, 20-25 GT3-Am. Max capacity of 62, with an already extensive reserve list each year. Going to be a tough job for the selection committee in the future - probably much tougher than for the NCAA Tournament!
 

FLRacingFan

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As far as future GT3-Am field is concerned, if they can fit 18-22 cars full season and limit two cars per OEM I’ll imagine we’ll see all of the following models:

Mercedes-AMG GT
Ford Mustang
Ferrari 296
Porsche 911
Unnamed Lexus/Toyota/GR concept
BMW M4
Lamborghini Huracán
McLaren 720S
Aston Martin Vantage
Corvette Z06
Acura/Honda NSX

Compared to now where GTE only has customer models from Ferrari, Porsche, and Aston. Since it’s a customer-driven class it’ll be interesting to see if they actually limit number of cars per OEM. Not sure how thrilled all of those guys with existing relationships with Ferrari and Porsche would be to be told they have to run something else to stay in the series.

Left out - Bentley Continental and Nissan GT-R are no longer supported and going the way of the dodo, Audi R8 is probably finished after homologation ends after 2024.
 

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People underestimate Super GT. GT500 has tons of aero and legitimate tire wars. I don’t think they’d hold up in a real endurance race though. I do think LMH/LMDh is probably a bit heavier than necessary.

I’m pretty surprised about GT300 being quicker than GTE though.
I think Super GT still uses the "Class 1" rules DTM used between 2019-2020. These cars are full-blown prototypes that don't have a lot in common with Touring Cars
 

Doc Austin

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If they were to split races there’d still be the issue of freight capacity and paddock space. It’s quite possible the GT teams would no longer find it financially viable if they were no longer a part of the big show either. And the traffic is a key aspect to the racing.
It's possible to split the prototypes and GT cars. The GT cars at one time had their own FIA championship. Also, Group C ran alone. It could probably be done again. You just need enough cars. You can't turn entries away because they may never come back.
 

FLRacingFan

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It's possible to split the prototypes and GT cars. The GT cars at one time had their own FIA championship. Also, Group C ran alone. It could probably be done again. You just need enough cars. You can't turn entries away because they may never come back.
There’s still plenty of opportunity to run ACO-affiliated racing between ELMS, AsLMS, and IMSA. A good number of WEC teams already bounce between the series as well. There will always be competition for Le Mans auto bids and that keeps teams involved.
 

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I'de like more prototypes, but I am cautiously optimistic things are going the right way. The convergence has been a miracle.
 

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I read that the rules changed three times while Toyota was building the current car, so the new one was necessary to take advantage of that.
 

FLRacingFan

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Rumored prospective locations for the eighth race in 2024…Germany, England, China, Qatar (Losail, possibly the favorite right now).

Gross.
 

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Rumored prospective locations for the eighth race in 2024…Germany, England, China, Qatar (Losail, possibly the favorite right now).

Gross.
Germany makes too much sense, you should know that by now. Silverstone always put on a good show as well.

Get the lawnmowers out, let's go and get the Hockenheim "oval" back for WEC. That would be an incredible experience.
 

FLRacingFan

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Germany makes too much sense, you should know that by now. Silverstone always put on a good show as well.

Get the lawnmowers out, let's go and get the Hockenheim "oval" back for WEC. That would be an incredible experience.
It should 100% be Silverstone, Nurburgring, or Hockenheim. It’ll wind up being Qatar because reasons.

Blows my mind that not even ELMS takes advantage of any of those tracks.
 
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