23XI statement on not signing Charter agreement

wi_racefan said:
Maybe but when asking for documents and being denied, that can't be considered a win?

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It’s a loss for sure. A loss of time.

They’ll get the stuff they asked to have expedited when everything else is handed over.
 
wi_racefan said:
Maybe but when asking for documents and being denied, that can't be considered a win?

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The judge slapped it down decisively. It is going to be very hard for them to ramp it up and go for anti-trust over the contract dispute argument. At this point, they have proved nothing.
 
aunty dive said:
It’s a loss for sure. A loss of time.

They’ll get the stuff they asked to have expedited when everything else is handed over.
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To me it just shows that they're not going to come in and steam roll nascar like they've been telling everyone they will.

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aunty dive said:
I wasn’t aware they’d said anything like that but I certainly could have missed it.
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Eating popcorn.gif
 
aunty dive said:
I wasn’t aware they’d said anything like that but I certainly could have missed it.
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They way their lawyer talked like this is so clearly illegal that anyone can see it and winning will be no issue


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KTMLew01 said:
That popcorn wasn't pointed at anyone. Just my opinion on whole thing. And last bag.
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You quoted me. Me .., the guy you bragged about having on ignore.

It never goes well for you when you come out of the storage shed. Some people never learn.
 
aunty dive said:
Are you able to point to a particular post or posts where I’ve suggested anyone in this discussion is stupid?
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Your understanding of the discovery process appears to be minimal, at best.
Surely you understand that the injunction application decision is much more consequential.
 
wi_racefan said:
They way their lawyer talked like this is so clearly illegal that anyone can see it and winning will be no issue
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As I said … I could have missed those remarks and apparently I did.

The success or failure of the injunction application will be a big tell, IMO.
 
aunty dive said:
I wasn’t aware they’d said anything like that but I certainly could have missed it.
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This work? You posted it.

“The France family and NASCAR are monopolistic bullies. And bullies will continue to impose their will to hurt others until their targets stand up and refuse to be victims. That moment has arrived.”
 
StandOnIt said:
Your understanding of the discovery process appears to be minimal, at best.
Surely you understand that the injunction application decision is much more consequential.
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I believe the first comment is a non-personalized statement of fact. 3 other respected posters agreed with it and the person I was speaking to gave a reasonable response and didn’t appear to have taken it the way you did.

2nd comment … Again - not personalized and implies nothing more than what it plainly says.

Find someone else to pick a fight with.
 
StandOnIt said:
This work? You posted it.

“The France family and NASCAR are monopolistic bullies. And bullies will continue to impose their will to hurt others until their targets stand up and refuse to be victims. That moment has arrived.”
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Now that you’ve reminded me, yes I do remember Mr. Kessler saying that.

We’ll see if he’s worth his hourly rate.
 
aunty dive said:
I believe the first comment is a non-personalized statement of fact. 3 other respected posters agreed with it and the person I was speaking to gave a reasonable response and didn’t appear to have taken it the way you did.

2nd comment … Again - not personalized and implies nothing more than what it plainly says.

Find someone else to pick a fight with.
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No picking, but tit for tat is what you will get.
 
jaqua19 said:
Yup. It's called retaliation lol
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Younger fans don't know that Nascar has been keeping teams in line for years. Before they had timing lines in the pits, they had stop watches. You could bet if one of their drivers was acting up it was a guaranteed speeding penalty coming. Today because of betting they don't do that. What they do though is find something wrong with the car during inspections.
Nascar is in competition with the teams for sponsors for their various races. They can be very persuasive if they want to.
 
aunty dive said:
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I agree with the tweet to a certain point... the ruling on expedited discovery does seem like a minor skirmish, compared to the substance of the November 4 hearing on the injunction. However, even that argument, scheduled for next Monday, is hardly the litmus test of this lawsuit, IMO.

The judge is going to have to rule, sooner or later, on the definition of the relevant market. Are we talking about professional stock car racing, as 23XI and Front Row propose? Or is the relevant market defined as Nascar suggests... all sports and entertainment... presumably including IndyCar, F1, NHRA, Supercross, Monster Trucks, NFL, March Madness, UFC fights, Taylor Swift concerts, on and on. That ruling to define the relevant market will be the big battle with real blood. Up to then, it's just preliminary sparring over small details, IMO.


BobbyFord said:
I hope they get their ass kicked in court.
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StandOnIt said:
Naw, I'm surprised. I thought you were a real fan of Nascar.
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I can't speak for @BobbyFord, but I'm a real fan of the sport of Nascar. That doesn't make me a fan of the monopoly of Nascar, or the owners of Nascar. There is a difference.

I'm also a fan of the history of Nascar and of the France family. But building a great dynasty does not give the Frances unfettered monopoly power in the face of a changed economic world. Just my opinion.
 
LewTheShoe said:
I agree with the tweet to a certain point... the ruling on expedited discovery does seem like a minor skirmish, compared to the substance of the November 4 hearing on the injunction. However, even that argument, scheduled for next Monday, is hardly the litmus test of this lawsuit, IMO.

The judge is going to have to rule, sooner or later, on the definition of the relevant market. Are we talking about professional stock car racing, as 23XI and Front Row propose? Or is the relevant market defined as Nascar suggests... all sports and entertainment... presumably including IndyCar, F1, NHRA, Supercross, Monster Trucks, NFL, March Madness, UFC fights, Taylor Swift concerts, on and on. That ruling to define the relevant market will be the big battle with real blood. Up to then, it's just preliminary sparring over small details, IMO.




I can't speak for @BobbyFord, but I'm a real fan of the sport of Nascar. That doesn't make me a fan of the monopoly of Nascar, or the owners of Nascar. There is a difference.

I'm also a fan of the history of Nascar and of the France family. But building a great dynasty does not give the Frances unfettered monopoly power in the face of a changed economic world. Just my opinion.
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I'm not seeing the monopoly thing. Nascar isn't stopping anybody from racing in those other series.
 
Is this hearing thing going to wrap up in 1 day or take several?

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StandOnIt said:
Does that mean he isn't going to take and spend his charter money? Maybe hire a good comedian?
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Do we even know whos getting what in the deal? And in reality only one charter appears to be sold right now

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wi_racefan said:
Do we even know whos getting what in the deal? And in reality only one charter appears to be sold right now

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Multi millions should cover it. The charters are already sold. Waiting on approval by Nascar. Probably might be why Smoke isn't happy. He can see the money, but he can't spend it.
 
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