Bonehead of the Week: Pocono

Matthew2470 said:
Oh give me a flockin break. When you have the chancee to make your move you take it. If he'd not done it and not had the chance to do it later you'd be ripping him fir not having the balls to go for a win. Unreal.
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How many laps were left when Joey tapped Mark, weren't there 6or 7 left? I honestly think Mark knew Joey had the faster car and Joey would of got him in the tunnel or going into 3. I think Joey is very impatient, I've seen the kid coming up around here at the local level and he did the same thing. And you would of been bitching if Joey hit Mark hard enough to put him in the wall. There is a difference between having balls and being smart enought to use them. Joey doesn't know that yet.
 
VaDirt said:
but dammit, the drivers should know that if they go over the speed limit (which they DO know when they're doing), they should know that a penalty could be forthcoming, regardless of where they are when they do it.
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NASCAR is unique because there are 43 cars sharing a crowded pit road. They need to be able to hit the gas coming in or out of the box to keep from running in to each other. I like that nascar makes the crews a bigger part of the competition, along with demanding a few more skills from the drivers.

I would like to see nascar institute a safe pit road speed and enforce that. Nobody pays attention to the pit road speed now. They add 5 mph and go with that and totally ignore the 'posted' speed limit. I imagine that 5 mph grace was from the days before they had precision tachs to set their speed off of.

Today, NASCAR and the track messed up. Listening to JJ, there clearly was an error in how that last line was laid out. He waited a full car length longer before hitting the gas the second time he got a penalty.
 
The Joey / Mark thing is exactly what Mark said it was. The bump and run has been accepted in nascar for a long, long time. Mark says he doesn't do it, but that's BS. I've seen him use it. Mark was slow and blocking and getting off the gas early to break Joey's rythum. Joey was fast and refused to let off the gas after a few laps of that nonsense. Pocono was a 1 groove track today, and that's how these things are decided.
 
Mopardh9 said:
How many laps were left when Joey tapped Mark, weren't there 6or 7 left? I honestly think Mark knew Joey had the faster car and Joey would of got him in the tunnel or going into 3. I think Joey is very impatient, I've seen the kid coming up around here at the local level and he did the same thing. And you would of been bitching if Joey hit Mark hard enough to put him in the wall. There is a difference between having balls and being smart enought to use them. Joey doesn't know that yet.
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Blah blah blah...

Joey won fair and square. He got the win and didn't wreck anyone to do it.
 
FenderBumper said:
NASCAR is unique because there are 43 cars sharing a crowded pit road. They need to be able to hit the gas coming in or out of the box to keep from running in to each other. I like that nascar makes the crews a bigger part of the competition, along with demanding a few more skills from the drivers.

I would like to see nascar institute a safe pit road speed and enforce that. Nobody pays attention to the pit road speed now. They add 5 mph and go with that and totally ignore the 'posted' speed limit. I imagine that 5 mph grace was from the days before they had precision tachs to set their speed off of.

Today, NASCAR and the track messed up. Listening to JJ, there clearly was an error in how that last line was laid out. He waited a full car length longer before hitting the gas the second time he got a penalty.
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And here's the problem I have with that. That "last line" was still somewhere on pit road. Which means he hit that gas before leaving pit road, which means he was speeding on pit road. It should be that black and white. Even if he waited a full car length after what he thought was the last line, he still wasn't to the actual exit of pit road. Period.
 
VaDirt said:
And here's the problem I have with that. That "last line" was still somewhere on pit road. Which means he hit that gas before leaving pit road, which means he was speeding on pit road. It should be that black and white. Even if he waited a full car length after what he thought was the last line, he still wasn't to the actual exit of pit road. Period.
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Errr.....lets wait and find out if nascar actually messed up and extended pit road beyond the last line, which is what JJ was saying. You can't pop out and yell "Surprise! You were speeding".
 
The way I understood it, NASCAR added another timing section -- from 9 last year to 10 with the repave. The teams were handed a map of the new lines and some didn't look closely enough. That's why NASCAR gave the teams another map during the race ---
 
FenderBumper said:
NASCAR is unique because there are 43 cars sharing a crowded pit road. They need to be able to hit the gas coming in or out of the box to keep from running in to each other. I like that nascar makes the crews a bigger part of the competition, along with demanding a few more skills from the drivers.

I would like to see nascar institute a safe pit road speed and enforce that. Nobody pays attention to the pit road speed now. They add 5 mph and go with that and totally ignore the 'posted' speed limit. I imagine that 5 mph grace was from the days before they had precision tachs to set their speed off of.

Today, NASCAR and the track messed up. Listening to JJ, there clearly was an error in how that last line was laid out. He waited a full car length longer before hitting the gas the second time he got a penalty.
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If he maitained the correct RPM setting all the way down pit road there would not have been a problem. it is a clear casse of trying to circumvent the rules to get an advantage.
 
TexasRaceLady said:
The way I understood it, NASCAR added another timing section -- from 9 last year to 10 with the repave. The teams were handed a map of the new lines and some didn't look closely enough. That's why NASCAR gave the teams another map during the race ---
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Yep and TNT backed right down when they found that out!
 
TexasRaceLady said:
The way I understood it, NASCAR added another timing section -- from 9 last year to 10 with the repave. The teams were handed a map of the new lines and some didn't look closely enough. That's why NASCAR gave the teams another map during the race ---
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I don't think that's the full story. I find it impossible to believe that Chad, the guy who invented timing line exploits, didn't check and know there was an extra loop. JJ explained it well, and it's what I had suspected. NASCAR measures speeds by the transponder on the roof of the car, which is hard for the drivers to judge off of. So nascar paints a line PAST where the loop is so the front bumper is at that line when the transponder is over the loop. This is the line the drivers judge off of. So, there are TWO lines for pit out. One we can't see, and one about 5 feet further down the road that we can see. If we believe what JJ said, Pocono reversed it and had the scoring loop AFTER the line out.
 
Mopardh9 said:
Yep and TNT backed right down when they found that out!
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TNT backed down because they don't have a clue. Those teams 'ran over and got maps' because the ones they were given weren't working. I for one DO NOT believe teams ignored the new maps nascar said they had handed out earlier. Somehow, the TNT crew thinks Chad and JJ just fell off a Turnip truck and hit their heads.
 
FenderBumper said:
I don't think that's the full story. I find it impossible to believe that Chad, the guy who invented timing line exploits, didn't check and know there was an extra loop. JJ explained it well, and it's what I had suspected. NASCAR measures speeds by the transponder on the roof of the car, which is hard for the drivers to judge off of. So nascar paints a line PAST where the loop is so the front bumper is at that line when the transponder is over the loop. This is the line the drivers judge off of. So, there are TWO lines for pit out. One we can't see, and one about 5 feet further down the road that we can see. If we believe what JJ said, Pocono reversed it and had the scoring loop AFTER the line out.
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Loops aside, if he maintained the right RPM all the way through he wouldn't of got penalized. All the teams try to cheat the system, some go a little to far in doing so.
 
Mopardh9 said:
Loops aside, if he maintained the right RPM all the way through he wouldn't of got penalized. All the teams try to cheat the system, some go a little to far in doing so.
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JJ says he WAS off of pit road BEFORE he sped up.

Please go to 1:25 and let JJ explain it to you.

Bottom line, it's nascars job to make sure pit road is market correctly. They messed up. It's as if they painted pit boxes too big, then panalized teams for pitting out of their box if they use the whole thing.
 
FenderBumper said:
JJ says he WAS off of pit road BEFORE he sped up.

Please go to 1:25 and let JJ explain it to you.

Bottom line, it's nascars job to make sure pit road is market correctly. They messed up. It's as if they painted pit boxes too big, then panalized teams for pitting out of their box if they use the whole thing.
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Correct me if I'm wrong , but I thought it was one of the middle segments on pit road where most of the teams were getting hit with penalties, not at the end of pit road?
 
As far as the brainiacs on TNT, they were saying that the drivers needed to go SLOWER on ENTRY. WTF? All the penalties and problems were at the exit, not the entrance. And it doesn't matter how many loops there were. That yellow line marks THE LAST LOOP.
 
Mopardh9 said:
Correct me if I'm wrong , but I thought it was one of the middle segments on pit road where most of the teams were getting hit with penalties, not at the end of pit road?
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It was the last loop, the one clearly marked by the yellow exit line.
 
TexasRaceLady said:
The way I understood it, NASCAR added another timing section -- from 9 last year to 10 with the repave. The teams were handed a map of the new lines and some didn't look closely enough. That's why NASCAR gave the teams another map during the race ---
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I just still don't get that. A map? Shouldn't the speed limit be from the entrance to the pit exit? And shouldn't that be kind of obvious without having to have a freaking map?
 
VaDirt said:
I just still don't get that. A map? Shouldn't the speed limit be from the entrance to the pit exit? And shouldn't that be kind of obvious without having to have a freaking map?
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You're standing in the middle of a Hurrican yelling shouldn't every day be sunny. What's the point? The rules are what they are. When your bumper goes over that last yellow line, the rules say you're OFF PIT ROAD.
 
FenderBumper said:
You're standing in the middle of a Hurrican yelling shouldn't every day be sunny. What's the point? The rules are what they are. When your bumper goes over that last yellow line, the rules say you're OFF PIT ROAD.
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Soo, we should all stop complaining about these kinds of things? Boy, is this gonna be a quiet forum.
 
FenderBumper said:
6.
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This is actually correct, in a way. I listened to Trackpass when I had it several years ago and the spotters and drivers refered to turn 1 as turns 1-2, turn 2 as 3-4 and turn 3 as 5-6. I think Dale Jarrett and Andy Petree mentioned this on an ESPN telecast as well.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
This is actually correct, in a way. I listened to Trackpass when I had it several years ago and the spotters and drivers refered to turn 1 as turns 1-2, turn 2 as 3-4 and turn 3 as 5-6.
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Yep. Those stupid signs are part of the fabricated 'tricky triangle' mystique.
 
They all go 360 degrees, to complete the circle, wherever they race.
 
Mopardh9 said:
How many laps were left when Joey tapped Mark, weren't there 6or 7 left? I honestly think Mark knew Joey had the faster car and Joey would of got him in the tunnel or going into 3. I think Joey is very impatient, I've seen the kid coming up around here at the local level and he did the same thing. And you would of been bitching if Joey hit Mark hard enough to put him in the wall. There is a difference between having balls and being smart enought to use them. Joey doesn't know that yet.
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But the other thing is, you've got to remember that Joey Logano is Mark Martin's discovery. Mark would've pulled over and let Joey win if it came down to it. I've always been a Mark Martin fan but that's how he is.
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
But the other thing is, you've got to remember that Joey Logano is Mark Martin's discovery. Mark would've pulled over and let Joey win if it came down to it. I've always been a Mark Martin fan but that's how he is.
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Are you high? Mark busted his ass trying to beat Joey, and said he was trying to get to his back bumper to return the favor.

I don't feel bad for Mark. I remember him wrecking a young driver out of the lead and on the verge of his first NW win.
 
FenderBumper said:
You're standing in the middle of a Hurrican yelling shouldn't every day be sunny. What's the point? The rules are what they are. When your bumper goes over that last yellow line, the rules say you're OFF PIT ROAD.
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Last year's pit road at Pocono featured nine timing zones throughout the length of pit road. This year, an additional section was added, and the now infamous "section 10" -- the 70 feet between the final pit stall and a thick, yellow line painted on the track -- was the common infraction location.

The pit road exit is marked. Regardless of maps, loops or whatever, there is no rule saying, "it's legal to speed between scoring loops". It's just a gray area since it hasn't been enforced and the teams think it's a rule. They broke the rules, they were caught. This isn't rocket science.
 
FenderBumper said:
Are you high? Mark busted his ass trying to beat Joey, and said he was trying to get to his back bumper to return the favor.

I don't feel bad for Mark. I remember him wrecking a young driver out of the lead and on the verge of his first NW win.
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You hold a nasty grudge. Bet you wouldn't have a problem with it if it WASN'T Keselowski. And that's the only time I've seen Mark Martin wreck a guy for the win (and he felt bad about it).
 
AndyMarquisLive said:
Last year's pit road at Pocono featured nine timing zones throughout the length of pit road. This year, an additional section was added, and the now infamous "section 10" -- the 70 feet between the final pit stall and a thick, yellow line painted on the track -- was the common infraction location.

The pit road exit is marked. Regardless of maps, loops or whatever, there is no rule saying, "it's legal to speed between scoring loops". It's just a gray area since it hasn't been enforced and the teams think it's a rule. They broke the rules, they were caught. This isn't rocket science.
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Apparently it is rocket science, because you don't understand it.
 
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