Cup RACE thread --- Roval

Nitro Dude said:
Yep, it could have happened to anyone. It was without a doubt a mistake that will probably never happen again hopefully. But if you feel they were cheating then you shouldn’t even root for the 9 team. But that’s your decision.
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I don’t believe there’s a truly legal car in the field any given Sunday period . It’s just shades of gray and how egregious.
 
A few more comments on the race.

I noticed if two cars were coming into the hairpin, the inside car often accelerated faster off the curve than the outside one and was able to complete the pass. This was true even in cases where the outside car was leading by a full car length going in. If the inside car didn't complete the pass the first time through, he often finished on the next lap. Just something to look for next year.

Overall, I think the new changes didn't result in much more chaos than the old layout. Fortunately, NASCAR continued its policy of restrain with the caution button on road courses. Yeah, the wad-ups in turn 7 involved more cars on average than the old turn 8 but I recall everyone as eventually driving away. With that said, I prefer the old layout but I enjoyed this one almost as much.
 
Speedbowl14 said:
Are you saying that the DQ is harsh if the #48 lost ballast? I disagree, heavy pieces of lead coming off the cars is one of the "major" no-no's in the NASCAR penalty world. Don't mess with tires, don't mess with fuel, don't mess with engines, don't have ballast come off the car. All of that was/is/will forever be a major penalty.

not the same but still, messing with the ballast
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Dr_B_UNC said:
No, I was saying that it sounded like people were arguing that the penalty was bogus because it was light due to lost ballast, and that wasn’t true because the penalty would be *even more* severe if that were the reason. Guess I apologize for being unclear.
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Chalk me up as one that thinks it is indeed bogus, when NASCAR is the one setting up turtle curbing that has the potential to knock weight out of the car after going full Bowman Air slam down landing. The whole thing is a setup for part loss and chaos by NASCAR whether that comes to fruition or not, when you can't make competitive lap time without abusing the curbing. NASCAR should penalize themselves and remove themselves from the playoffs, in fact slap yourself NASCAR for running the Roval in the first place when this car's strong point is intermediate Ovals, then slap yourself again NASCAR for robbing Kligerman on Saturday, then one more time for installing curbing low enough that you can cut "the course" and launch yourself at the same time.

Under normal circumstances, yes shedding weight out on track should be a harsh penalty safety violation, except NASCAR is the one that rigged this particular course for this to potentially happen with this particular car so maybe they should look in the damn mirror with their barrage of penalties and absolute nonsense officiating. It's EXHAUSTING. I can see why Truex is so done with this shhh.

The 48 not appealing the penalty they already knew it's a done deal ... and with 3 other Hendricks in play they are experts at staying in the good graces.

Bowman is guilty of driving a great playoffs and forcing his car to go on a diet post air, so what are we really doing here? the punishment doesn't fit the crime.

It'd be different if there was some type of advantage gained or an intent to skirt the rules, this was purely accidental from on track action.

A fine and car chief suspension would have sufficed, it did not help the driver to advance on performance.
 
Turtle84 said:
Chalk me up as one that thinks it is indeed bogus, when NASCAR is the one setting up turtle curbing that has the potential to knock weight out of the car after going full Bowman Air slam down landing. The whole thing is a setup for part loss and chaos by NASCAR whether that comes to fruition or not, when you can't make competitive lap time without abusing the curbing. NASCAR should penalize themselves and remove themselves from the playoffs, in fact slap yourself NASCAR for running the Roval in the first place when this car's strong point is intermediate Ovals, then slap yourself again NASCAR for robbing Kligerman on Saturday, then one more time for installing curbing low enough that you can cut "the course" and launch yourself at the same time.

Under normal circumstances, yes shedding weight out on track should be a harsh penalty safety violation, except NASCAR is the one that rigged this particular course for this to potentially happen with this particular car so maybe they should look in the damn mirror with their barrage of penalties and absolute nonsense officiating. It's EXHAUSTING. I can see why Truex is so done with this shhh.

The 48 not appealing the penalty they already knew it's a done deal ... and with 3 other Hendricks in play they are experts at staying in the good graces.

Bowman is guilty of driving a great playoffs and forcing his car to go on a diet post air, so what are we really doing here? the punishment doesn't fit the crime.

It'd be different if there was some type of advantage gained or an intent to skirt the rules, this was purely accidental from on track action.

A fine and car chief suspension would have sufficed, it did not help the driver to advance on performance.
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This might be the worst post I've seen about this all week. The turtles had nothing to do with it.

I'm sick of the roval bashing as well I suppose you people all want to go back to when mile and a half tracks were like 24 out of 36 races and sucked. Charlotte only needs one oval date. You'll get all the 1.5 milers back and then complain the schedule is boring again. God forbid you people ever realize NASCAR does actual know what it's doing.
 
Turtle84 said:
Chalk me up as one that thinks it is indeed bogus, when NASCAR is the one setting up turtle curbing that has the potential to knock weight out of the car after going full Bowman Air slam down landing.
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The curbing was actually reduced after the Xfinity race, from 4" to 2.5". If NASCAR wanted to intentionally knock off parts, they would have left it alone.

So far, no one had definitively said the car was underweight due to components falling off.

So much for that theory. Also, FEMA isn't taking people's property and there are no nanobots in COVID vaccine.
 
StandOnIt said:
Bell is going to need more than a notebook.
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Yep, got that covered......
IMG_6150.jpeg
 
Nitro Dude said:
I didn’t think I could have anymore respect for HMS then I already had but that is a classy move and I’m so proud to be a fan of that great organization. Go kick some Toyota’s and Fords butts 48, 24, 5, and 9 teams. ❤️
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He told us what we already knew. How honorable. A different approach from the louvers when he shook a finger at all that had the audacity to question the empire. ❤️
 
Revman said:
He told us what we already knew. How honorable. A different approach from the louvers when he shook a finger at all that had the audacity to question the empire. ❤️
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You had better concentrate on your yotas and your employees that are selling valuable information. You have some inside the house problems right now. 😃
 
jaqua19 said:
I wish it was Charlotte or Darlington, or even Vegas! But hey, I don't run the sport
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hmmmmmm...All tracks Larson does really well at? I'm gonna call bias. LOL I say we run the title race at Watkins Glen in the last gen car. :)
 
Nitro Dude said:
You had better concentrate on your yotas and your employees that are selling valuable information. You have some inside the house problems right now. 😃
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Don't you think that the assholes buying the information have a problem?
 
Revman said:
Don't you think that the assholes buying the information have a problem?
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“The McLaren team was fined $100 million US and stripped of all of its points in the constructors' standings Thursday in the spy scandal that has rocked Formula One.”

“McLaren, which leads the current drivers' and constructors' standings, was punished by the World Motor Sports Council for allegedly using leaked secret technical documents belonging to F1 rival Ferrari.”

“The case broke open in July when a 780-page technical dossier on Ferrari cars was found at the home of McLaren's chief designer, Mike Coughlan, who was later suspended. Ferrari mechanic Nigel Stepney, who allegedly supplied the documents, was fired.“

 
aunty dive said:
“The McLaren team was fined $100 million US and stripped of all of its points in the constructors' standings Thursday in the spy scandal that has rocked Formula One.”

“McLaren, which leads the current drivers' and constructors' standings, was punished by the World Motor Sports Council for allegedly using leaked secret technical documents belonging to F1 rival Ferrari.”

“The case broke open in July when a 780-page technical dossier on Ferrari cars was found at the home of McLaren's chief designer, Mike Coughlan, who was later suspended. Ferrari mechanic Nigel Stepney, who allegedly supplied the documents, was fired.“

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The Mc-Ferrari
 
aunty dive said:
“The McLaren team was fined $100 million US and stripped of all of its points in the constructors' standings Thursday in the spy scandal that has rocked Formula One.”
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14 years ago in another series. Will NASCAR react similarly? If I recall, neither team has filed a complaint yet.
 
kkfan91 said:
This might be the worst post I've seen about this all week. The turtles had nothing to do with it.

I'm sick of the roval bashing as well I suppose you people all want to go back to when mile and a half tracks were like 24 out of 36 races and sucked. Charlotte only needs one oval date. You'll get all the 1.5 milers back and then complain the schedule is boring again. God forbid you people ever realize NASCAR does actual know what it's doing.
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Meh I was due and happy to help with the entertainments, this was more of an accumulation of irrelevant grievances that I'm having with NASCAR that has me reaching a breaking point. It's a love hate relationship.

For the record, I never complained about the excitability of the Ovals back in 2009-2018 at it's peak of the 78 whomping the field, so I'm definitely not in the camp of those that wanted less Oval or those that thought the COT or Gen 6 was boring on intermediates. Is that why they're revisiting the DVP clock because they know what they're doing? Is that why cars are doing barrel rolls at Daytona?



But okay let's dive into it then and have a discussion on a discussion forum? Not the turtles, the stationary curbing then.

The point remains Bowman did not benefit from losing the ballast weight.

NASCAR has direct video evidence audio visual of what happened to the 48 on track that would cause the car to come back underweight. It did not benefit the 48 to lose the ballast from the car. It did not improve their performance, it was not intentional, it was an accidental occurrence from the jarring opposite directional forces of impact of going airborne and hard landing back down that caused the ballast weight to drop out on track, there can and should be allowances for accidents without intent in a live race with 36+ race cars on track, not everything will go perfectly as planned. If it is determined there must be a reprimanding to discourage further occurrences or suspicion of purpose, in regards to safety, then do so in a way that is meaningful outside of what can be controlled or not controlled.

Of course it’s not NASCAR’s responsibility for Bowman and the 48 team to make sure everything is fastened & secured to the maximum. But does NASCAR ever take responsibility for anything that they do? Or do they slough it off to the race teams at fault entirely. Because I am 100% confident this does not happen if they’re are running the Charlotte Oval and won’t happen this week in Vegas either. So what factor changed the equation? The Roval with curbing that can send this stiff as a board suspension zero give zero flex car airborne off all 4 tires. So maybe NASCAR should take an inkling of responsibility on that? and maybe not throw said car out of the playoffs for an accidental occurrence? Once again the 48 gained no benefit.


Charlie Spencer said:
The curbing was actually reduced after the Xfinity race, from 4" to 2.5". If NASCAR wanted to intentionally knock off parts, they would have left it alone.

So far, no one had definitively said the car was underweight due to components falling off.

So much for that theory. Also, FEMA isn't taking people's property and there are no nanobots in COVID vaccine.
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Noted, I guess I'm not saying NASCAR had intentions either whether they know it or not, it's an unintentional setup for where this could happen with this particular car imo.

Also noted, but I'm just going off of what I think more than likely happened while I'm left to twist in the wind by the powers at be, I don't find reason for the 48 to go intentional weight shaving beyond the limits to make much sense considering their points position going in, the risk doesn't seem worth the reward to me if they happened to get caught, but if it happens to come back they were toying with something else then this ain't my first rodeo lol.
 
Turtle84 said:
Also noted, but I'm just going off of what I think more than likely happened while I'm left to twist in the wind by the powers at be, I don't find reason for the 48 to go intentional weight shaving beyond the limits to make much sense considering their points position going in, the risk doesn't seem worth the reward to me if they happened to get caught, but if it happens to come back they were toying with something else then this ain't my first rodeo lol.
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Gordo said it wasn't intentional. It was accidental / inadvertent / sloppy.

It's debatable which is worse.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Gordo said it wasn't intentional. It was accidental / inadvertent / sloppy.

It's debatable which is worse.
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Well I'm sure they didn't anticipate the car taking flight in race, so intentional would be way worse in my book, inadvertent could be for a number of reasons.

I'm not holding my breath on getting any real answers from a third party source that doesn't have a vested interest in the remaining hendrick cars in the playoffs, maybe after the season is over.
 
Turtle84 said:
Well I'm sure they didn't anticipate the car taking flight in race, so intentional would be way worse in my book, inadvertent could be for a number of reasons.

I'm not holding my breath on getting any real answers from a third party source that doesn't have a vested interest in the remaining hendrick cars in the playoffs, maybe after the season is over.
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Oh, I'm don't expect to ever get a definitive answer. But I'm not one to come up with unprovable theories to fill the gap. A known lack of information is better to work with than unsupported assumptions.

Just the opinion of one former Army intelligence analyst.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Oh, I'm don't expect to ever get a definitive answer. But I'm not one to come up with unprovable theories to fill the gap. A known lack of information is better to work with than unsupported assumptions.

Just the opinion of one former Army intelligence analyst.
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That's kind of the thing for me tho, is that I believe we more than likely already have the answer on video replay visual and audio, but that's just my take on it.
 
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