Will Kyle do it again?

Can he win both?

  • Total voters
    17
  • Poll closed .
SlicedBread22 said:
Now your starting to sound like me :p lol aren't you the one who said results are all that matters. Take a look at the W column.
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I have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not discrediting Petty's wins. He won the races he entered. He couldn't control the talent of the competition. Just like Petty, Kyle wins the races he enters. I sound nothing like you. Lol My guy has the results in the W column...unlike...well...u know. :p
 
FenderBumper said:
Petty averaged 34 races per year for his career, which is 2 less than drivers today. He also dealt with an average of 8 major part failures per year, something unheard of today.
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That average is quite conceiving. When he was winning, he was running 40, 50, 60 races a year. The only reason that average drops is because the last 15 years or so, when he wasn't competitive at all anyways, they were racing only 30 races a year.
 
breatheoflife said:
I have no idea what you're talking about. I'm not discrediting Petty's wins. He won the races he entered. He couldn't control the talent of the competition. Just like Petty, Kyle wins the races he enters. I sound nothing like you. Lol My guy has the results in the W column...unlike...well...u know. :p
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Either way man, Kyle's win total doesn't compare.. you can't compare two people that never raced each other. You can obscurely assume things but that is all any of us are doing. All I know is Petty has 200, Kyle has 26. Im not saying you are discrediting Petty's wins. I'm just saying your giving Kyle too much credit for his. Or at least the one's in the minor's. I'm not trying to get in some big argument, it's just my opinion. Won't change. Like I said, I like Kyle, I just don't see the comparison. It will be an amazing feat when he does reach the 200 mark obviously, I just wouldn't put him up there with Petty when he does.
 
SlicedBread22 said:
Either way man, Kyle's win total doesn't compare.. you can't compare two people that never raced each other. You can obscurely assume things but that is all any of us are doing. All I know is Petty has 200, Kyle has 26. Im not saying you are discrediting Petty's wins. I'm just saying your giving Kyle too much credit for his. Or at least the one's in the minor's. I'm not trying to get in some big argument, it's just my opinion. Won't change. Like I said, I like Kyle, I just don't see the comparison. It will be an amazing feat when he does reach the 200 mark obviously, I just wouldn't put him up there with Petty when he does.
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Petty = 200 NASCAR wins
Busch = 111 NASCAR wins
 
Actually you know what you guys are kind of swaying me a little bit. I wouldn't say it's quite as impressive but when whoever said about "not being able to control the competitions talent" and "winning the races he enters" I do see more why people look at it like that. It's still not quite the same but I get what you mean. It's just changing times and it's really not comparable when it comes down to it the sport is completely different nowadays than it was back then. I think it's just better, or IMO makes more sense to place a driver in the era they drove and compare stats to people they raced against.
 
SlicedBread22 said:
Actually you know what you guys are kind of swaying me a little bit. I wouldn't say it's quite as impressive but when whoever said about "not being able to control the competitions talent" and "winning the races he enters" I do see more why people look at it like that. It's still not quite the same but I get what you mean. It's just changing times and it's really not comparable when it comes down to it the sport is completely different nowadays than it was back then. I think it's just better, or IMO makes more sense to place a driver in the era they drove and compare stats to people they raced against.
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Do you agree that today, it's much harder to when a race than it was back then?
 
For all it's worth, here's the way I look at this. Petty did not have the opportunity to run in the lower series level during career like today's drivers to pad that 200 number. His career was a span of 35 years. Although he's not likely to do the same, Kyle also has the opportunity to extend his career to that of Petty's mark. If he decides to do so and the season stays at its present day mark of a 36 race season, Kyle will have run about 76 races more than Petty over the same time period. Get back to us then with the numbers then to see where he stack up because adding in his win totals from both Nationwide and the Truck Series, using Dale Earnhardt Jr's words..... Don't mean sh!t.
 
breatheoflife said:
Petty = 200 NASCAR wins
Busch = 111 NASCAR wins
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Soo if were counting all of NASCAR then my driver has 32? lol :p Jk

Wonder how long until Kyle gets up to 200 over the top 3. At the rate he's going this year I'd say only a few more. Hmm....(googling... searching.. calculating..) well he's won 49 races since 2010.. so with that and the way he's run lately I wouldn't give it more than another 2 years before he gets to the magic number.
 
breatheoflife said:
Do you agree that today, it's much harder to when a race than it was back then?
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You are absolutely correct.

During Petty's hay day, he had a 1 in 42 chance of winning a race. When NASCAR added the past champions provisional (the Petty place), the odds plummeted to 1 in 43. :eek:
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
Petty did not have the opportunity to run in the lower series level during career like today's drivers to pad that 200 number.
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Thats my issue. Sure they were "pro" level races, but many were just like the lower series of today. He didn't race the Pearsons, Allisons, and Yarborough's every single race.
 
Smoke14 said:
You are absolutely correct.

During Petty's hay day, he had a 1 in 42 chance of winning a race. When NASCAR added the past champions provisional (the Petty place), the odds plummeted to 1 in 43. :eek:
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That's not entirely accurate. By that logic Kyle Busch has the same shot at the victory as Scott Riggs?
 
SlicedBread22 said:
Soo if were counting all of NASCAR then my driver has 32? lol :p Jk

Wonder how long until Kyle gets up to 200 over the top 3. At the rate he's going this year I'd say only a few more. Hmm....(googling... searching.. calculating..) well he's won 49 races since 2010.. so with that and the way he's run lately I wouldn't give it more than another 2 years before he gets to the magic number.
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I really don't know if he will hit 200. Some act like that's a gimme, but I don't think it is.
 
Smoke14 said:
Are you going to dump "sliced bread"? :p
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Nope! I've actually tried to do that once. Couldn't. It was a couple years ago and I was just so frustrated with the bad finishes I tried to follow Kyle Busch and root for him but I found even when Kyle was leading I was still more interested in where Joey was on track. I'm glad too because over the past year or so I've become more confident than ever that he'll do great.
 
Smoke14 said:
You are absolutely correct.

During Petty's hay day, he had a 1 in 42 chance of winning a race. When NASCAR added the past champions provisional (the Petty place), the odds plummeted to 1 in 43. :eek:
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Petty had 3 or 4 drivers that were a threat to win every race. You have 10 or 15 that can be a threat week in, week out in todays level.
 
breatheoflife said:
I really don't know if he will hit 200. Some act like that's a gimme, but I don't think it is.
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Well I wouldn't call it a gimme but I mean he only seems to be improving. He's still got another 15-20 years ahead of him too. Now I know throughout that time a lot of thhings will happen.. the competitors will come and go and there will be a couple guys that will just rip up the field for a bit here and there and you never really know what is going to happen. But really there's nothing stopping him. 49 wins since 2010 and 86 from 2008-2012. And he only needs(I say it like it small lol) what like 89 more. I'm not calling it a gimme but from what I saw out of him over the 8 months or so it really wouldn't surprise me if he did get there.
 
Smoke14 said:
Or Trevor Bayne???
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Yes! But he STILL has low odds even though Trevor Bayne has the equipment under him that the other top drivers do. Just like ooooh say Danica Patrick... you going to tell me she has the same odds next week that Kyle Busch or JJ or Carl have? My point is that even though there are 43 drivers they don't all have the same odds.. Trevor Bayne won against the odds lol. Not like it never happens but its not often a lower tier team gets a win. Im not pitting their talent mostly their equipment against each other. Except Danica :p
 
breatheoflife said:
Considering he's racing against other Cup drivers as well? :confused:
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Trust me I'm not taking from him I brag all the time about Joey last year in NNS. I'm just saying the competition isn't as high. There are less competitive guys. Not saying they are easy at all.. but cup races are harder is all.
 
There's a big difference between winning races in NCWT, NNS and the NSCS. I don't know where this "overall" wins thing started but they're three seperate series for a reason. No doubt Kyle is good and he sure wins a lot of races but to say his "overall" wins is more accomplishing of someone like David Pearson's 105 Cup wins is ridiculous IMO. No argument that Kyle will win a lot more races in all 3 but I don't see him eclipsing guys like Petty, Pearson, Gordon, Earnhardt or JJ in the Cup ranks.
 
Thegroundpounder99 said:
There's a big difference between winning races in NCWT, NNS and the NSCS. I don't know where this "overall" wins thing started but they're three seperate series for a reason. No doubt Kyle is good and he sure wins a lot of races but to say his "overall" wins is more accomplishing of someone like David Pearson's 105 Cup wins is ridiculous IMO. No argument that Kyle will win a lot more races in all 3 but I don't see him eclipsing guys like Petty, Pearson, Gordon, Earnhardt or JJ in the Cup ranks.
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Kyle has 25 cups wins right? That's a long way from 200 that Petty had. I don't count(nor should anyone else) all the Truck and Nationwide wins.
 
Damn, I'm getting a headache thinking about all these stats. Stats are overrated, heck if you looked at the stats for the best reaction times in dragracing it used to show John Force, but that is only because he goes in deep everytime he stages his car, so he gives up some et so he can get a good light, but he is far from being the best leaver on the circut. The bottom line is that Richard Petty was darn good in his era, and Kyle Busch is darn good right now.:)
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
For all it's worth, here's the way I look at this. Petty did not have the opportunity to run in the lower series level during career like today's drivers to pad that 200 number. His career was a span of 35 years. Although he's not likely to do the same, Kyle also has the opportunity to extend his career to that of Petty's mark. If he decides to do so and the season stays at its present day mark of a 36 race season, Kyle will have run about 76 races more than Petty over the same time period. Get back to us then with the numbers then to see where he stack up because adding in his win totals from both Nationwide and the Truck Series, using Dale Earnhardt Jr's words..... Don't mean sh!t.
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Never heard it said better, thats the bottom line, it dont mean sh!t in the cup totals unless its cup wins.
 
breatheoflife said:
And how many 50 and 60 race seasons did Petty have? A lot..... What happened to the King once the talent and technology started catching up with him? He had what? Only 10 or 15 wins his last FIFTEEN seasons?[
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Petty only ran one season that exceeded 60 races. In 1964 he ran 61 races.
I am not sure of when you define technology and the talent catching up, but Petty won his last title in 1979 at the age of 42 very few won it an older age.
Allison the oldest champion of all won it at 45. Based on the history and trends I have observed for over 40 years I am convinced that like all others age just caught up with Petty and nothing else.

A little more about 42 year old Richard Petty. He won that title by beating Waltrip. Believe me if you know much about Waltrip of 1979 you would know he was one of the best at the time. When Cale left Johnson , Junior wanted Waltrip, the same Waltrip that Petty had just beaten the year before in their epic point battle.

The defeated Waltrip also had Buddy Parrott as his crew chief who was excellent. In two years with Wallace he won 18 races. Waltrips team had a big money owner in Bill Gardner who willing to spend a lot of money as well. Probably more $ than Petty enterprises, when a Diegard car blew an engine during a race they would replace it with another engine to gain a few points, Petty enterprises was never that extravagant.

So again I would contend that age stopped the King and I think the above is more than enough evidence.

But in order to be complete look at Pearson, many for good reasons believe that Pearson was the best ever but he only won 1 race after his 45th birthday.
 
There were other drivers that had better win percentages than Petty. Pearson was one of them. The only reason Petty won more races than Pearson is because he entered twice as many races than did Pearson.
 
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