All-Star race experimentation receives mostly high marks

StandOnIt said:
That doesn't make any sense. About the same as saying has the Gov't in the last 15 years, blah blah blah, or have the decisions anybody has made in the last 15 years and the 20 20 hindsight rig of a marole is pretty laughable also. It's a different world if you haven't noticed. Racing isn't exempt.
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I agree that it is a different world and some niche sports like the NHL have adapted well and prospered and others like Nascar have floundered. The recently concluded Winter Classic packed in close to 80K on New Year’s Day at Notre Dame Stadium.

One has been managed well and the other has been grossly mismanaged. No rig, no a and no marole on that one.
 
IanMcVittie said:
I agree that it is a different world and some niche sports like the NHL have adapted well and prospered and others like Nascar have floundered. The recently concluded Winter Classic packed in close to 80K on New Year’s Day at Notre Dame Stadium.

One has been managed well and the other has been grossly mismanaged. No rig, no a and no marole on that one.
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comparison to a simple game, doesn't make any sense either..but please continue. What's next cell phones to the auto industry?
 
StandOnIt said:
comparison to a simple game, doesn't make any sense either..but please continue. What's next cell phones to the auto industry?
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I wouldn’t describe the NHL as simple at all as it is full of highly skilled athletes and astute businessmen.
 
IanMcVittie said:
I agree that it is a different world and some niche sports like the NHL have adapted well and prospered and others like Nascar have floundered. The recently concluded Winter Classic packed in close to 80K on New Year’s Day at Notre Dame Stadium.

One has been managed well and the other has been grossly mismanaged. No rig, no a and no marole on that one.
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Completely off-topic, I hear Notre Dame ran out of beer before the second period.
 
IanMcVittie said:
I do not but I’m sure if you’re interested you could track it down. You’ll probably run across where Dewar said most Nascar fans live in California too.
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As much as I was not a fan of Dewar, I have never been able to track this quote down, and I suspect it's not quite what he actually said.
 
gnomesayin said:
As much as I was not a fan of Dewar, I have never been able to track this quote down, and I suspect it's not quite what he actually said.
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I will track it down and I believe it was by Dustin Long in 2017. I believe Dewar said California has NASCAR’s largest audience
 
IanMcVittie said:
I do not but I’m sure if you’re interested you could track it down. You’ll probably run across where Dewar said most Nascar fans live in California too.
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I didnt ask you about what Dewar said, I asked you where Brian France said fans asked for stages.
 
Spotter22 said:
I didnt ask you about what Dewar said, I asked you where Brian France said fans asked for stages
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I would much rather have you disbelieve what I said as I don’t feel like taking the time to find the article. It is like when you told me that the 2019 rules were one of the most researched items in recent Nascar history but did not provide any supporting documentation. I didn’t feel like tracking it down so I left it at that.
 
Spotter22 said:
I dont see a problem with waiting to see what kind of racing we get this year.
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What is the point in having an online forum where thoughts, ideas and opinions are tossed around if you can’t speculate on future happenings?

I think the 2019 rules suck because speed has been arbitrarily reduced. I think it will dumb the racing down. I think it will cause more pack racing, more wrecks and longer races which I think will also suck.

Will I watch some of the races to see if they change my mind as to the quality of them? You bet I will but until then I am giving my opinion about what I think.
 
IanMcVittie said:
The biggest one we talked about on here was stage racing. Apparently it was what the fans had been asking for even though no one knew what it was.
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Spotter22 said:
Who said the fans asked for it?
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IanMcVittie said:
BZF
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No fans involved in what I see. I think the "industry stakeholders" have been the TV and Nascar trying to find a solution to not only covering up much of the racing with commercials and using fake cautions sometimes to do so. They had to completely come up with a different racing format to so that it includes from a competition side awarding points for stage finishes and besides adding a long commercial break it can and has added to the action..sometimes. Screwed up the points system..totally

“Simply put, this will make our great racing even better,” Brian France, NASCAR chairman and CEO, said.
“I’m proud of the unprecedented collaboration from our industry stakeholders, each of whom had a common goal — strengthening the sport for our fans.

Here is Penske's take
NASCAR’s new stage-based race format is kind of a big deal, with some close to the sport applauding the forward-thinking structure and others decrying the break with decades of tradition.

“I think the TV guys have really put their foot down that they want more action, because of the money they’re committing to the sport over a long period of time,” Team Penske owner Roger Penske told SiriusXM NASCAR Radio, via USA TODAY

Read more at: https://nesn.com/2017/02/nascar-rules-changes-came-after-tv-executives-really-put-their-foot-down/
 
StandOnIt said:
No fans involved in what I see. I think the "industry stakeholders" have been the TV and Nascar trying to find a solution to not only covering up much of the racing with commercials and using fake cautions sometimes to do so. They had to completely come up with a different racing format to so that it includes from a competition side awarding points for stage finishes and besides adding a long commercial break it can and has added to the action..sometimes. Screwed up the points system..totally

“Simply put, this will make our great racing even better,” Brian France, NASCAR chairman and CEO, said.
“I’m proud of the unprecedented collaboration from our industry stakeholders, each of whom had a common goal — strengthening the sport for our fans.

Here is Penske's take
NASCAR’s new stage-based race format is kind of a big deal, with some close to the sport applauding the forward-thinking structure and others decrying the break with decades of tradition.

“I think the TV guys have really put their foot down that they want more action, because of the money they’re committing to the sport over a long period of time,” Team Penske owner Roger Penske told SiriusXM NASCAR Radio, via USA TODAY

Read more at: https://nesn.com/2017/02/nascar-rules-changes-came-after-tv-executives-really-put-their-foot-down/
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Basically what Penske is saying is the TV guys are not getting an ROI so they are telling Nascar what to do in order to try and get the ship off the iceberg and re-floated.

Between Nascar and the TV guys they managed to piss off almost 800k fans (yes eight hundred thousand fans) that watched in 2017 but decided to do something else in 2018.

Why Lesa and Uncle Jimmy let the bloated little alkie remain at the helm is beyond me.
 
Ventisca said:
Yup, there's no good spin on that one...
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It is very simplistic to say that is the only reason, I would guess there are many factors involved. But it makes for simplistic drama that some crave for. Throw it out there maybe it will stick. on every thread.
 
StandOnIt said:
It is very simplistic to say that is the only reason, I would guess there are many factors involved. But it makes for simplistic drama that some crave for. Throw it out there maybe it will stick. on every thread.
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Your thoughts and opinions on why you think Nascar lost almost 800k per race year over year would be welcome. Personally I think losing such a large chunk of your fan base in a single year is a dramatic drop don’t you?
 
IanMcVittie said:
Your thoughts and opinions on why you think Nascar lost almost 800k per race year over year would be welcome. Personally I think losing such a large chunk of your fan base in a single year is a dramatic drop don’t you?
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I think its for several reasons, todays lifestyles have changed, people live on thier phones and other devices that arent tracked properly yet, some fans didnt like the change, younger generation doesnt get in to motorsports like we did coming up, they just dont identify with the automobile. Its simply not one reason and one reason only.
 
Spotter22 said:
I think its for several reasons, todays lifestyles have changed, people live on thier phones and other devices that arent tracked properly yet, some fans didnt like the change, younger generation doesnt get in to motorsports like we did coming up, they just dont identify with the automobile. Its simply not one reason and one reason only.
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I hope the 2019 rules resonate with younger viewers. Even if it ends up that I don’t like them I’m fine with it provided new blood gets interested. The average age of a Nascar fan is 60 so getting younger is essential.
 
IanMcVittie said:
I think the 2019 rules suck because speed has been arbitrarily reduced. I think it will dumb the racing down. I think it will cause more pack racing, more wrecks and longer races which I think will also suck.
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Lets back up a bit. First of all the speeds and the cars of the 90's and early 2000 ( 650 HP) produced some great racing. This idea of faster is better is all in peoples minds. I doubt few can say they have driven anything 170 miles per hour so they need 200 mph. As a matter of fact fans love short track racing and the speeds are much slower out of necessity.
Wrecks in my opinion are caused by drivers over driving cars not capable of keeping up
and these drivers are driven by the fear of losing their rides. The only way a 30th place team can get to 20th place is by putting a better product on the track or hire a top 5 driver.
RFR proved this by bringing MK back and he was no better than Stenhouse.
 
Team Penske said:
Lets back up a bit. First of all the speeds and the cars of the 90's and early 2000 ( 650 HP) produced some great racing. This idea of faster is better is all in peoples minds. I doubt few can say they have driven anything 170 miles per hour so they need 200 mph. As a matter of fact fans love short track racing and the speeds are much slower out of necessity.
Wrecks in my opinion are caused by drivers over driving cars not capable of keeping up
and these drivers are driven by the fear of losing their rides. The only way a 30th place team can get to 20th place is by putting a better product on the track or hire a top 5 driver.
RFR proved this by bringing MK back and he was no better than Stenhouse.
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I agree that the average person can’t tell the difference between 190 and 170. The reason I don’t like the lower speeds is because I feel it penalizes the most skilled drivers.

When you slow a car down it gives the have nots, the less talented and the inexperienced a much better chance of performing better. In many cases it is a lot easier to enter a corner at 170 than 190. Maybe 10 guys on track can enter the corner at 190 but maybe 20 drivers doing 170 can. I don’t like it.
 
IanMcVittie said:
The reason I don’t like the lower speeds is because I feel it penalizes the most skilled drivers.
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I disagree with your thinking. You are choosing those who can drive the fastest. That is not usually the best driver. Dale E. did not usually have the fastest car but he was a SMARTER driver with what he had then someone who had the fastest car. Fastest drivers are usually the wreckers because they don't race smart. JJ. outsmarted JG and at the end of the season he won the championship.
 
Team Penske said:
I disagree with your thinking. You are choosing those who can drive the fastest. That is not usually the best driver. Dale E. did not usually have the fastest car but he was a SMARTER driver with what he had then someone who had the fastest car. Fastest drivers are usually the wreckers because they don't race smart. JJ. outsmarted JG and at the end of the season he won the championship.
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IDK what the differential in speed will be from 2018 to 2019 but so far I have not been enthused with what I have heard. I will definitely give things a fair chance though.
 
IanMcVittie said:
IDK what the differential in speed will be from 2018 to 2019 but so far I have not been enthused with what I have heard. I will definitely give things a fair chance though.
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The problem for me is the differential between straightaway speed and corner speed. Have them go 170, fine. But I want 130 in the corner, not 155. Make them drive.
 
Hey, can someone direct me to the 2019 Folds of Honor QuikTrip 500 - Atlanta - Rate the Race Thread? I wanted to voice my displeasure with the new package raced there before I have a chance to actually see it.

Seriously though, I hope that we're actually surprised and find that the racing isn't all as bad as we think it will be.
 
dpkimmel2001 said:
Hey, can someone direct me to the 2019 Folds of Honor QuikTrip 500 - Atlanta - Rate the Race Thread? I wanted to voice my displeasure with the new package raced there before I have a chance to actually see it.
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