23XI statement on not signing Charter agreement

One example out of probably hundreds why teams say they are broke. It's like giving a kid a hammer and wondering how the glass topped coffee table got broken.

 
StandOnIt said:
Who offered the charter system in the first place? Give them an inch, they take a mile.
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Rob Kauffman was the major force in the creation of the charter system. It was his vision and his leadership. Same as the RTA, also his vision and leadership that brought that about.

From Nascar's perspective, the charter system was revenue-neutral and expense-neutral. It improved the economic viability of the race teams, with the target of financial stability that would attract new investment... realizing that the octogenarian team owners wouldn't be there forever to put on the weekly show.

Brian France realized the dangers of cup series team owners mostly being way, way past normal retirement age... and a dearth of new owners due to the money-losing business model. I think it's safe to say Jim France views the owners differently. To Jim, there are always owners around, in the truck series, in ARCA, etc. Or eliminate team owners entirely... NASCAR could just own all the cars, employ all the crew chiefs and road crews, and keep all the cash. LOL.
 
LewTheShoe said:
Rob Kauffman was the major force in the creation of the charter system. It was his vision and his leadership. Same as the RTA, also his vision and leadership that brought that about.

From Nascar's perspective, the charter system was revenue-neutral and expense-neutral. It improved the economic viability of the race teams, with the target of financial stability that would attract new investment... realizing that the octogenarian team owners wouldn't be there forever to put on the weekly show.

Brian France realized the dangers of cup series team owners mostly being way, way past normal retirement age... and a dearth of new owners due to the money-losing business model. I think it's safe to say Jim France views the owners differently. To Jim, there are always owners around, in the truck series, in ARCA, etc. Or eliminate team owners entirely... NASCAR could just own all the cars, employ all the crew chiefs and road crews, and keep all the cash. LOL.
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Kauffman certainly championed it, but it was never a thing that he or the RTA could create. The only people who could create it was NASCAR themselves, and they did it for all the reasons you pointed out. What I think has changed is the loose thread you identified at the end. NASCAR has essentially already been caught saying they'd be just as fine kicking all the owners to the curb and putting everything under their control and keeping all the money in house. That's not a model any other legitimate motorsport uses, but maybe NASCAR doesn't care if you or I or anyone thinks they're legitimate and they're perfectly fine joining Monster Jam (which does sorta use this model) and the WWE in the "sports entertainment" category so long as the TV checks clear.
 
LewTheShoe said:
Rob Kauffman was the major force in the creation of the charter system. It was his vision and his leadership. Same as the RTA, also his vision and leadership that brought that about.
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Rob was driving the charter system because he had more than anyone else to gain. He got awarded charters for a shut down team. Then in turn sold those, all while technically no longer having a team....
 
wi_racefan said:
Rob was driving the charter system because he had more than anyone else to gain. He got awarded charters for a shut down team. Then in turn sold those, all while technically no longer having a team....
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Kaufman’s Cup Charter eligibility depended upon previous performance on the racetrack, rather than someone’s expectations for that.
 
aunty dive said:
Kaufman’s Cup Charter eligibility depended upon previous performance on the racetrack, rather than someone’s expectations for that.
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So the fact that he was there front man and biggest advocate for charters was just pure coincidence that from a monetary standpoint he had the most to gain?
 
I don't blame NASCAR for all of this, but treating the teams like subcontractors is insulting, in my opinion.

NASCAR has done a lot for racing, but the owners deserve some respect as partners. I am not going to pretend to know all of the details, but the drivers have taken pay cuts over the last decade while NASCAR wants to keep their books closed and play hardball.

I have a hard time feeling the kind of sympathy that I'm reading from others, and I don't think the France family is at any risk of losing their business. It is just a power struggle, and NASCAR needs good teams more than they care to admit or accept.
 
Greg said:
I don't blame NASCAR for all of this, but treating the teams like subcontractors is insulting, in my opinion.

NASCAR has done a lot for racing, but the owners deserve some respect as partners. I am not going to pretend to know all of the details, but the drivers have taken pay cuts over the last decade while NASCAR wants to keep their books closed and play hardball.

I have a hard time feeling the kind of sympathy that I'm reading from others, and I don't think the France family is at any risk of losing their business. It is just a power struggle, and NASCAR needs good teams more than they care to admit or accept.
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On the other hand, the reasons teams are always crying for more money are because of examples like this. Gibbs spent a million dollars coming up with a faster pit gun. The reason for so many brake failures is because teams have figured out that different brake compounds on individual wheels make the car turn better ( I wonder how much that cost?). So we can go round and round with the poor me's until the cows come home.

I think there is more at stake here than we need mo money. That's always a factor, but the end game is more control IMO. It's easy to see why Nascar wanted control at the back end of the charters.
 
Greg said:
I don't blame NASCAR for all of this, but treating the teams like subcontractors is insulting, in my opinion.

NASCAR has done a lot for racing, but the owners deserve some respect as partners. I am not going to pretend to know all of the details, but the drivers have taken pay cuts over the last decade while NASCAR wants to keep their books closed and play hardball.

I have a hard time feeling the kind of sympathy that I'm reading from others, and I don't think the France family is at any risk of losing their business. It is just a power struggle, and NASCAR needs good teams more than they care to admit or accept.
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wi_racefan said:
So the fact that he was there front man and biggest advocate for charters was just pure coincidence that from a monetary standpoint he had the most to gain?
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I don't agree that Kauffman had "the most to gain." His team earned two charters. Hendrick earned four. Multiple teams earned three. They gained more than Kauffman. Arguably, the pure back-marker teams gained the most per charter... because more of the payout was a flat amount per car rather than performance based. Arguably, Nascar gained the most as their race teams - the ones that actually put on the show every week - collectively had greater financial stability at a time when such stability was in very short supply.

I agree with @aunty dive... Kauffman's vision, innovation, and leadership served the interests of the entire Nascar industry.
 
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