23XI statement on not signing Charter agreement

Truex_rox said:
I take it you're not a basketball fan and that even Matt Kenseth couldn't convince you to become one. :p
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Exactly. In fact, let's replace the hypothetical basketball team with heavy metal. His preference didn't cause me to reevaluate my opinion. Ditto Mark Martin and rap.

Maybe Jordan can bring along those with minimal or no exposure to racing. Maybe he can get people who don't like racing to revisit it. Maybe I'm the only one who won't take another look based solely on a celeb's say-so, especially on the subject of entertainments.
 
Jorge De Guzman said:
We've now hit the part of this discussion where the junior college psychologists hit the ground running. Good grief, how can you someone even remotely think this is true without even having a conversation with that person? So, Dennis flaunts his money, good for him. I'd have my own helicopter pad if I had that kind of money... God bless him.
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If I ever become wealthy, I will not change. I will remain the same Greg I have always been.

Except for setting up a railroad to bring in hawt semi emaciated wimmins from Eastern Europe.
Funeral plans that would pour my ashes into the carburetor of a 900+ HP Chevy engine to blow my ashes onto the bodies of some more hawt wimmins.
 
Jorge De Guzman said:
We've now hit the part of this discussion where the junior college psychologists hit the ground running. Good grief, how can you someone even remotely think this is true without even having a conversation with that person? So, Dennis flaunts his money, good for him. I'd have my own helicopter pad if I had that kind of money... God bless him.
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Oh stop it…I’m having some fun with it, while explaining the truth. And yes I was a darn good psychology major!

I don’t resent anyone with money, and I will always be an MJ fan. I despise Hambone because of his smarmy persona. Yes, he’s a narcissist…his behavior reveals it over and over. His home (I’ve seen the video) is a constant service at the “church of Hamlin”.

But regardless, the main reason he’s fighting this is he will be broke without seeing his charter purchase grow as an investment. He’s leveraged an asset that is disappearing. Follow the money…
 
Conover said:
Oh stop it…I’m having some fun with it, while explaining the truth. And yes I was a darn good psychology major!

I don’t resent anyone with money, and I will always be an MJ fan. I despise Hambone because of his smarmy persona. Yes, he’s a narcissist…his behavior reveals it over and over. His home (I’ve seen the video) is a constant service at the “church of Hamlin”.

But regardless, the main reason he’s fighting this is he will be broke without seeing his charter purchase grow as an investment. He’s leveraged an asset that is disappearing. Follow the money…
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Plus NASCAR is f-ing them 😝
 
Conover said:
Oh stop it…I’m having some fun with it, while explaining the truth. And yes I was a darn good psychology major!

I don’t resent anyone with money, and I will always be an MJ fan. I despise Hambone because of his smarmy persona. Yes, he’s a narcissist…his behavior reveals it over and over. His home (I’ve seen the video) is a constant service at the “church of Hamlin”.

But regardless, the main reason he’s fighting this is he will be broke without seeing his charter purchase grow as an investment. He’s leveraged an asset that is disappearing. Follow the money…
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You’re claiming Hamlin borrowed money personally using a charter he doesn’t own as collateral.
 
aunty dive said:
You’re claiming Hamlin borrowed money personally using a charter he doesn’t own as collateral.
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It’s an educated guess. Unless one believes he has $30M laying around and wants to put his personal accounts in jeopardy. Hambone gets business advice. He incorporated the business, which means the collateral and business analysis used to borrow money would require the company demonstrate income streams and assets. Back when they bought the charters, likely with a majority of borrowed funding, they would have represented these charters as assets, showing the bankers examples of how the charter value had grown over the years. Was this a misrepresentation on his part, or just an assumption? Either way it’s a hot mess unless he can force NASCAR to make it a property owned by the teams.
 
Conover said:
It’s an educated guess. Unless one believes he has $30M laying around and wants to put his personal accounts in jeopardy. Hambone gets business advice. He incorporated the business, which means the collateral and business analysis used to borrow money would require the company demonstrate income streams and assets. Back when they bought the charters, likely with a majority of borrowed funding, they would have represented these charters as assets, showing the bankers examples of how the charter value had grown over the years. Was this a misrepresentation on his part, or just an assumption? Either way it’s a hot mess unless he can force NASCAR to make it a property owned by the teams.
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At this point the way I see it, Jenkins and Hamlin are overextended or will be shortly. If they don't get their charters back soon, Jenkins has said he can't last very long with unchartered teams. Hamlin has been squeaking about his "return" on his investment, so he doesn't seem too happy either. Nascar is playing hardball at this point.
 
StandOnIt said:
At this point the way I see it, Jenkins and Hamlin are overextended or will be shortly. If they don't get their charters back soon, Jenkins has said he can't last very long with unchartered teams. Hamlin has been squeaking about his "return" on his investment, so he doesn't seem too happy either. Nascar is playing hardball at this point.
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When did Jenkins say that? I must have missed it, which is certainly possible.
 
Conover said:
It’s an educated guess. Unless one believes he has $30M laying around and wants to put his personal accounts in jeopardy. Hambone gets business advice. He incorporated the business, which means the collateral and business analysis used to borrow money would require the company demonstrate income streams and assets. Back when they bought the charters, likely with a majority of borrowed funding, they would have represented these charters as assets, showing the bankers examples of how the charter value had grown over the years. Was this a misrepresentation on his part, or just an assumption? Either way it’s a hot mess unless he can force NASCAR to make it a property owned by the teams.
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Hamlin didn’t buy a charter. Neither did Jordan or their 3rd partner, Curtis Polk.

23X1 is a corporate entity separate from its owners. It has the ability to establish its own banking arrangements with lenders that do not require the personal guarantees of its shareholders. Hamlin won’t be “going broke” any time soon.

And Rick Hendrick doesn’t run Larson’s cars out of his pocket … same kind of thinking.
 
aunty dive said:
Hamlin didn’t buy a charter. Neither did Jordan or their 3rd partner, Curtis Polk.

23X1 is a corporate entity separate from its owners. It has the ability to establish its own banking arrangements with lenders that do not require the personal guarantees of its shareholders. Hamlin won’t be “going broke” any time soon.

And Rick Hendrick doesn’t run Larson’s cars out of his pocket … same kind of thinking.
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Hmmm when Hamlin is complaining about lack of return on his investment, he isn't talking play money.
 
God, this thread has become a PITA. Hopefully something important doesn’t come along because I would never find it. Maybe a new thread for actual “news” would be good.
 
DIDIT said:
God, this thread has become a PITA. Hopefully something important doesn’t come along because I would never find it. Maybe a new thread for actual “news” would be good.
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You could take it upon yourself to start a new one when the court’s decision on the injunction application comes down.
 
DIDIT said:
God, this thread has become a PITA. Hopefully something important doesn’t come along because I would never find it. Maybe a new thread for actual “news” would be good.
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Whats a PITA? Not familiar with this Board Lingo
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Some of us don't follow celebrities, popular culture, or all sports. From here, he's just another famous person among the many that have zero affect on my life, like Beyonce, Quentin Tarantino, Howard Stern, or Oprah Winfrey.

No need to get your Knicks in a twist. (See what I did there? Basketball joke! Get it?) I'm not concerned if you don't happen to know who David Sibley or Roger Tory Peterson are. Different cultures, different icons.
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I didn't start watching basketball until this year and I knew who Michael Jordan was 30 years ago.

Just like people who have never watched NASCAR know who Dale Earnhardt was.
 
aunty dive said:
Pain In The Ass
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Some would say that about me ha ha thanks, and for the record I dont think this thread is a PITA. Whenever news will be reported, it'll be posted here and then the topic of discussion will evolve. It's a good catch all for this topic, I just think we're all awaiting what is going to happen and discussing various scenarios no matter how out they are while waiting it out.
 
If a person isn't enjoying this thread there are plenty of others in this forum. We still are carrying the racing news on the others also.
 
aunty dive said:
When did Jenkins say that? I must have missed it, which is certainly possible.
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This came from the Pockrass article I posted below. It's a good short summation of the lawsuit.

Front Row owner Bob Jenkins in court filings stated: "Because of our love for the sport and our determination to maintain the race team we have built, we are determined to race next year even if we have to do so on an ‘open’ basis, but at some point, the losses may become so severe that we simply cannot continue — causing irreparable harm to our business, our employees, and the communities and fans we are associated with."

What to know about NASCAR antitrust lawsuit: Injunction motion filed | FOX Sports

Two teams — Michael Jordan's 23XI Racing and Front Row Motorsports — are suing NASCAR alleging a violation of antitrust laws. Here is the latest news and everything to know about the saga.
www.foxsports.com www.foxsports.com
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
I used to hate basketball.
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I've never bothered hating it. I don't care for it because I don't understand it. Specifically, I don't understand what constitutes a foul.
AndyMarquisLive said:
Caitlin Clark converted me.
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Is she able to eliminate the strategy of the losing team repeatedly fouling the leading one so the last two minutes on the game clock don't take 25 on my wall clock? That's the thing I dislike the most.

I spend enough time in front of the box watch racing. No point in adding any more recliner time.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
He's as influential today as Dale Earnhardt would be if he was still alive.
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Yeah, that's a comparison I would have made, but wait a bit and we'll probably be told again that's invalid. I believe the posts were that (paraphrasing) other athletes aren't fit to carry Jordan's jock strap, he's the most influential athlete ever, and is the greatest athlete of all time.

I have no gauge of social influence so I have only this forum as a source.
 
aunty dive said:
Hamlin didn’t buy a charter. Neither did Jordan or their 3rd partner, Curtis Polk.

23X1 is a corporate entity separate from its owners. It has the ability to establish its own banking arrangements with lenders that do not require the personal guarantees of its shareholders. Hamlin won’t be “going broke” any time soon.

And Rick Hendrick doesn’t run Larson’s cars out of his pocket … same kind of thinking.
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You missed my point in my “educated guess” segment. I noted that the corporation owns the teams…of course they would protect themselves personally. However, financing the corporation requires confidence in tangible assets and cash flows. Charters would have been presented as those assets if assumed to be owned. I’m sure both Hambone and Jordan have some of their own skin in the investment as well.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Is she able to eliminate the strategy of the losing team repeatedly fouling the leading one so the last two minutes on the game clock don't take 25 on my wall clock? That's the thing I dislike the most.
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My brother, let me introduce to the TBT, "the basketball tournament." The play with the "Elam ending" which is where at the start of the 4th quarter they set a target score (adding 8 points to the leading teams' score) and eliminate the game clock. Then the first team to hit the target score wins. It's completely changed my outlook on basketball and I hope the other leagues adapt it.

thetournament.com

WHAT IS THE ELAM ENDING? - TBT and TST

DON’T LIKE LATE GAME FOULING? THE ELAM ENDING IS FOR YOU Designed to preserve a more natural end of game finish, the Elam Ending® calls for the game clock to… Continue reading WHAT IS THE ELAM ENDING?
thetournament.com thetournament.com
 
Conover said:
But regardless, the main reason he’s fighting this is he will be broke without seeing his charter purchase grow as an investment. He’s leveraged an asset that is disappearing. Follow the money…
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I must have misunderstood this as well.
 
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