Top Ten things wrong with NASCAR.

Ok, I really hate to be a buzz kill here, but lets get serious.


The sport from a competition standpoint sucks.





Now, I get it, the way these boards work is that everyone has a different opinion, a different view.

So here are my personal views on why the current state of the sport is at its lowest, blandest, most boring point in the 28 years I've been a fan. You can agree, disagree, give your views, whatever.

From the top, and in no real order:

1. The emergence of the mega-teams.

Im not talking about Junior Johnson from back in the day here, either. Im talking about the new-york-yankee-ish way certain teams have literally taken over. Change the outfit to fit the year, but HMS, JGR and Roush know who they are.

I think Mega teams is something that couldn't be avoided. Anyone who has ever came into the business as an owner has strived for the same goal, to be a mega team. Hendrick, Gibb and Roush have all accomplished that goal. We shouldn't put them down for accomplishing goals.

2.The prime-time TV move and network switching chaos.

Why in the hell NASCAR has chosen to cut the throats of local tracks all over the country would be beyond me.
That is, if I were too stupid to recognize a greed driven desire for higher tv ratings.

Friday or Saturday nights are for local tracks. Sunday afternoon is where the top Nascar series belongs. Plus, I never can keep up with when a race is on or what station anymore.

Every sport has to have viewers to survive, I do not blame NASCAR for having more prime time races. I love Saturday Night races myself! Plus, if your local track is a good one, they will sale sets no matter what is on TV that night.

3.The contrived false drama vs actual competition aspect.

C'mon...this is obvious. From phantom cautions to green-white-checker finishes to the new(and idiotic) double file restarts. Remember, what works on a hot summer night at a bullring in person is one thing--what works at the top level is different.

What is so funny is before Green-White-Checker finishes, people were complaining about how many races ended under caution. I for one think that Green-White-Checker and double file restarts have helped the sport tremendously for entertainment value. I don't really think it is false drama by anymeans.

4. The incredible way NASCAR has managed to find about 30 of the blandest, most cookie-cutter , drab, lifeless robotic individuals on the planet to drive the blandest, most cookie cutter, drab , regressive shoebox cars on the planet. And speaking of cookie cutter....

I don't care who the driver is or how they act at their "home track" if they get called up to the big leagues, some rough edges will get ironed off. Of course there are some exceptions to this rule. However, with as much drama as their has been the past several weeks with personalities clashing, I don't know exactly what you are wanting to see.

5.The blandest, most cookie cutter, drab, personality free tracks on the planet with a few, very few, exceptions. Kansas? Chicago? Vegas? What?

I agree, some of the tracks fit this description, but def. not all of them.

6. A simply stupid , false drama building made-for-tv 'chase' format to decide the champion. WTH is up with that? Its the same old generic pretty-boy drivers in the same old indistinguiable cars.

I will be the first to say that there are glitches in the chase system, BUT, it does make things more interesting and feel more "sports like" to have some sort of playoff system. And yes, it is good for ratings.

7. The introduction of Japanese cars. And yeah, I know they might be made by Uncle Jimmy Earl down on main street, but if you think Toyota is an American car, you were dropped on your head as a kid. Its bad enough we have Government Motors now after all. And Toyota makes a fine vehicle, dont misunderstand. Its just simply a break from tradition that was purely yet another greed driven ratings move.

I can see your point here for sure. But, no matter how much we resist, foreign cars are going to make their way into the sport. And they for sure will now with the problems that the major american manufacturers are having.

8. Touched upon above, the COT has simply single handedly struck a huge blow to competition. Its a backward thinking shoebox that erases years of automotive design evolution.

I have to admit that you have a point here, but I do think that the drivers are alot safer in the COT.

9. Chic terms and big-mouthed ex drivers as announcers.

"Dirty air" might be real trendy, but we get it already. And about those big mouthed ex drivers? Ha...he deserves his own number on this list.

10. Darrell Waltrip. The most biased and ridiculous creature to ever sit in a broadcast booth. He is grating, irritating, usually inaccurate and obviously has a huge man-crush on certain Hendrick drivers....and reminds us of that about every 12.5 seconds.

Ok, 9, 10 to me are talking about the same thing. I have to tell ya, I don't see why everyone has such a problem with DW and has such a crush on TNT coverage. Honestly, atleast DW is a past champion and has some right to talk. What the heck does Wally and Kyle bring to the table? Aside from that DW shows passion for the sport where those two sound like they could be calling a golf game. So I def. do not think that DW is bad by any means. There has been times he has gotten on my nerves for sure, but I will take him over the TNT coverage anyday. I personaly am looking forward to DJ on ESPN.
 
I still don't get the arguement by people saying Toyota doesn't belong in NASCAR. These are the same people that watch the races on their Sony or Panasonic televisions.
 
I still don't get the arguement by people saying Toyota doesn't belong in NASCAR. These are the same people that watch the races on their Sony or Panasonic televisions.

I agree!

At least when you buy a Toyota or Honda someone who built the car (Uncle Earl) draws a paycheck that gets spent in the U.S. If you buy a Ford or Chevy (with a few exceptions) a paycheck is spent in Mexico or Canada.

I ordered my Silverado with specific requests knowing it would be built here in Indiana.
 
True

yea I love Nascar but it definitely has it share of downfalls. this post was pretty dead on, but the problems don't seem to really take away from Nascar.
 
Well, thanks to all that replied.

Lets see if we can sum this up then in a semi-agreeable manner.


Ok, what opinions did we get out of this?

Same old story: people are pretty divided on the state of the sport in the current era. I was surprised at exactly how many saw it as stable and acceptable, frankly. That, on the surface, could make one question their own perceptions.

If not for one bit of reality.

The sport, rating-wise, IS in a downward spiral. That's not illusion and its not opinion. In ticket sales as well as media regardless of how we each view it personally.Down 6.5 percent in ticket sales this year, TV ratings down 11 percent. 11 percent from last years already weak ratings to be clear.

Now, for the weak- economy blamers, the big TV drop is very, very telling. It cost no more to watch on television now than it did ten years ago.

That fact alone should encourage a re-thinking by the sanctioning body as to the current state of the sport. Assuming a dismissive and cavalier attitude towards fans(by NASCAR admin and press) is certainly not advisable,either. In fact, give the very nature of the sport, NASCAR is much more fan dependent than most stick and ball sports could ever be. Sponsors are tossed out as important, and they are, but without fans the sponsors are gone at any rate.

And remember: Big corporations are as aware as anyone that ratings are dropping.

Now, NASCAR may not want to regard the fans as the important ingredient in this recipe, but the reality is, they---WE--are.

So the numbers are there, the ratings are off at the end of the day.

All that's left for us all to do, frankly, is argue as to the reasons.

I just have a sad feeling at some point in the near future we will be arguing as to what finally killed the sport entirely.

Eat food without salt long enough and you don't even miss it I guess.

They---the sanctioning body---could of course, choose to listen to us,the fans, and reverse the downward content driven spiral(Because that is absolutely what is driving it downward).

But they damned sure wont listen when we cant even agree amongst ourselves that there is a problem to begin with.



Thanks again to everyone REGARDLESS of opinion.:beerbang:

Ok, That's my last say,I'm off to thread games now.:D
 
Ok, 9, 10 to me are talking about the same thing. I have to tell ya, I don't see why everyone has such a problem with DW and has such a crush on TNT coverage. Honestly, atleast DW is a past champion and has some right to talk. What the heck does Wally and Kyle bring to the table? Aside from that DW shows passion for the sport where those two sound like they could be calling a golf game. So I def. do not think that DW is bad by any means. There has been times he has gotten on my nerves for sure, but I will take him over the TNT coverage anyday. I personaly am looking forward to DJ on ESPN.

I guess it depends on what you are looking for. Successful drivers (or any other sport for that matter) may not make the best announcer. Just because they were able to do it does not mean they can convey that to their audience. As to Waltrip, its not all his fault. I just don't think the team he's with is the best. Dead air needs to be filled and DW is willing to fill it. Wally and Kyle are better at taking turns thus making it sound more like a conversation. And even tho they never won much they know what they're talking about.
 
Well, thanks to all that replied.

Lets see if we can sum this up then in a semi-agreeable manner.


Ok, what opinions did we get out of this?

Same old story: people are pretty divided on the state of the sport in the current era. I was surprised at exactly how many saw it as stable and acceptable, frankly. That, on the surface, could make one question their own perceptions.

If not for one bit of reality.

The sport, rating-wise, IS in a downward spiral. That's not illusion and its not opinion. In ticket sales as well as media regardless of how we each view it personally.Down 6.5 percent in ticket sales this year, TV ratings down 11 percent. 11 percent from last years already weak ratings to be clear.

Now, for the weak- economy blamers, the big TV drop is very, very telling. It cost no more to watch on television now than it did ten years ago.

That fact alone should encourage a re-thinking by the sanctioning body as to the current state of the sport. Assuming a dismissive and cavalier attitude towards fans(by NASCAR admin and press) is certainly not advisable,either. In fact, give the very nature of the sport, NASCAR is much more fan dependent than most stick and ball sports could ever be. Sponsors are tossed out as important, and they are, but without fans the sponsors are gone at any rate.

And remember: Big corporations are as aware as anyone that ratings are dropping.

Now, NASCAR may not want to regard the fans as the important ingredient in this recipe, but the reality is, they---WE--are.

So the numbers are there, the ratings are off at the end of the day.

All that's left for us all to do, frankly, is argue as to the reasons.

I just have a sad feeling at some point in the near future we will be arguing as to what finally killed the sport entirely.

Eat food without salt long enough and you don't even miss it I guess.

They---the sanctioning body---could of course, choose to listen to us,the fans, and reverse the downward content driven spiral(Because that is absolutely what is driving it downward).

But they damned sure wont listen when we cant even agree amongst ourselves that there is a problem to begin with.



Thanks again to everyone REGARDLESS of opinion.:beerbang:

Ok, That's my last say,I'm off to thread games now.:D

This has been thought provoking. I was happy to see things remain civil and productive. :beerbang:

This qoute:
TV ratings down 11 percent. 11 percent from last years already weak ratings to be clear.

Got me to wondering how other sports were doing. I looked at golf, baseball and football and the TV ratings are almost identical across the board for the last two years. :growl: I could not find ticket sales number for the other sports.
 
TV ratings should be a clearer sign than attendance. The attendance has fallen off because of the economy. TV ratings drop because of lack of interest.
 
This has been thought provoking. I was happy to see things remain civil and productive. :beerbang:

This qoute:

Got me to wondering how other sports were doing. I looked at golf, baseball and football and the TV ratings are almost identical across the board for the last two years. :growl: I could not find ticket sales number for the other sports.

With football, they blackmail everyone in to buying overpriced tickets with blackouts so they do sell out every game. :rolleyes:
 
The sport, rating-wise, IS in a downward spiral. That's not illusion and its not opinion. In ticket sales as well as media regardless of how we each view it personally.Down 6.5 percent in ticket sales this year, TV ratings down 11 percent. 11 percent from last years already weak ratings to be clear.


Every sport is down in ratings. Consider this, when ratings were higher six years ago, NASCAR was getting beat out by boring ass golf, basketball and baseball every week except Daytona and Charlotte. Now, they're beating all of those stick and ball sports in ratings (except boring football, which will always be the thing America revolves around:() every week. If NASCAR's hurting, every other sport is hurting a lot more.

And for your next task, look and see which lower rated sports get more attention from CBS, FOX, ESPN, ABC and NBC.:rolleyes: ESPN had baseball offseason on SportsCenter as a more important story than Jimmie Johnson winning his third consecutive championship.

Oh, be careful what you wish for. When the ESPN announcers are boring you to sleep because they have nothing to offer, and you're missing every wreck, every lead change, every position change and every interesting thing on track because ESPN's in the Dish Tech Center or promoting baseball, don't complain to us.

Of all the motorsports stuff I watch, from our local races on public TV to ASA on MASN to NASCAR and everything in between, ESPN's TV coverage is THE worst. Worse than SPEED, worse than Versus, worse than local amateur footage of short track races.
 
"Every sport is down in ratings. Consider this, when ratings were higher six years ago, NASCAR was getting beat out by boring ass golf, basketball and baseball every week except Daytona and Charlotte. Now, they're beating all of those stick and ball sports in ratings (except boring football, which will always be the thing America revolves around) every week. If NASCAR's hurting, every other sport is hurting a lot more."



Its not so much a comparison to other sports so much as it is a comparison to itself from a few years back.
 
This is just one fan's opinion but I believe that NA__AR could decide whether it wants to be strictly entertainment and continue to revolve solely around the drivers and "trick" up the sport with "Lucky Dawgs," "Phantom Debris Cautions" in the last stages of a race , make rules ensuring the biggest names in the series ALWAYS are in the starting field, and measure the quality of a race by the number of cars finishing on the lead lap. Or, does it want to be a legitimate competitive sport encouraging new teams and drivers to compete?

From where I stand it appears that NA__AR s attempting to straddle the fence and play both sides, and doing an only so-so job at both. In addition to the economy, I think the attendance and rating declines are an indication that NA__AR is losing credibility with both sides.

But, that's just my personal opinion...
 
This is just one fan's opinion but I believe that NA__AR could decide whether it wants to be strictly entertainment and continue to revolve solely around the drivers and "trick" up the sport with "Lucky Dawgs," "Phantom Debris Cautions" in the last stages of a race , make rules ensuring the biggest names in the series ALWAYS are in the starting field, and measure the quality of a race by the number of cars finishing on the lead lap. Or, does it want to be a legitimate competitive sport encouraging new teams and drivers to compete?

From where I stand it appears that NA__AR s attempting to straddle the fence and play both sides, and doing an only so-so job at both. In addition to the economy, I think the attendance and rating declines are an indication that NA__AR is losing credibility with both sides.

But, that's just my personal opinion...

:cheers:
 
I still don't get the arguement by people saying Toyota doesn't belong in NASCAR. These are the same people that watch the races on their Sony or Panasonic televisions.
It doesn't matter where that car is made, the American people will always call it a Japanese car and for the right reason.

Something to ponder regarding that issue. We Americans are proud of our sports, and we pull for Americans even in sports we seldom, or never watch. Track and field is a good example of that and winter sports as well. But in the sports we have here in America, sports that we watch week in and week out, we take it for granted that the majority of the players (teams etc.) are American. While we will accept foreigners gladly in small numbers, when they grow to become the majority, we Americans tend to begin to fall out of favor with that sport. Case in point, the Indianapolis 500 and USAC, or as it became, CART. At first, a couple of Italian or Brazilian drivers made it look cool that the field was beginning to have an international look. But when those foreigners began to dominate the series, the fan base began to dwindle. Look at what they have today, trying to survive a split that nearly killed the who thing. Another case in point is the LPGA. Take a look at the leader board this next time you pick up a Sunday paper and just count the number of names that appear to be oriental. It's getting to the point that Asian women have overtaken not just American women, but Anglo women altogether. The commissioner was forced to resign because the number of tournaments has fallen off as well as the sponsorships. Is foreign participation part of the problem?

There are other instances as well, but the point here is that if it didn't make any difference that Toyota was part of NASCAR these days, no one would mention it, but the fact that it is mentioned, no rarely, but often means that it is a problem. How big is something that NASCAR will have to decide. But I can tell you this, if for some reason Dodge, or Ford pulls out of the sport and NASCAR decides to replace them with Honda or Nissan, or any other foreign manufacturer, the sport will decline faster than it is now.

That is just the American way, rightly or wrongly.
 
It doesn't matter where that car is made, the American people will always call it a Japanese car and for the right reason.

Something to ponder regarding that issue. We Americans are proud of our sports, and we pull for Americans even in sports we seldom, or never watch. Track and field is a good example of that and winter sports as well. But in the sports we have here in America, sports that we watch week in and week out, we take it for granted that the majority of the players (teams etc.) are American. While we will accept foreigners gladly in small numbers, when they grow to become the majority, we Americans tend to begin to fall out of favor with that sport. Case in point, the Indianapolis 500 and USAC, or as it became, CART. At first, a couple of Italian or Brazilian drivers made it look cool that the field was beginning to have an international look. But when those foreigners began to dominate the series, the fan base began to dwindle. Look at what they have today, trying to survive a split that nearly killed the who thing. Another case in point is the LPGA. Take a look at the leader board this next time you pick up a Sunday paper and just count the number of names that appear to be oriental. It's getting to the point that Asian women have overtaken not just American women, but Anglo women altogether. The commissioner was forced to resign because the number of tournaments has fallen off as well as the sponsorships. Is foreign participation part of the problem?

There are other instances as well, but the point here is that if it didn't make any difference that Toyota was part of NASCAR these days, no one would mention it, but the fact that it is mentioned, no rarely, but often means that it is a problem. How big is something that NASCAR will have to decide. But I can tell you this, if for some reason Dodge, or Ford pulls out of the sport and NASCAR decides to replace them with Honda or Nissan, or any other foreign manufacturer, the sport will decline faster than it is now.

That is just the American way, rightly or wrongly.

Define American! As a "Yankee" am I an American? I always find it interesting how "The south" and "The north" vary on opinions.

Me, I just LOVE racing! I am going to the local track this next Saturday to watch the Super late models race.

Yaall are invited... :beerbang:
 
Hmmm, maybe you don't know the definition of American, but everyone else in the world does. Yankee, redneck, whatever.
 
Anyone else see this response at Yahoo sports mailbag...Not bad at all

And finally, Roger Boggs of Dayton, Ohio, has a litany of ideas he pulled out of his very own suggestion box:

Cars of Tomorrow must replicate Cars of Today?

Raise the entry fee to $20,000 more than the last place payout (Blaney got $85,938 for finishing 43rd) to get rid of the backmarkers who start, run 20 laps, cause three wrecks, then go home?

All cars are to have solid color paint jobs, with nothing other than the primary sponsor on the hood and rear fenders, and nothing on the doors or roof other than the car number?

Corporate sponsors limited to maximum of $1,000,000 per team?

Manufacturer sponsors limited to maximum contribution of $50,000,000 total of cash, materials, and services per season (GM spent 120+million) divided equally between registered teams?

NASCAR takes back the starting time – GREEN FLAG time – of the race, and gives highest bidding networks no more than 30 minutes of pre-race BS before green flag drops as a part of their contract?

Daytime races start with green flag no later than 1:00 p.m. local time, and night races start with green flag no later than 7:00 p.m. local time?

Minimum of 25 laps of racing – green OR yellow – between commercial breaks during television coverage. NASCAR tells bidding networks to take it or leave it as a part of their contract?

Reduced emphasis (and prize money) on season championship, increased emphasis (and prize money) on winning individual races?

Championship dinner among top 12 drivers wearing jeans and t-shirts at a round table in a North Carolina barbecue joint rather than tuxedos at a dais in a New York City hotel?

Drivers must declare at the beginning of the season whether they will drive in the Sprint Cup series or the Nationwide series - Sprint Cup drivers that move down to the Nationwide series will not be permitted to return to Sprint Cup series until the following season, nor will Nationwide series drivers who move up to the Sprint Cup series be permitted to return to the Nationwide series until the following season at which time they will be required to sign another 1-year series

commitment contract?

Notice I didn’t mention Kyle Busch or Dale Earnhardt, Jr. anywhere until just now???


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
 
Other than the paint suggestion (aesthetics just don't bother me much, one way or another; these press releases concerning special paint schemes are a joke and I have no interest in buying over-priced toy cars), and the banquet (it's already moved to Vegas and it'll probably be a lot less formal), I've been making a lot of these suggestions ever since you've known me, Mate.

I'm ambivalent on the sponsor limitations.

The one thing I would add to his suggestions is to change the point system to reward driving to win and not rewarding "Start&Parkers" and the rolling wrecks. Increase point separation for the first five finishers and award no points for positions 30th and back.

Other than that I agree with much of what he suggests.
 
rubbernuts??? WTF???? Typical 97 yuck mouth!!!! How have you been dude?
 
yep, still there, TRL and mag are the only ones with keys these days, they left color books and crayons there so you should feel at home though.
 
Nah, this new softer and gentler me aims to stay out of it. I imagine Silverram and Happy are still there.


Or their bones, anyhow.:beerbang:
 
yep thought so too!!! They were annoying as piss anyway!!! No sleep lost here.:cool:
 
I can appreciate anyone’s individual views and opinions. What gets me is when someone says everyone has the right to their opinion and views then puts others down for offering the same. We have one on this board that does that on a regular basis. You can't take all the credit for being the only smart butt on here. That would not be fair to tkj24. LOL :D

ROFLMAO! You didn't!!! LOL Oh yes you did!!! HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! :D Just because tkj24 knows you're a closet 24 fan, doesn't mean there aren't others of us who know the same thing, right Muggle? LMAO!!! :XXROFL::XXROFL:
 
ROFLMAO! You didn't!!! LOL Oh yes you did!!! HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! :D Just because tkj24 knows you're a closet 24 fan, doesn't mean there aren't others of us who know the same thing, right Muggle? LMAO!!! :XXROFL::XXROFL:
LOL, I have known that for years now.
 
Oh! And by the way, there is nothing wrong with the racing. I have only been following racing since the 60's so I am a Newb but I love it more today than ever.

But, I just love racing. ;)

ONLY since the 60s? That makes you a newb? Yow.. I'll always be a newb then. LOL
 
ROFLMAO! You didn't!!! LOL Oh yes you did!!! HAHAHAHAHAHA!!!! :D Just because tkj24 knows you're a closet 24 fan, doesn't mean there aren't others of us who know the same thing, right Muggle? LMAO!!! :XXROFL::XXROFL:

Yes, I did.... :p
tkj24, don't know a whole lot about me since I let the horns appear. :D
 
LOL, I have known that for years now.

spanka.gif
This is not a spanking for fun either. :D
 
Of the 4 bodystyles NASCAR uses, only Toyota's is built in America. The Fusion is built in Mexico, the Impala and Charger in Canada. The Camry is built in good ole USA(USA! USA!), Georgetown, KY to be exact.
 
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