2024 Next Gen Car

aunty dive said:
The guy raced both types of cars multiple times last season. He’s not a fan of huge amounts of unsprung weight and antiquated suspension systems.

I’d say his opinion has value.
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You mean he is into modern race cars? Imagine that.
 
With downtime during the holidays, I have been deep into F1--especially with GR partnering with Hass......You can say what you want about that series, but they are innovative with an eye to developing technologies for the consumer side. I have missed that car emphasis....and I am looking forward to getting back into F1 because of the Hass partnership. It emphasizes just how far behind NASCAR is in the racing world in relevant technology. I get that NASCAR can't change the engine formula, etc. right now because of cost, but man, this series is so far behind....they have no choice but to promote their drivers, and hope that OEM based fans look the other way. I mean, pushrod V8?

Toyota is developing a twin turbo V8 hybrid in the LFR.....Hmmmmm......maybe someday......as long as The Felon says it's okay......of course.
 
Revman said:
It emphasizes just how far behind NASCAR is in the racing world in relevant technology.
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NASCAR has never been about the technology. Indy, F1, sports car prototypes have always featured more advanced engineering. NASCAR has competed successfully with them for decades.

Different strokes. If I had a favorite manufacturer in F1, I still wouldn't watch. Boring is boring, regardless of who participates.
 
Revman said:
With downtime during the holidays, I have been deep into F1--especially with GR partnering with Hass......You can say what you want about that series, but they are innovative with an eye to developing technologies for the consumer side. I have missed that car emphasis....and I am looking forward to getting back into F1 because of the Hass partnership. It emphasizes just how far behind NASCAR is in the racing world in relevant technology. I get that NASCAR can't change the engine formula, etc. right now because of cost, but man, this series is so far behind....they have no choice but to promote their drivers, and hope that OEM based fans look the other way. I mean, pushrod V8?

Toyota is developing a twin turbo V8 hybrid in the LFR.....Hmmmmm......maybe someday......as long as The Felon says it's okay......of course.
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Blinding speed coupled with all of the bleeps blaps, bloops you can hang on a race car doesn't necessarily equate to good racing or a dependable street ride, but it does impress some people.
 
StandOnIt said:
Blinding speed coupled with all of the bleeps blaps, bloops you can hang on a race car doesn't necessarily equate to good racing
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Well, if NASCAR is a template, then neither is a lack of them....in some opinions.....based on definitions of "great racing"...which usually equate to close finishes.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
NASCAR has never been about the technology.
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Then I will need some help with:
1. SMT data
2. ECU's
3. Digital dashes.
4. SIMs
.....Should I go on?

Additionally, this is freaking "stock car" racing. At one time, the series reflected what was on the street. Then, technology entered the chat...now the excuse is cost containment--which is probably valid, but nevertheless, what NASCAR is racing with appeases the older set not because of anything other than that is what they drove.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
NASCAR doesn't prioritize it like other series.
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If this is a stock car series--even remotely--it should. No question NASCAR would like to be in a different place with the engine, but with everything going on, it could be a death blow. Why can't they get another manufacturer? Who in the actual **** would sign up for a pushrod V8? Nobody.
 
Revman said:
Well, if NASCAR is a template, then neither is a lack of them....in some opinions.....based on definitions of "great racing"...which usually equate to close finishes.
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Lol. well I guess if you love little passing and mostly single file parades, it's whatever floats your boat.
 
Fact: WEC, F1, and Indy Car are all turbo hybrid.....and that little regional series is still pushrod 8s....even when you could attach a spec hybrid unit onto the existing piece....still can't get it done, but you can be assured that they want to. Can't wait for the next manufacturer.......but it will be some time....the traditionalists will **** themselves, jump in their hybrid trucks, and go home. FYI....WE have turbo hybrid 4s, 6s, and soon 8s. If NASCAR could get their heads out of their asses, WE could flip the script on that little lack of pushrod 8 upon our entry which is so frequently mentioned. Fingers crossed, but cramping.
 
Revman said:
Fact: WEC, F1, and Indy Car are all turbo hybrid.....and that little regional series is still pushrod 8s....even when you could attach a spec hybrid unit onto the existing piece....still can't get it done, but you can be assured that they want to. Can't wait for the next manufacturer.......but it will be some time....the traditionalists will **** themselves, jump in their hybrid trucks, and go home. FYI....WE have turbo hybrid 4s, 6s, and soon 8s. If NASCAR could get their heads out of their asses, WE could flip the script on that little lack of pushrod 8 upon our entry which is so frequently mentioned. Fingers crossed, but cramping.
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What happened man? Tired of getting beat and wanting to switch brands?
 
Revman said:
Fact: WEC, F1, and Indy Car are all turbo hybrid.....and that little regional series is still pushrod 8s....even when you could attach a spec hybrid unit onto the existing piece..
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Why would you expect current technologies from a series that has historically delayed implementing them? NASCAR is what it is.
 
Revman said:
Fact: WEC, F1, and Indy Car are all turbo hybrid.....and that little regional series is still pushrod 8s....even when you could attach a spec hybrid unit onto the existing piece....still can't get it done, but you can be assured that they want to. Can't wait for the next manufacturer.......but it will be some time....the traditionalists will **** themselves, jump in their hybrid trucks, and go home. FYI....WE have turbo hybrid 4s, 6s, and soon 8s. If NASCAR could get their heads out of their asses, WE could flip the script on that little lack of pushrod 8 upon our entry which is so frequently mentioned. Fingers crossed, but cramping.
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I don’t mind this argument to be honest. I think that a turbo V6 with a hybrid component probably makes the most sense
 
Revman said:
I think that the hybrid turbo 6 is the new 8 honestly.
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Pretty much. With the exception of pickup trucks and high performance sports cars V8's have been mostly done away with. Even then there's little reason most pickups aren't a turbo V6 anymore, I recently drove an F-150 and enjoyed it quite a bit
 
Mispeedway15 said:
I don’t mind this argument to be honest. I think that a turbo V6 with a hybrid component probably makes the most sense
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Oh, I agree with the notion of a hybrid. But I see the notion as another one that falls under the heading of "What some people would like to see vs. what's not likely to happen soon." See also reversion to a full-season points system, or not throwing a yellow between stages.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Oh, I agree with the notion of a hybrid. But I see the notion as another one that falls under the heading of "What some people would like to see vs. what's not likely to happen soon." See also reversion to a full-season points system, or not throwing a yellow between stages.
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If NASCAR wants another OEM, it will happen. Even if they don't, a hybrid unit can be added to the existing motor as I understand it. IMO NASCAR's connectedness to the consumer side is what separates it from the open wheel stuff.....the NASCAR 8 is less connected IMO than the turbo 6 hybrids from the open wheel bunch. Who is "stock" now?
 
Revman said:
If NASCAR wants another OEM, it will happen.
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Strictly my opinion but I don’t think we'll see a fourth manufacturer regardless of powerplant.

There are 36 (?) charters. Chevys have historically made up the majority of the field, and I don’t see that changing. I also don't see a new manufacturer being able to convince more than a couple of teams to switch, for maybe five or six cars total. Would a manufacturer want to get involved for that small a slice of the field? Based on what we've seen with Toyota*, growing that slice is a very slow process that won't result in 25% of a four-manufacturer field.

*I name Toyota because they're the most recent manufacturer to come on board, not for performance reasons.
 
Revman said:
If NASCAR wants another OEM, it will happen. Even if they don't, a hybrid unit can be added to the existing motor as I understand it. IMO NASCAR's connectedness to the consumer side is what separates it from the open wheel stuff.....the NASCAR 8 is less connected IMO than the turbo 6 hybrids from the open wheel bunch. Who is "stock" now?
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Nascar saying they want another maunufcturer and having a full field of cars already, I don't think they are excited as some fans are. It would be different if charters were not in demand and they are having trouble with low entries for their races, but that isn't happening in all three series. These poor, broke, wounded, working out on the street teams continue to manage to wire up, patch up some cars to make the races weekly.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Strictly my opinion but I don’t think we'll see a fourth manufacturer regardless of powerplant.

There are 36 (?) charters. Chevys have historically made up the majority of the field, and I don’t see that changing. I also don't see a new manufacturer being able to convince more than a couple of teams to switch, for maybe five or six cars total. Would a manufacturer want to get involved for that small a slice of the field? Based on what we've seen with Toyota*, growing that slice is a very slow process that won't result in 25% of a four-manufacturer field.

*I name Toyota because they're the most recent manufacturer to come on board, not for performance reasons.
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Solid post.....But let's take a look at a couple of things.....First, an assessment of Toyota's growth is a bit skewed. Initially, Lee White initially wanted a third of the field IMO. When David Wilson took over, the philosophy shifted....with development as it was.....fewer cars meant that you keep your advantage to that of a few. It wasn't until the Next Gen came that expansion was essential because of the quasi-spec nature of the formula....you can't get the same kind of advantage....so, you need to increase your count to keep a reasonable chance of winning. Enter Legacy. Increasing the count should make financial sense if the formula saves money.

As for would a new manufacturer enter....Absolutely--if the formula is relevant--which it isn't at the present time....but I digress.....Chevy has a big chunk, but how many of those non-Felon teams would jump at a shot to be the lead dog? I doubt Childress because he doesn't know how to help himself....but Trackhouse certainly may if Marks can grow a pair, and stop kissing the ring. A Trackhouse championship will always be an upset with Chevy. Spire? Kaulig? Hyak or whatever it is called. You got yourself about a quarter of the field right there.....How much of the pie would a new guy want? I don't think the new guy needs a bunch of cars, but maybe a flagship that could get them some headlines.....Trackhouse would be the target IMO....and a damn good one....I think my Toyota took a run at them.
 
Revman said:
Toyota is developing a twin turbo V8 hybrid in the LFR.....Hmmmmm......maybe someday......as long as The Felon says it's okay......of course.
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Doubtful it will perform and be as versatile as the LT 1-4 series of GM push rod V8's. The base LT 1 in GM trucks, cars and Cadillacs has 460 HP and 460 torque.
From a supercharged 650 to 682 HP is available in the Camaro, Caddy and Vette as an option. No need to change a winning small block.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Strictly my opinion but I don’t think we'll see a fourth manufacturer regardless of powerplant.

There are 36 (?) charters. Chevys have historically made up the majority of the field, and I don’t see that changing. I also don't see a new manufacturer being able to convince more than a couple of teams to switch, for maybe five or six cars total. Would a manufacturer want to get involved for that small a slice of the field? Based on what we've seen with Toyota*, growing that slice is a very slow process that won't result in 25% of a four-manufacturer field.

*I name Toyota because they're the most recent manufacturer to come on board, not for performance reasons.
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I disagree, I think with the merger we'll see Nissan & Honda eventually enter. But a hybrid is probably needed as that is the way tech is heading across the board for on the road driving.
 
Mispeedway15 said:
I disagree, I think with the merger we'll see Nissan & Honda eventually enter. But a hybrid is probably needed as that is the way tech is heading across the board for on the road driving.
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I hope so, but I think an engine change would be a huge thing for this series at this time. Huge. That is going to cost the owners eventually, and I am not sure that they are going to want to take that on....maybe the lawsuit changes that at some point? When I look at Indy Car and F1.....I just can't understand how NASCAR can stand still on the engine formula....
 
Revman said:
I hope so, but I think an engine change would be a huge thing for this series at this time. Huge. That is going to cost the owners eventually, and I am not sure that they are going to want to take that on....maybe the lawsuit changes that at some point? When I look at Indy Car and F1.....I just can't understand how NASCAR can stand still on the engine formula....
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GM is already fielding hybrid Cadillacs. Honda (Acura) is too, so they'd be ready if interested. Indeed, I read one of the reasons for the Honda / Nissan merger was to improve hybrid and EV development. I don't know about Ford or Toyota but I'd be astonished if they weren't working on something as far as racing goes. I can tell you I'm delighted with my hybrid Ford Maverick.

For a variety of reasons, some good and some 'What the...?', NASCAR has historically been slow to adopt new technologies.
 
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