Bojangles Bonehead

ted@economy said:
The other side of that coin is that the folks who claim that she wrecks every week are losing all of their bets. She hasn't had many DNF's this year and yes, I'd like to see her be a bit more aggressive but maybe now she knows when not to be aggressive .
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If people are claiming DP causes a bunch of wrecks they are not watching the same events I am as she doesn't even seem to have contact with others. As others have said it may be time to dial up the intensity and try some things out this year that may help next year. With 9 finishes on the lead lap this year it wouldn't hurt to do some different things and like Mr. E said it would help a lot if her crew did a better job with qualifying.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
If people are claiming DP causes a bunch of wrecks they are not watching the same events I am as she doesn't even seem to have contact with others. As others have said it may be time to dial up the intensity and try some things out this year that may help next year. With 9 finishes on the lead lap this year it wouldn't hurt to do some different things and like Mr. E said it would help a lot if her crew did a better job with qualifying.
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Here's a question for you . The sheet for practice speeds list at the bottom the 10 lap average speeds for cars who complete that many consecutive laps. I can only remember the 10 team appearing there once or twice. What does that say about their approach to preparing the race car ? Are they thrashing looking for speed at the track? Not as interested in long run speed? Relying on fuel mileage and tire wear input from others? Or are they just unprepared ?
 
All these folks saying Danica gets the short shrift are ridiculous. NASCAR and SHR would kill for her to win. I guarantee if she was in the lead of a race there would mysteriously be no debris on the track. Everyone should just admit it: she is among the worst drivers with a fulltime ride, and the worst driver with a ride on a premier team.
 
29-4 said:
All these folks saying Danica gets the short shrift are ridiculous. NASCAR and SHR would kill for her to win. I guarantee if she was in the lead of a race there would mysteriously be no debris on the track. Everyone should just admit it: she is among the worst drivers with a fulltime ride, and the worst driver with a ride on a premier team.
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She's pretty bad alright . What else ya got ? Did you know she is skinny ?
 
ted@economy said:
She's pretty bad alright . What else ya got ? Did you know she is skinny ?
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I think fit and trim better describes her.:D

danica-patrick-1450077470pc4l8-700x452.jpg
 
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29-4 said:
It's a slow day at work. I need four pages of debate with you, and figured this was a good avenue. :D
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I reset my preferences to enable 40 posts per page.

Much easier to follow your trail of incessant rants against the man. :cool:
 
aunty dive said:
I reset my preferences to enable 40 posts per page.

Much easier to follow your trail of incessant rants against the man. :cool:
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I thought the guy might have some new info that we haven't heard before . But I guess not .:(
 
ted@economy said:
Here's a question for you . The sheet for practice speeds list at the bottom the 10 lap average speeds for cars who complete that many consecutive laps. I can only remember the 10 team appearing there once or twice. What does that say about their approach to preparing the race car ? Are they thrashing looking for speed at the track? Not as interested in long run speed? Relying on fuel mileage and tire wear input from others? Or are they just unprepared ?
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Good questions and I don't know the answer because by now you would think any communication issues would be fixed and you would also think that the crew that works on the 10 car would be competent. She is down about 3.5 spots in qualifying this year over 2014 and 2015 but is finishing about 1 spot better for the same period. It has to be frustrating to roll off in the average starting position of 26th each week and who knows how much that is contributing to finishes off the lead lap? In 2014 she had 19 LLF's and in 2015 14 and this year is 9 so far and I can't see her ending up the year with anymore than 11 and that has to change.

Maybe the 10 team needs to go to Greenville-Pickens or some other track and try a bunch of different setups in order to try and find the right one.
 
The 10 cc has the same parts / pieces and access to the same simulation, shaker-rig and wind tunnel data as the crew chiefs of the other 3 cars have.

A reasonable conclusion seems to me to be that there are people / execution problems within that team. As I often do, I will say that it might be a good idea to fire somebody. I'd start with the car chief and work my way up until a solution was found.
 
aunty dive said:
The 10 cc has the same parts / pieces and access to the same simulation, shaker-rig and wind tunnel data as the crew chiefs of the other 3 cars have.

A reasonable conclusion seems to me to be that there are people / execution problems within that team. As I often do, I will say that it might be a good idea to fire somebody. I'd start with the car chief and work my way up until a solution was found.
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DP seems to like Billy so I dont think she will fire him.:rolleyes:
 
Zipadelli might but the will has to be there. And ... the problem might lie with other staffers directly beneath Billy Scott. As always, it only works if you can find a better replacement.

It seems that nothing they've done or tried to do this season has had a positive effect. The sponsor, the driver, the owners and the hard-working team members deserve better. Just my opinion, of course.
 
aunty dive said:
Zipadelli might but the will has to be there. And ... the problem might lie with other staffers directly beneath Billy Scott. As always, it only works if you can find a better replacement.

It seems that nothing they've done or tried to do this season has had a positive effect. The sponsor, the driver, the owners and the hard-working team members deserve better. Just my opinion, of course.
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What has been the one common denominator throughout Danica's poor career in Cup? I don't think even Chad Knaus could turn this driver into a true competitor.
 
aunty dive said:
Zipadelli might but the will has to be there. And ... the problem might lie with other staffers directly beneath Billy Scott. As always, it only works if you can find a better replacement.

It seems that nothing they've done or tried to do this season has had a positive effect. The sponsor, the driver, the owners and the hard-working team members deserve better. Just my opinion, of course.
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I was being sarcastic with my post. Zippy will do whatever the hell he wants to do with the 10. She had no say in who was going to be her CC this year.The only thing they are doing better this year is unloading better and being more consistent with finishes. Until they find a couple more tenths the 10 will continue to finish p20 every race.
 
aunty dive said:
The 10 cc has the same parts / pieces and access to the same simulation, shaker-rig and wind tunnel data as the crew chiefs of the other 3 cars have.

A reasonable conclusion seems to me to be that there are people / execution problems within that team. As I often do, I will say that it might be a good idea to fire somebody. I'd start with the car chief and work my way up until a solution was found.
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Is there a lot to be learned from 10+runs , or is it low on the priority list during practice ? Mr E is correct . a couple of tenths would move her up a long way in the standings .
 
Ok that is weird . I bring this up one time and this last practice , almost every car in the field does a 10+ lap run . If that doesn't prove the teams monitor racing-forums ..nothing does .
 
Well , you were off on that Barney Oldfield nostalgia trip and we didn't know if you were coming back . But , if you think of a bonehead ....(other than me ...of course)
 
aunty dive said:
The 10 cc has the same parts / pieces and access to the same simulation, shaker-rig and wind tunnel data as the crew chiefs of the other 3 cars have.

A reasonable conclusion seems to me to be that there are people / execution problems within that team. As I often do, I will say that it might be a good idea to fire somebody. I'd start with the car chief and work my way up until a solution was found.
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Speaking of execution I heard Harvick being interviewed the other day and when asked about his team's execution he said he was in favor of it.

You don't start firing people and replacing them in the hope that things get better because as plans go the hope plan is the worst. The first thing you do is identify the problem(s) and once you have a handle on what they are you can plan your work and then work your plan. Tony Gibson could probably tell you in less than 60 seconds what needs to be done in order to get the 10 car routinely finishing inside the top 20 with occasional top 15's.

If I had to guess I would say that Gene Haas does not think that there is any problem with the 10 as DP is very easy on equipment and the team normally finishes between 22 and 27th. Between purse winnings and the sponsors checks what is there not to like?
 
29-4 said:
What has been the one common denominator throughout Danica's poor career in Cup? I don't think even Chad Knaus could turn this driver into a true competitor.
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Mr. E is a good source for DP info as he follows her fairly closely and he said she slows down when she is around traffic. That is one thing that would need to change order to get better finishes.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
Speaking of execution I heard Harvick being interviewed the other day and when asked about his team's execution he said he was in favor of it.

You don't start firing people and replacing them in the hope that things get better because as plans go the hope plan is the worst. The first thing you do is identify the problem(s) and once you have a handle on what they are you can plan your work and then work your plan. Tony Gibson could probably tell you in less than 60 seconds what needs to be done in order to get the 10 car routinely finishing inside the top 20 with occasional top 15's.
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You wouldn't. I would.

If Mr. Gibson had that knowledge, he would have imparted it by now.
 
kymartin6 said:
Kevin Harvick for once again calling out his crew on national T.V.


They knew how bad they screwed up.... And even though Kevin had every right to be pissed..... The tongue lashing should have been done back at the shop. He done nothing at all to help team work.... These guys respect him even less now. He might as well now go looking for a whole new pit crew one race away from the chase. Granted..... had they been more prepared and executed their job.... he would have more than likely won the race....... but.... Kevin ain't Jesus Christ either..... we have all seen him screw up and never once have I heard his pit crew get in front of the camera and say...... '' The guys at the shop and us pit guys gave him the very best equipment and great pit stops.... but... the driver just dropped the ball today''.........
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This completely sums up my dislike for Harvick. There is a time and a place for the haranguing. It is not in front of the media and the viewers at home. My man JJ frequently has pit road problems, yes, but he seems to realize that verbal harassment will not solve the problem, which is why you'll rarely hear him bitching about much of anything on the radio. Does Harvick's crew throw a hissy-fit when he overdrives a corner and ruins their day? I doubt it.
 
Wow, the bonehead thread is still going while the start of the next race weekend is under way, when is the checkered flag gonna fly on this one?:laugh::laugh:
 
aunty dive said:
You wouldn't. I would.

If Mr. Gibson had that knowledge, he would have imparted it by now.
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Just firing people without any knowledge of the problem or it's cause is the height of stupidity as it is like cutting off your arm because you have a hangnail. May God help you if you ever have to own and/or manage a failing business back to health or ramp up for growth.

I think plenty of people know how to up the performance of the 10 team but with happy sponsors and no great expectations placed upon them it doesn't make sense to upset the apple cart.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
Just firing people without any knowledge of the problem or it's cause is the height of stupidity as it is like cutting off your arm because you have a hangnail. May God help you if you ever have to own and/or manage a failing business back to health or ramp up for growth.

I think plenty of people know how to up the performance of the 10 team but with happy sponsors and no great expectations placed upon them it doesn't make sense to upset the apple cart.
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Before you interjected, we were discussing it from the point of view of making the cars better with Ms. Patrick in the seat. I've forgotten more about what makes racecars behave properly than you have ever known and I'd rather not be called stupid if that's all right with you.

With 2 partners, I have run a civil construction business successfully for a long time. I'm sure your management career was equally successful ... as an employee.
 
aunty dive said:
Before you interjected, we were discussing it from the point of view of making the cars better with Ms. Patrick in the seat. I've forgotten more about what makes racecars behave properly than you have ever known and I'd rather not be called stupid if that's all right with you.

With 2 partners, I have run a civil construction business successfully for a long time. I'm sure your management career was equally successful ... as an employee.
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Read: I do this, therefore my argument is more valid than yours.

I do believe that you're better than to resort to this sort of debate tactic.
 
aunty dive said:
Before you interjected, we were discussing it from the point of view of making the cars better with Ms. Patrick in the seat. I've forgotten more about what makes racecars behave properly than you have ever known and I'd rather not be called stupid if that's all right with you.

With 2 partners, I have run a civil construction business successfully for a long time. I'm sure your management career was equally successful ... as an employee.
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Actually I had a majority interest in and managed a business for 25 years and I started out with 8 employees and ended up with 75. I sold the busines but retained the real estate and did well. After 3 years I was bored and bought a money losing business that now is a money maker that I am still a financial participant in but I am not involved in the day to day operations other than to go in and annoy people.

I do apologize for intimating you were stupid as that is clearly not the case and you don't have to convince me that you have more knowledge about race cars with good or bad behavior. I have about as much interest in yaw and the section modulus of a racing frame then I do going out and playing in traffic as that sort of thing is not for me. If you truly feel that the best course of action for improving performance in a race team or a bread company is to indiscriminately begin firing people then I will leave you to it.
 
Accepted.

Not indiscriminately. I said I would start with the car chief and move up the last 2 rungs on that ladder if necessary.
 
aunty dive said:
Accepted.

Not indiscriminately. I said I would start with the car chief and move up the last 2 rungs on that ladder if necessary.
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But doesn't the Car chief get his instructions from the crew chief. I thought it was his job to make sure the car was ready to unload and race as per the set up designated by said CC.
 
Team Penske said:
But doesn't the Car chief get his instructions from the crew chief. I thought it was his job to make sure the car was ready to unload and race as per the set up designated by said CC.
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I do think you are correct, the chain of command goes Crew Chief, Car chief, and so on .
 
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