Hamlin and Busch Diqualified?

antman12

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Im not particularly a Denny fan (although I have far more respek for him now that hes a team owner), but at least he has a personality. Ill take Denny over the other 3/4 of the field who are just a bunch of boring robots who probably have their managers handle their socials and give the same ole boring interview time and time again. 😴😴😴

You hate it for your guys? wow I wouldve never guessed.
 

Magicmiler

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All things aside, I kinda envy his left hand side view with 2 Daytona winning cars in his house...
Screenshot_20220727-201209_Google.jpg
 

Formerjackman

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Its not what I need to know, its what you dont know. The Rules Committee had a reason why they wrote the penalties the way they are written and enforced and obviously they dont see it your way because you dont have their info. Unless you were on the Tech line at the track and at the tear down at the R&D building you dont know jack.
And they will make damn sure we don’t know jack, because they treat every situation like this as if it were a military secret. You want to make two totally different penalties for two very similar infractions, then tell us and SHOW us why. Nascar THRIVES on secrecy, vagary, circular logic and the ability to weasel their way around any situation. They LOVE having people in the dark so they can be as inconsistent as they want to be and do whatever strikes their mood that day. There is also WAY too many penalty levels, and possible punishments. Give me two days with a rule book and I could probably cut those in half.
 

Spotter22

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And they will make damn sure we don’t know jack, because they treat every situation like this as if it were a military secret. You want to make two totally different penalties for two very similar infractions, then tell us and SHOW us why. Nascar THRIVES on secrecy, vagary, circular logic and the ability to weasel their way around any situation. They LOVE having people in the dark so they can be as inconsistent as they want to be and do whatever strikes their mood that day. There is also WAY too many penalty levels, and possible punishments. Give me two days with a rule book and I could probably cut those in half.
Its NASCARS game and they write the rule book the way they see fit, if they dont like it they can go play in the ASA series.
 

Spotter22

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No harm in calling out the series and their inconsistency. It’s always been obvious, and it does hurt the sport.

I do think the application has improved over earlier years, but agree with @Formerjackman they should be explaining this application of penalties discrepancy to fans.
NASCAR issues press releases and Miller even goes live on radio and does news conferences and explains. Maybe we can get him to come on RF to explain it
 

Revman

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How about they just do that…explain it?
I agree.....and why is nothing said until an appeal is heard? Why? Tell us what the infraction is, and why NASCAR doesn't allow it.....and then how about streaming the appeals hearing itself? My God, they allow cameras into courtrooms now.
 

Daytripper

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I agree.....and why is nothing said until an appeal is heard? Why? Tell us what the infraction is, and why NASCAR doesn't allow it.....and then how about streaming the appeals hearing itself? My God, they allow cameras into courtrooms now.

Probably because they don't want anyone to know how much of a kangaroo court the hearings are. Nascar is not a democracy.
 

28car

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If I read right
The rule came out the week before Pocono

Cars are already wrapped

Can the wrap be pulled back (clear tape removed) and placed back?
 

Spotter22

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I agree.....and why is nothing said until an appeal is heard? Why? Tell us what the infraction is, and why NASCAR doesn't allow it.....and then how about streaming the appeals hearing itself? My God, they allow cameras into courtrooms now.
You guys are impossible. Reality is no matter what the sanctioning body does somebody's gonna complain or feel left out. I tell you how you can avoid these situations, stop getting caught cheating. This is akin to the criminal complaining to the judge he got caught.
 

9050lx

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I'm sorry, but drawing a distinction between infractions caught at the track and infractions caught at the R&D center is absurd and silly. I have been following this sport for more than forty years and can't explain the logic of it, imagine how it looks to the fans that don't obsess over every nut and bolt on the car the way many of us here do. NASCAR is it's own worst enemy with their inconsistent and often incoherent race control and enforcement of the rules. This stuff is not nearly as hard as they make it seem most of the time. The penalty for the 34 should have been EXACTLY the same as the 11 and 18, whether that is merely a Disqualification or that plus the money and point and suspension fines. Transparency and consistency would go a LONG way towards eliminating many of the knocks on this sport.
Thanks for being logical.
 

2 Sweet

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You guys are impossible. Reality is no matter what the sanctioning body does somebody's gonna complain or feel left out. I tell you how you can avoid these situations, stop getting caught cheating. This is akin to the criminal complaining to the judge he got caught.

When a criminal gets busted, the police usually show pictures of the drugs or guns or whatever contraband they seized. Just sayin.
 

Jorge De Guzman

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98% wouldnt know what the hell they were looking at. Jus sayin
Just reading through this thread. I will preface it by saying I dont care about penalties and what many seem to be in an uproar about.... all this kind of bores me. The Penalty and tech inspection aspect of the sport, does nothing for me. I would say though those who are interested in this kind of stuff cant have as much transparency as possible because and what I quoted up above I infer as "They dont know what they are looking at, because they're not involved with the sport... so piss on em they'll get whatever morsels of info we'll give them"...... if that's the case I think that's a shame. My question is why is transparency a bad thing, so much transparency that people cant question why x team got this kind of penalties compared to y team?
 

Spotter22

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Just reading through this thread. I will preface it by saying I dont care about penalties and what many seem to be in an uproar about.... all this kind of bores me. The Penalty and tech inspection aspect of the sport, does nothing for me. I would say though those who are interested in this kind of stuff cant have as much transparency as possible because and what I quoted up above I infer as "They dont know what they are looking at, because they're not involved with the sport... so piss on em they'll get whatever morsels of info we'll give them"...... if that's the case I think that's a shame. My question is why is transparency a bad thing, so much transparency that people cant question why x team got this kind of penalties compared to y team?
How transparent does NASCAR need to be? Most of these knuckleheads are conspiracy theorists that think NASCAR has a bias of some sort or covering things up. I dont think anything would please them.
 

Jorge De Guzman

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How transparent does NASCAR need to be? Most of these knuckleheads are conspiracy theorists that think NASCAR has a bias of some sort or covering things up. I dont think anything would please them.
I'm not sure about how transparent they need to go. Cant answer that. Could the sanctioning body explain their findings further so that there's not even a whiff of any funny business on their end. I dont even know the difference between the 34's penalties and JGR's, but thats mostly my fault because I stopped having interest in this story after Denny's tweet with the trophy and champagne as I'm just ready for the next race to start. I do agree with you on the conspiracy theorists lmao Racing-Forum's.com loves a good conspiracy.
 

Spotter22

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I'm not sure about how transparent they need to go. Cant answer that. Could the sanctioning body explain their findings further so that there's not even a whiff of any funny business on their end. I dont even know the difference between the 34's penalties and JGR's, but thats mostly my fault because I stopped having interest in this story after Denny's tweet with the trophy and champagne as I'm just ready for the next race to start. I do agree with you on the conspiracy theorists lmao Racing-Forum's.com loves a good conspiracy.
I'm with you my man. Bring on Indy. Oh and I dont think for some it matters what NASCAR would do, they are the bad guys. But thats ok, everybody needs one
 

StandOnIt

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I'm with you my man. Bring on Indy. Oh and I dont think for some it matters what NASCAR would do, they are the bad guys. But thats ok, everybody needs one
eh, it's pretty much one or two, the rest are impatient to know all of the details (me too). If Nascar told told the details today, do you think some of these fans would say Oh, ok thanks for the info lol? Nascar and Front Row are keeping it simple without the peanut gallery's involved. We've seen a number of these penalties changed after the appeals process, my hat in the ring thinks this one will be reduced also, but nobody needs a bunch of so called experts spouting off lies and half truths until the two parties involved get it settled between them.
 

Spotter22

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eh, it's pretty much one or two, the rest are impatient to know all of the details (me too). If Nascar told told the details today, do you think some of these fans would say Oh, ok thanks for the info lol? Nascar and Front Row are keeping it simple without the peanut gallery's involved. We've seen a number of these penalties changed after the appeals process, my hat in the ring thinks this one will be reduced also, but nobody needs a bunch of so called experts spouting off lies and half truths until the two parties involved get it settled between them.
I still think its to early on being lenient, they want these penalties to sting and the thing is ,theTeams asked them to do it.
 

StandOnIt

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I still think its to early on being lenient, they want these penalties to sting and the thing is ,theTeams asked them to do it.
Nascar doesn't pack their tribunals and final appeals with yes men. Most of them are X racers, race track owners etc. It's going to have to be pretty blatant for those charges to stand. But that is what makes it debatable.
 

Spotter22

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Nascar doesn't pack their tribunals and final appeals with yes men. Most of them are X racers, race track owners etc. It's going to have to be pretty blatant for those charges to stand. But that is what makes it debatable.
You are correct, they arent yes men and they know that "dont touch it" means dont touch it.
 

Revman

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You guys are impossible. Reality is no matter what the sanctioning body does somebody's gonna complain or feel left out. I tell you how you can avoid these situations, stop getting caught cheating. This is akin to the criminal complaining to the judge he got caught.
I think you are missing where I am coming from. All of this is part of my love for the sport. I think it is ****** cool that a couple of pieces of tape matter. I want to know more about that. When somebody is caught, let's talk about why because, again, it's cool. Why the silence before the appeal? Tell us what was done, and when the team tries to justify it, tell us why the justification doesn't matter, or why your mind was changed.

From the biased fan standpoint, I hate that MY teams broke a rule, but I appreciate how JGR and TRD responded. That is separate from the questions I was asking. I am not saying that NASCAR was wrong, but I want to know more about why they are right. NASCAR asks me to invest time and money into the series, and then tells me it is none of my business when something like this happens. I don't agree with that.....and frankly I may not matter, but if you get a few thousand who feel the same way, you are going to have a problem selling this sport I think.
 

Revman

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Nascar doesn't pack their tribunals and final appeals with yes men. Most of them are X racers, race track owners etc. It's going to have to be pretty blatant for those charges to stand. But that is what makes it debatable.
More mystery....Who in the actual **** is on this "tribunal," and how in the actual **** did they get there? Why is this a secret?
 

Charlie Spencer

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More mystery....Who in the actual **** is on this "tribunal," and how in the actual **** did they get there? Why is this a secret?
It's no secret. I can't find a current roster but this 2015 article will give you an idea of the kinds of experience usually on the National Motorsports Appeals Panel. Not all members are active on each appeal.

 

Charlie Spencer

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Spotter22

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Remember y’all, complaining about NASCAR is a no no. We have to be good fans and accept every single thing they do, while we smile and nod.
Remember yall, nobody said that. Voices in their heads maybe.
 
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