Discussion in 'NASCAR chat' started by FLRacingFan, Mar 19, 2018.
We cannot lose Dover
Annual revenue (last year) $46.7M
Annual profit (last year)$8.3M
Net profit margin17.74%
How much of that $46.7M was track operations vs. casino?
That's just for Dover Motorsports. $6.657M from admissions, $8.303M event-related, $31.775M broadcasting in 2017.
Total revenue from their six NASCAR events made up 96% of total revenue in 2017.
Sounds like we might get another road course or eldora in 2020 one can hope.
0%. The data is Dover Motorsports, which is the Nascar track. The hotel and casino is organized under the sister company, which is the entity being sold to the Rhode Island casino operator.
My point about questionable longevity is NOT that the Nascar races are non-viable. Clearly they are profitable, primarily due to TV money. But the parent holding company is gradually selling off all the operating units. The Nascar track is all that's left. Time will tell if that also gets shopped around.
(A Minor Correction: Dover Motorsports still has a shuttered race track near Nashville, been trying to sell it for years, the deals keep falling apart.)
Hmm midweek prime time, Nascar has a tough time filling half the seats at Kansas last week, what makes them think they'll draw more than 15k for a weekday race? Dumb idea.
In reality, if the fan age is getting younger then many dads are busy with the children in their own sports and not doing Nascar for entertainment.
Midweek would give some dads a chance to take in a night race.
40 years ago my dad was busy taking me to Ontario and Riverside on weekends
Excellent idea. How about the day after the MLB all star game? That is a date with no sports events anywhere.
You know this is actually probably NASCAR's biggest problem. The schedule has became so damn stale whereas F1 and Indy seem to always be changing, it doesn't drum up big support elsewhere. Look how big Kentucky was when it was added a few years back, that event was insane. Likewise I'm a season ticket holder at Michigan, but why not take one of those to Eldora or Mid Ohio as I'd be able to make any of those locations. You keep your blue blood tracks, but there are so many other places we could run and it would be a massive event each week
Then you have to work the next day, I don't see this being a good idea no matter how you look at it.
I agree. The proof is in the pudding with the Roval change.
Gateway would be a great addition to the schedule, and with that, Kansas should lose a race if you ask me. One of the most unique ovals in NASCAR.
Attendance would certainly take a hit, but TV viewership would likely increase by a significant margin if it was broadcasted on FOX/NBC. This could be the only sporting event nationally televised during primetime and casual or non-NASCAR fans would be more apt to tune into this race rather than plan a few hours over their weekend to watch it.
Worst case scenario is it gains some fans who end up viewing and especially attending races in the future. This would be a genius move for NASCAR long term.
Here, the arenas are going strong from morning to night on the weekends.
Many of the other sporting venues get used quite a bit. Soccer, baseball, gyms
and even karate classes all take up the weekends and drain the family budgets
for entertainment. My oldest granddaughter was $40. per week for Karate alone.
It isn't like your doing this every day, get real. You never stay up late when your working the next day? If they do this where the tracks are close to a city it may mean less people at the track
but it could also mean a bigger TV audience,
Hockey arenas ( newer ones) hold about 20,000 fans and the players are paid millions besides housing the team on the road for 40 games a year. The TV money is what makes most sports work.
Do you remember when NASCAR was on major networks?
The TV audience is shrinking. This isn’t sustainable long term.
I didn't think Hockey would survive the million dollar salaries but I was wrong.
What keeps open wheel (IRL, F1) going? The money sure isn't coming from the fans.
I think Nascar properly advertised for what it really is and run properly will do OK.
I agree this hyped version of door banging side by side promoting won't survive because they can't provide what they are advertising. The projected image is not what we see every week.
Maybe, I don't have all the answers but I also know that until they try it somewhere, NO ONE Knows.
I don’t watch hockey, IRL or F1.
The constant meddling in NASCAR is causing me and many other fans to lose interest.
TV ratings are their bread and butter and they’re slowly screwing that up.
Just saying...they have a tough time with attendance now, weekday will be tough I think, but who knows.
I agree and that is because the producers don't understand what a Nascar fan wants.
Of course many forum members are the same.
NASCAR doesn’t even understand what their fans want. How could producers know? NASCAR corporate can’t seem to get a grasp.
Worse case scenario is no one watches or attends.
Thompson has been running 2 150 lap modified races a year on a Wednesday night and will again in 2019. IIRC they ran a full schedule on Thursday nights too. I haven't checked lately but Stafford has run mid week schedules.
Waterford runs ''wacky Wednesdays'', Seekonk has ''fast Fridays''
I've gone to races mid week and I hope they continue
If they want to try this, let them try it, but I have yet to see ANY evidence that it will help in viewership OR attendance. With possible exception of Bristol, I have never seen any evidence of increased night race attendance over day race attendance at the same venue (I attribute some of that to the crappy spring weather at Bristol) and there is certainly no evidence that night races have better TV ratings, the opposite actually. The ONLY races that have ever showed increased nighttime TV numbers are Sunday races delayed into prime time. I did a fair bit of research into this a few years ago when everybody thought making the Brickyard a night race would cure it's ills. The numbers just don't support it. The people that attend NASCAR races differ quite a lot from attendees of other sports in that a far larger percentage come from long distance, and there is the camping element that other sports don't have. I will also point out that summertime TV ratings tend to be lower than fall and winter too. What time do you do you plan to start the race? Start too late and viewers will go to bed before it's over. Start too early, and a lot of people aren't even home yet and the West coast misses the first part of the race. As I said, I have zero objections to them trying it, I just don't see why anyone thinks it will succeed. I think consistency is important for good viewership too. I'm not sure too many casual fans will even be thinking to LOOK for a NASCAR race during the week, and you won't get ratings with only the hard core like us. That's why I have always railed against too many TV network involved in the schedule and why there should only be TWO Sunday start times. An east Coast start time, and a West Coast start time, and that is just a concession to reality. It would be far better if there was only ONE. One of the great things about the NFL is you know no matter what, at 1PM on Sunday, there will be a football game on.
That's fine and dandy for a local track, Thompson only runs a few weekday shows now, they aren't every week like they used to to be, car counts fell way off and so did attendance.
And yet despite those unconventional event schedules, none of those tracks have a Cup date or a national TV contract.
I've been waiting for the midweek experiment for years now. If Gateway gets Cup TV money for a year for one shot at it they're not going to care too much about the gate. And they've been very good about promoting their events recently and getting that place back up and running anyways.
Co-signing @LewTheShoe on running the day after the MLB All-Star Game. Absolute waste of a day sitting there for the taking.
I just believe the key to changes should be the emphasis on the day races are run. Midweek is not a good idea. Forces fans to take off too many days of vacation, so it cuts down on walkup ticket buys. I would suggest NASCAR makes Saturday the primary race day, with all events possible moving to night racing (or late afternoon starts that transition into darkness). Run the Xfinity races on Friday nights, and have the trucks run lots of unique tracks on their own schedule.
Saturday’s means a rainout gives fans the chance to still see the race on Sunday. It doesn’t compete with the NFL. Yes competes with college football but those fans won’t typically pick racing over their team. I also want to see more tracks and fewer double dates, except for the classic vital tracks (Charlotte, Daytona which should do a royal in July, Talladega and the short tracks). Have Xfinity run races on the big tracks to replace the old date taken away. Also, NO Momster Series drivers in Xfinity. Leave it to their own drivers to race and compete.
I think midweek racing would hurt attendance for the reasons mentioned. I also think later starts have hurt attendance too,
I hear they are bringing in a non-alcoholic to run things.
How the heck does a race track survive having one race a year.??????
They occupy the rest of the season with non NASCAR races and events.
Shootout at Daytona
1. Feb 21st, 2021 (Sunday) - Daytona (Cup) | Daytona (NXS) | Daytona (Trucks)
2. Feb 28th, 2021 (Sunday) - Atlanta (Cup) | Atlanta (NXS) | Atlanta (Trucks)
3. March 7th, 2021 (Sunday) - Las Vegas (Cup) | Las Vegas (NXS) | LVMS Bullring (Trucks)
4. March 14th, 2021 (Sunday) - ISM Raceway (Cup) | ISM Raceway (IndyCar)
5. March 21st, 2021 (Sunday) - Auto Club (Cup) | Auto Club (NXS)
6. March 28th, 2021 (Sunday) - Gateway (Cup) | Gateway (NXS) - moved Martinsville to Summer
OFF - Easter - NXS (Nashville) | Trucks (Nashville)
7. April 11th, 2021 (Sunday) - Bristol (Cup) | Bristol (NXS) |
8. April 18th, 2021 (Sunday) - Richmond (Cup) | Richmond (NXS) - Richmond Spring moved to daytime
9. April 25th, 2021 (Sunday) - Mosport/Canadian Tire (Cup) | Mosport (Trucks) - NASCAR adds another road course, to rotate venues as contract allows
10. May 2nd, 2021 (Sunday) - Talladega (Cup) | Talladega (NXS) |
11. May 8th, 2021 (Saturday) - Dover 300 Combo Race (Cup) | Dover 200 Combo Race (NXS) - Dover moves to 2 consecutive 300 lap & 200 lap races.
12. May 9th, 2021 (Sunday) - Dover 300 Combo Race (Cup) | Dover 200 Combo Race (NXS) - Dover moves to 2 consecutive 300 lap & 200 lap races.
13. May 15th, 2021 (Saturday) - Martinsville Night (Cup) | | Rockingham (NXS) | Martinsville (Trucks) - NXS returns to The Rock, Martinsville moved
May 22nd, 2021 (Saturday) - All-Star Race (rotated among SMI venues)
14. May 30th, 2021 (Saturday) - Coke 600 (Cup) | Charlotte (NXS) | Charlotte (Trucks)
15. June 6th, 2021 (Sunday) - Michigan 500 (Cup) | Michigan (NXS) | Michigan (Trucks)
16 - June 13th, 2021 (Sunday) - Sonoma 350 (Cup) | Iowa (NXS) | Iowa 200 (Trucks)
17 - June 20th, 2021 (Sunday) - Chicagoland (Cup) | Chicagoland (NXS) | Chicagoland (Trucks)
18 - June 26th, 2021 (Saturday) - Kentucky (Cup) | Kentucky (NXS)
19 - July 3rd, 2021 (Saturday) - Daytona (Cup) | Daytona (NXS) | Gateway (Trucks) - Gateway Truck race moved to later in year
20 - July 14th, 2021 (Wednesday) - Eldora (Cup) | | Mid-Ohio (NXS - Saturday) | Eldora (Trucks) - Eldora Dirt Derby
21 - July 18th, 2021 (Sunday) - New Hampshire (Cup) | New Hampshire (NXS)
22 - July 25th, 2021 (Sunday) - Pocono (Cup) | Iowa (NXS) | Pocono (Trucks)
23 - August 1st, 2021 (Sunday) - Watkins Glen (Cup) | Watkins Glen (NXS) | Rockingham (Trucks)
24 - August 7th, 2021 (Saturday) - Bristol (Cup) | Bristol (NXS), Bristol (Trucks)
25 - August 15th, 2021 (Sunday) - Indianapolis (Cup), IRP (NXS) | IRP (Trucks) - IRP added to schedule
26 - August 21st, 2021 (Saturday) - Richmond (Cup), Richmond (NXS) | Richmond (Trucks)
27 - August 28th, 2021 (Saturday) - Charlotte Roval (Cup), Charlotte Roval (NXS) - Roval moves to night.
28 - September 5th, 2021 (Sunday) - Darlington (Cup) | Darlington (NXS) | Las Vegas (Trucks)
29 - September 12th, 2021 (Sunday) - Talladega (Cup), Road America (NXS) | Talladega (Trucks) - Road America pushed back a couple weeks
30 - September 19th, 2021 (Sunday) - Kansas (Cup) | Kansas (Xfinity) | Trucks (Dover)
31 - September 26th, 2021 (Sunday) - Martinsville (Cup) | Martinsville (Trucks)
32 - October 3rd, 2021 (Sunday) - Texas (Cup) | Texas (NXS) | Texas (Trucks)
33 - October 10th, 2021 (Sunday) - ISM Raceway (Cup) | ISM Raceway (NXS) | ISM Raceway (Trucks)
34 - October 17th, 2021 (Sunday) - Miami (Cup) | Miami (NXS) | Miami (Trucks)
Cup - 34 races, top 12 in points after 24 races to race in final 10 playoffs (charter system eliminated, 40 cars)
Xfinity (7 standalone races) - 31 races, top 8 in points after 21 races to race in final 10 playoffs (38 cars).
Trucks (7 standalone races) - 24 races, top 8 in points after 14 raes to race for final 10 playoffs (32 trucks).
- Texas, Kansas, Michigan, Phoenix (NXS), Pocono (NXS), IMS (NXS), Las Vegas, Pocono, Kentucky (NXS) among other lose races in place of Mosport, Gateway, Eldora, Rockingham, IRP, Nashville Fairgrounds.
- Competition Caution after halfway through race (some races shortened on schedule, stage racing continues more as a bonus point system than stages)
- 1st Place: 50 Points
- 2nd Place-40th Place: 39-1.
- Halfway Stage Points: 5-1 (1st-5th place)
- Most Laps Led: 5
- Max. Points Available: 60
- Points reset for all series: 5 points for victory, 15 points for regular season title, 10 points for 2nd place in regular season, 5 points for 3rd place in regular season, everybody else 0.
Someone's got a lot of spare time & quite the imagination.
I had the time on a overnight shift with it being a slow time period for an hour, lol. Don't see why NASCAR shouldn't end in mid-October though. 8 months of racing has to be cheaper than a full 9 currently. I would say that schedule is more realistic than overhauling the whole thing.
IRP, Memphis, Gateway, Nashville Fairgrounds, Eldora have all indicated moving up from their current NASCAR state along with Rockingham trying to comeback as a concert/outdoor venue which might actually be a good deal for racing again. Along with maybe an Australian exhibition.
At least in 2018 those tracks appear to change things up.
I’d be down for a midweek summer time race hopefully the day after the MLB All Star Race and if it’s close by....Gateway as rumored.....I’d even attempt to attend it. The schedule as is never bothered me, I think the tracks themselves (one groove 1.5 milers like Texas as opposed to two) tire compound and aero package are more of a problem. It’s pretty interesting to me that when NASCAR was at its zenith a peep was made of the schedule and they had been having races at some of those tracks for 20 plus years, seems to me they are running out of things to change.
Seriously? I'll bet it would take less than a day to get two pages here on "What (Stupid) Change Will NASCAR Implement Next?"
Separate names with a comma.