Alan Kulwicki

aunty dive said:
His story is the stuff Halls of Fame are made of.
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I agree. This story wont repeat for a very long time if ever. I was there
that fateful day in Atl, Nov. 1992. The race for the ages.
 
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Hotrod said:
I agree. This story wont repeat for a very long time if ever. I was there
that fateful day in Atl, Nov. 1992. The race for the ages.
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I was there also, went to the concert the night before honoring Petty. The group Alabama performed. Somewhere I still have my ticket autographed by the King. That was a fantastic race, and the grandstands were packed. There were Fords, Chevys, Olds, Buicks and Pontiacs in the field, and no two looked alike. What a day.
 
mack said:
I was there also, went to the concert the night before honoring Petty. The group Alabama performed. Somewhere I still have my ticket autographed by the King. That was a fantastic race, and the grandstands were packed. There were Fords, Chevys, Olds, Buicks and Pontiacs in the field, and no two looked alike. What a day.
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Yep, we were on the back straight stands coming out of T2.
Those Apache (looking) helicopters following Petty around the
parade laps was awesome. They were sooooo low !
 
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To me the answer is No. One season shouldn't be enough to get in and the main problem i've had with the HOF since the beginning is it's not exclusive enough.
Ray Evernham is in.
Ron Hornaday is in.
really?
 
I read a story about AJ Foyt in current issue of Hagerty magazine. Part of the story talked about Kulwicki and Foyt roughing each other up during a caution at Talledega. Both had to serve a penalty and Foyt hit him again leaving the pit (Foyt got another penalty). It takes something to stand up to Foyt, I wasn't aware of that side of Kulwicki's personality.
 
Hotrod said:
Yep, we were on the back straight stands coming out of T2.
Those Apache (looking) helicopters following Petty around the
parade laps was awesome. They were sooooo low ![/QUOTE

That's crazy! We were on the backstretch about 15 rows up right out of turn 2. The Apaches were awesome. Somewhere in my junk I have a poster that DuPont was passing out in the infield, it has a rendering of the #24 Lumina, and all the DuPont color codes on it. Plus a rendering of JG and that cheezy mustache. One of these days when I keel over, I hope my kids will go through my junk, might find something worthwhile.
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Johnny G said:
To me the answer is No. One season shouldn't be enough to get in and the main problem i've had with the HOF since the beginning is it's not exclusive enough.
Ray Evernham is in.
Ron Hornaday is in.
really?
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Ray Evernham won three Cup titles as a crew chief and a butt load of races, including two Daytona 500's. two Brickyard 400's, two Coke 600's and four Southern 500s. He also brought a manufacturer back to the sport from scratch and won races as a car owner. Maybe more importantly, he was perhaps the prototype for the modern crew chief and changed the game in so many ways. A lot of things we take for granted now are because Ray did them first. In my opinion, Evernham is among the top half dozen crew chiefs to ever sit on the box. I have zero problem with him being in the Hall. Ron Hornaday is the king of the Truck Series. You can argue that his accomplishments there don't equate to Cup level achievement, but unless the hall wants to make separate categories for different NASCAR divisions, (which I would be fine with) how can you exclude Hornaday from the Hall?
 
Let me get this right...
AK basically started a CUP team with nothing
AK was an owner/driver champion
AK was the first northern born champion
AK coined the iconic "underbird"
AK is credited with creating the "Polish Victory Lap"
AK landed Hooters as a sponsor...would they have been in NASCAR without him?
AK at the time won the closest championship in NASCAR Cup history during one of the most memorable races ever.
AK brought back "Mighty Mouse"
AK was the "My Way" guy
AK died as the current Cup champion
AK was a fan favorite because of his dedication, work ethic and lifestyle.

Yes, I was always a huge AK fan and think he deserves a place in NASCAR's Hall of Fame at some point.
 
sdj said:
In time, Alan K get's in, as it should be. Hell of a story there. Plus with "HOOTERS" on the car, I mean, come on. :punkrocke
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AtomicPunk55 said:
Don't forget the #1 of Rick Mast either. He had my favorite Hooters pain scheme.
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...and don't forget about Hooters sponsoring Brett Bodine.
...and Greg Biffle at the Cup level.
Others at the truck and busch level.
 
Formerjackman said:
Not that any of this was Kulwicki's problem, but 1992 was a VERY down year for NASCAR performance. Dale Earnhardt and Rusty Wallace's seasons were among the worst of their careers, Mark Martin had a so-so year, Ricky Rudd took a step back, Ernie Irvan and Dale Jarrett had yet to assert their prowess, the next batch of superstars wasn't there yet. Even in championship contention, none of the points leader's seasons were stellar. Kulwicki's 4078 points was the lowest total EVER for a champion under the Latford System, and would have only been good enough for fourth place in the season before and after. From 1998 through 2001, I think each champion scored more than a 1000 more points than Kulwicki did in 1992. That championship was a Christmas miracle, the like never to be seen again.
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I think Gant was fourth in the standings, seemed a great, but very odd year
 
DIDIT said:
Let me get this right...
AK basically started a CUP team with nothing
AK was an owner/driver champion
AK was the first northern born champion
AK coined the iconic "underbird"
AK is credited with creating the "Polish Victory Lap"
AK landed Hooters as a sponsor...would they have been in NASCAR without him?
AK at the time won the closest championship in NASCAR Cup history during one of the most memorable races ever.
AK brought back "Mighty Mouse"
AK was the "My Way" guy
AK died as the current Cup champion
AK was a fan favorite because of his dedication, work ethic and lifestyle.

Yes, I was always a huge AK fan and think he deserves a place in NASCAR's Hall of Fame at some point.
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All well and fine, but only the first two items listed would have ANY influence on me if I were voting on HoF membership.
 
BradBlaney said:
I think Gant was fourth in the standings, seemed a great, but very odd year
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Other than the number of wins, 2 VS 5, Gant had almost a carbon copy of his 1991 season and he ended up with almost the exact same number of points and was fourth both years. Gant's final two years as a driver were not nearly as good. Age may have been some of it, but I think the loss of Andy Petree to RCR was a bigger reason.
 
Formerjackman said:
Ray Evernham won three Cup titles as a crew chief and a butt load of races, including two Daytona 500's. two Brickyard 400's, two Coke 600's and four Southern 500s. He also brought a manufacturer back to the sport from scratch and won races as a car owner. Maybe more importantly, he was perhaps the prototype for the modern crew chief and changed the game in so many ways. A lot of things we take for granted now are because Ray did them first. In my opinion, Evernham is among the top half dozen crew chiefs to ever sit on the box. I have zero problem with him being in the Hall. Ron Hornaday is the king of the Truck Series. You can argue that his accomplishments there don't equate to Cup level achievement, but unless the hall wants to make separate categories for different NASCAR divisions, (which I would be fine with) how can you exclude Hornaday from the Hall?
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I can see the argument for Evernham in one way but also to me he was'nt a "star" per say of the sport. I can undertsnad your reasoning. i still disagree hes a Hall of Famers.
As per Hornaday he was a truck series driver. Not the top level. No one should get in hall of fame based on truck series accomplishments or Xfinity series either. Hall of Famers should be Cup Series.
 
DIDIT said:
Let me get this right...
AK basically started a CUP team with nothing
AK was an owner/driver champion
AK was the first northern born champion
AK coined the iconic "underbird"
AK is credited with creating the "Polish Victory Lap"
AK landed Hooters as a sponsor...would they have been in NASCAR without him?
AK at the time won the closest championship in NASCAR Cup history during one of the most memorable races ever.
AK brought back "Mighty Mouse"
AK was the "My Way" guy
AK died as the current Cup champion
AK was a fan favorite because of his dedication, work ethic and lifestyle.

Yes, I was always a huge AK fan and think he deserves a place in NASCAR's Hall of Fame at some point.
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Being a 'northern born champion' isn't a factor in my book.
A victory celebration isn't grounds for HoF.
I dunno what the 'Mighty Mouse' connection was, but I've only been following the sport since '95. If he "brought back" (from where?), then it's gone back there again since.
Would Hooters have been in the sport without him? You could ask that about any number of sponsors he (and others) haven't brought to the sport.
"My Way" guy? A nickname isn't justification either.
Dying as champion isn't grounds either. I'm sorry I never got to see him race, but that's purely a sentimental factor.

Fan favorite? If any of those criteria get him in besides owner/driver of a self-started team, that will be the one.

I am definitely NOT saying he shouldn't be in (and not saying he should). I'm only saying that on that list of criteria, most of them don't support entry in my book.
 
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Johnny G said:
I can see the argument for Evernham in one way but also to me he was'nt a "star" per say of the sport. I can undertsnad your reasoning. i still disagree hes a Hall of Famers.
As per Hornaday he was a truck series driver. Not the top level. No one should get in hall of fame based on truck series accomplishments or Xfinity series either. Hall of Famers should be Cup Series.
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It's not called the Cup Series Hall of Fame, it's called the NASCAR Hall of Fame.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Being a 'northern born champion' isn't a factor in my book.
A victory celebration isn't grounds for HoF.
I dunno what the 'Mighty Mouse' connection is. If he "brought back" (from where?), then it's gone back again since.
Would Hooters have been in the sport without him? You could ask that about any number of sponsors he (and others) haven't brought to the sport.
"My Way" guy? A nickname isn't justification either.
Dying as champion isn't grounds either. I'm sorry I never got to see him race, but that's purely a sentimental factor.

Fan favorite? If any of those criteria get him in besides owner/driver of a self-started team, that will be the one.

I am definitely NOT saying he shouldn't be in (and not saying he should). I'm only saying that on that list of criteria, most of them don't support entry in my book.
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Certainly can't argue with that. I never said that was the list to get him into the Hall. Just things I remember about him.
He was well known to carry the Mighty Mouse figure on his car and uniform. See pic of the "underbird".
a7d78b01-1f1f-4f27-8d5d-80ca1f3e1724.jpg
 
Johnny G said:
I can see the argument for Evernham in one way but also to me he was'nt a "star" per say of the sport. I can undertsnad your reasoning. i still disagree hes a Hall of Famers.
As per Hornaday he was a truck series driver. Not the top level. No one should get in hall of fame based on truck series accomplishments or Xfinity series either. Hall of Famers should be Cup Series.
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It's the NASCAR Hall of Fame. So, to me that includes all the series. If it were just for the Cup drivers, it wouldn't be as meaningful or educational. I think Herb Nab should be in it. Maurice Petty is in. I think the Hall should about drivers, crew chiefs, owners, and people who helped shape the sport. I would like to see T. Wayne Robertson in the HoF. He was huge in the success of the Winston Cup Series. I saw this year where Janet Guthrie has been nominated for a Landmark Award, for people making outstanding contributions to NASCAR, I have no problem with her being recognized that way. But in her case, not as a driver. 0 wins and 0 titles shouldn't be HoF worthy. But to me, AK is a no brainer. Rookie of the year in 1985, first time winner in 1988, Champion in 1992. I see a steady progression from start to finish. Just my 2 cents.
 
Johnny G said:
I can see the argument for Evernham in one way but also to me he was'nt a "star" per say of the sport. I can undertsnad your reasoning. i still disagree hes a Hall of Famers.
As per Hornaday he was a truck series driver. Not the top level. No one should get in hall of fame based on truck series accomplishments or Xfinity series either. Hall of Famers should be Cup Series.
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Regarding Evernham, for about five years, he was a bigger star than 75% of the drivers. Heck, he was the first crew chief I know of that had his own sponsorship deals. As I said, I will agree that dumping ALL NASCAR people into the same bucket is full of pitfalls, but that is what they did, so you HAVE to include drivers from lower series, crew chiefs, car owners, etc.
 
DIDIT said:
Yea, I get your position from prior posts.
What is your take on Wendell Scott, should he have been inducted?
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I was absolutely against it, and I was verbally beaten up in several venues for having the audacity to say it out load. If they want to build a monument honoring Wendell Scott in the middle of the Hall of Fame Museum, that's fine with me, but I'm sorry, his career is not Hall of Fame material any more than Janet Guthrie's is.
 
Johnny G said:
To me the answer is No. One season shouldn't be enough to get in and the main problem i've had with the HOF since the beginning is it's not exclusive enough.
Ray Evernham is in.
Ron Hornaday is in.
really?
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Ron Hornaday's biggest influence on the sport may well have been off the track. The Hornaday's opened their home to a number of up-and-coming young drivers, including future champions Jimmie Johnson and Kevin Harvick. Having a free home base allowed those drivers to concentrate more on building their careers and less on how they would support themselves. HoF administrators have often joked that Hornaday's guest room couch belongs in the building almost as much as some of the cars.
 
Formerjackman said:
Regarding Evernham, for about five years, he was a bigger star than 75% of the drivers. Heck, he was the first crew chief I know of that had his own sponsorship deals. As I said, I will agree that dumping ALL NASCAR people into the same bucket is full of pitfalls, but that is what they did, so you HAVE to include drivers from lower series, crew chiefs, car owners, etc.
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If the HoF is just for Cup drivers, its gonna be a very small HoF. They're already up to Jeff Gordon, so they're going to have to go back and really start re evaluating a bunch if drivers. I hope they will recognize all the touring series. Tell the stories of Jack Ingram, Red Farmer, Tommy Houston and guys like those. All those Cup drivers had to come from somewhere. If I ever went to the HoF, I'd want to see more than Petty, Earnhardt and Gordon. The HoF should tell an abundance of stories. Not just the superstars.
 
mack said:
If the HoF is just for Cup drivers, its gonna be a very small HoF. They're already up to Jeff Gordon, so they're going to have to go back and really start re evaluating a bunch if drivers. I hope they will recognize all the touring series. Tell the stories of Jack Ingram, Red Farmer, Tommy Houston and guys like those. All those Cup drivers had to come from somewhere. If I ever went to the HoF, I'd want to see more than Petty, Earnhardt and Gordon. The HoF should tell an abundance of stories. Not just the superstars.
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I have thought all along that after the first couple of classes, they really needed to slow down the number of driver inductees that went in, because they ARE going to run out of qualified applicants, probably sooner than later. I also agree that the Hall of Fame is a great place to tell the stories noteworthy people in the sport's history. That does NOT mean that all of those people need to be recognized as Hall of Famers. I know that not EVERY exhibit at Cooperstown and Canton is centered strictly on HoF members. Pete's Rose's achievements are chronicled in Cooperstown, even though he likely will never be inducted.
 
If only 32 people in the history of the sport have been crowned Champion at the Cup level then it should be an automatic that you are in the HOF if you are a part of that number. That is a very small number of people.
 
It's an apples to oranges comparison and NASCAR makes us put them in the same fruit basket. Hornaday is the best all time apple. Kulwicki is not the best all time orange.
 
Personally I prefer grapes, is there a driver no matter the series that we can define as a grape?
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Any of them that live in Concord. :D

I'm here all week.
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This thread has been something else since yesterday. Our resident racing experts/insiders were laying absolute haymakers on the jackman who took it like a champ and is back today for round 2
 
I'm not sure if I'm of the thinking that a championship automatically gets you in. A championship means you were the best in a particular year, but not necessarily over the course of a career.

Another former champion that I think is a borderline HOF guy is Bobby Labonte. He only had two really good seasons (1999 and 2000), but never finished higher than 6th in points outside of that. He did also win a BGN title so that might put him over the top. I'd put Truex in the same category if he doesn't win another title.
 
Formerjackman said:
I've taken an awful lot haymakers over the years, which might explain a few things........:)
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You're my hero lol you took those personal shots and just kept trying to get your point across without losing your cool. Whether you were right or wrong on the HOF debate, you looked past the schoolyard bully tactics and tried to engage in a worthwhile conversation. That's all you can do on a internet message board.
 
ToyYoda said:
Another former champion that I think is a borderline HOF guy is Bobby Labonte. He only had two really good seasons (1999 and 2000), but never finished higher than 6th in points outside of that. He did also win a BGN title so that might put him over the top. I'd put Truex in the same category if he doesn't win another title.
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Just depends on your point of view. Is the HOF only for longevity of really good? Brief spirts of elite? Or all encompassing? Not everyone can be Gordon, Petty or Earnhardt.

Bobby Labonte is an interesting case because his prime was a lot shorter than other champions. He didn’t land a full time Cup ride until age 29, ended up with Gibbs and won his first race at 31. He notched all 21 wins and his Cup title in an 8 year span, and was done winning by age 40. Had he landed at a team like RCR, rather than Petty, he likely had a few more wins in him. But agreed, his time at the top of the sport was short lived.

In my mind, Labonte was one of the top drivers of the late 90’s. Add on his Busch Series championship (he was the first to win the title in Busch and Cup) and I’d say he’s a rock solid HOF candidate. Others may disagree I’m sure.
 
JBone88 said:
Just depends on your point of view. Is the HOF only for longevity of really good? Brief spirts of elite? Or all encompassing? Not everyone can be Gordon, Petty or Earnhardt.

Bobby Labonte is an interesting case because his prime was a lot shorter than other champions. He didn’t land a full time Cup ride until age 29, ended up with Gibbs and won his first race at 31. He notched all 21 wins and his Cup title in an 8 year span, and was done winning by age 40. Had he landed at a team like RCR, rather than Petty, he likely had a few more wins in him. But agreed, his time at the top of the sport was short lived.

In my mind, Labonte was one of the top drivers of the late 90’s. Add on his Busch Series championship (he was the first to win the title in Busch and Cup) and I’d say he’s a rock solid HOF candidate. Others may disagree I’m sure.
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Interesting point and I was actually thinking of Labonte while the sparring about AK was going on here yesterday, I think Bobby's case will have as much if not more debate. His 1999 season was incredible, 23 top 5 finishes and 26 top 10's! That's crazy consistency
 
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Formerjackman said:
Other than the number of wins, 2 VS 5, Gant had almost a carbon copy of his 1991 season and he ended up with almost the exact same number of points and was fourth both years. Gant's final two years as a driver were not nearly as good. Age may have been some of it, but I think the loss of Andy Petree to RCR was a bigger reason.
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Always had a respect for Harry, though '92 was about the time I started watching Nascar at the end of his career. That Skoal bandit was iconic
 
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