Not making friends

dpkimmel2001 said:
I kinda liked it better when drivers didn't have to worry about making friends on the track. I loved Mark Martin but I sure don't want to see 40 of him on the track week in and week out.
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I don't recall anytime a driver had to have any friends on the track as it was more having respect in the garage.
 
Topaz said:
Kurt, shouldn't even be running his mouth off. He's in a completely different league for bone heads. Do any of you remember why he got fired from roush racing? Because he crashed people every week. He was a hot head, the call came all the way from the top to can his butt. Ford told roush to let him go. Then he got to PR and proceeded to do even more dumb stuff and got fired again. Over the last few years he's really cleaned up his act, but he still crashes other guys in tough racing deals and people still get ticked off at him. It's called racing guys. They are all racing for the win, sometimes things don't go your way. But the drivers now today are so quick to grab a microphone and make an ass of themselves. Just leave it at it's a racing deal and move on. NASCAR is full of whinny babies and fans. Let them start targeting each other and tearing up equipment every week. They won't be in that car long, NASCAR will park them, the sponsors won't deal with it and you'll see someone get fired. Who knows in two weeks from now the 22 may push 41 to a win. Then it will be water under the bridge. Some of you guys make ant hill into a mountain. It's just Racing. Get over it. Thank you may now all return to your bitching.
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Your recollection of what happened to Kurt in the 97 car at Roush varies greatly from mine. As far as I can remember Kurt signed a contract to join Penske in 2007 back in 2005 and asked for his release from Roush for the 2006 year. Kurt fired Jack not the other way around.
 
There was several interviews done at the time, that he was fired. The call came from the Ford family. Something to do with his ethical terms in his contract. Kurt had himself in some hot water with a lot of people. So who knows, we will probably not get the full truth from either side. If I remember correctly he didn't even get finish the year out in the 97 car I think.
 
We are both right, he already signed with Penske, but was fired and did not finish out the season in the 97 due to criminal reckless driving.
 
Winners piss people off. That is all this is about. Period. What amazes me more than anything Kez and Joey have done is the engineering work of Penske. Just freakin' awesome. Terrible in the 500, and they go to work, and bring the class of the field in the 400. TRD Toyotas were still very good--didn't regress--but Penske found something because they went to work. If you want an example of a race I truly enjoyed without one of my TRD Toyotas winning, it was that one. This is what I love about this sport. Best team and driver on that given night executed, and the best car won. Great stuff.
 
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ToyYoda said:
Brad K is more of a Butt-Head clone. If they ever wanted to make a live action Beavis and Butt-Head movie, they found their two guys.
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Revman said:
Winners piss people off. That is all this is about. Period. What amazes me more than anything Kez and Joey have done is the engineering work of Penske. Just freakin' awesome. Terrible in the 500, and they go to work, and bring the class of the field in the 400. TRD Toyotas were still very good--didn't regress--but Penske found something because they went to work. If you want an example of a race I truly enjoyed without one of my TRD Toyotas winning, it was that one. This is what I love about this sport. Best team and driver on that given night executed, and the best car won. Great stuff.[/

There is so much that is unseen in Nascar that goes into making a winning car it staggers the mind. Everything from prepping the car to getting it set up for a good qualifying run/grid position/pit stall to communication to the decisions a driver makes. When I factor all that in it is hard to dislike a winning team.
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Michfan said:
It's Funny reading this thread. Obviously jlo fans have learned nothing from last year. Still beating their chests screaming at anyone who will listen that this isn't a popularity contest. No sh!t, but you also can't just be a huge ass and have all of the other drivers hate you and expect to win championships.
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I beg to differ. Dale Earnhardt drove to win or better his position in every race. Didn't see anyone trying the bull**** that Gordon/Kenseth pulled.
All Joey has to do is go out and make them understand that it's tit for tat.
Quit whining and start driving.
 
Skoalbandit33 said:
Guys like Ricky Rudd, Geoff Bodine, Harry Gant, Terry Labonte, Tim Richmond, Mark Martin, Dave Marcis, Bill Elliott, Morgan Shepherd, Kenny Schrader and Alan Kulwicki seemed to have a much different outlook and frame of mind compared to today's group.
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All those guys raced against Earnhardt and knew better than to be whinny. They also knew he would be the first to help anyone.
 
What a joke, can't find anything truthful to say against a driver so he becomes ugly. LOL
Amazes me how ignorant some people can be.

I think Brad looked downright handsome standing on the podium **** faced from beer and holding
his championship cup. There are a few drivers that wished they were that ugly. :D
 
Team Penske said:
If you know anything about Daytona, you would understand that the moment Kurt moved up, drag slowed his car just enough that the gap was filled by Joeys car and that is why Kurt got spun out. The mistake was all Kurt's.
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Pete, I am 100% in favor of drivers who race hard for every position in every race. Logano is one of them, and I love that he refuses to bow down before the entitled whiny aging veterans who like to talk about "driver code" to explain their losses. Joey has a long and very bright future. I wish more drivers were willing to ruffle veterans' feathers to go for the win.

I also think it is laudable for a driver to admit it when he makes a mistake. Logano was on Race Hub yesterday, and he directly contradicted your analysis of lap 161 at Daytona. Joey said when Kurt moved high, Joey steered low to attempt a pass, but as he turned left, he lost the back end (got loose). As he corrected to the right to catch the slide, he steered into Kurt's quarter panel and wrecked the 41. He caused the wreck, and he apologized for it. He was there. You and I were watching on TV. I'll believe Joey.
 
Team Penske said:
What a joke, can't find anything truthful to say against a driver so he becomes ugly. LOL
Amazes me how ignorant some people can be.

I think Brad looked downright handsome standing on the podium sh!t faced from beer and holding
his championship cup. There are a few drivers that wished they were that ugly. :D
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Yep. Very well stated.
 
Always amazes me how much fans make of this stuff and how little drivers make of it . These guys attend church together , drivers meetings together ,live side by side in the motorhome lot , fly home together , hunt and fish together ,their wives are friends with each other , their kids play together , their crews are friends with each other . Sure you will find weekly disputes , but believe it or not , these guys have short memories and for the most part , they get along real well .
 
LewTheShoe said:
Pete, I am 100% in favor of drivers who race hard for every position in every race. Logano is one of them, and I love that he refuses to bow down before the entitled whiny aging veterans who like to talk about "driver code" to explain their losses. Joey has a long and very bright future. I wish more drivers were willing to ruffle veterans' feathers to go for the win.

I also think it is laudable for a driver to admit it when he makes a mistake. Logano was on Race Hub yesterday, and he directly contradicted your analysis of lap 161 at Daytona. Joey said when Kurt moved high, Joey steered low to attempt a pass, but as he turned left, he lost the back end (got loose). As he corrected to the right to catch the slide, he steered into Kurt's quarter panel and wrecked the 41. He caused the wreck, and he apologized for it. He was there. You and I were watching on TV. I'll believe Joey.
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Thanks for the replay. Unfortunately here in Canada I can't get any of those extra shows so I miss out on this type of information. My point that Joey in no way intentionally wrecked Kurt because of aggressive driving still stands. His move was legit, losing grip was unexpected. No different than Tony's trip to the wall except Tony didn't collect anyone.
So why is Joey such a great villain? Because he was born with a different face? Rich daddy?
Or people are just plain jealous of anyone who is successful?
 
Every racer blocks. The manner jlo was throwing blocks in the xfinity race was nothing more than reckless and a miracle he didn't cause a big one.
 
ted@economy said:
Always amazes me how much fans make of this stuff and how little drivers make of it . These guys attend church together , drivers meetings together ,live side by side in the motorhome lot , fly home together , hunt and fish together ,their wives are friends with each other , their kids play together , their crews are friends with each other . Sure you will find weekly disputes , but believe it or not , these guys have short memories and for the most part , they get along real well .
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For the most part that is true but for some reason Joey and Brad are not part of the clique. Anytime someone has an issue and they are even close its their fault. Martin Teuex was the greatest example. He lost it and because Joey was behind Truex and his CC start a campaign they were wrecked by JL even when there was evidence he never touches the car. And then no apology for the accusation. It's 7th grade school girl stuff.
 
Everything goes around . How great was it to see Clint in the booth rubbing elbows with best buds Gordon and Mikey.
 
The point I've been trying to make all along, he doesn't give a shiit if he wrecks you if he advances a single position. He raced that way on local tracks and if not local cops intervening he and his 'tough guy old man' would have been greasy spots on the ground
 
Loganno is nascar's latest punching bag. No matter what he does he will get spat on. I'm the same way with him as I am with Brad. Go for the win, or at least the pass.
 
ted@economy said:
Always amazes me how much fans make of this stuff and how little drivers make of it . These guys attend church together , drivers meetings together ,live side by side in the motorhome lot , fly home together , hunt and fish together ,their wives are friends with each other , their kids play together , their crews are friends with each other . Sure you will find weekly disputes , but believe it or not , these guys have short memories and for the most part , they get along real well .
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NM
 
I'm not a Logano fan but I think he gets a lot of undeserved flak. Until he earns the respect of other drivers, fair or not, I don't think that's gonna change. I'm just surprised there are so many fans that dislike him.

I don't like Brad at all, but he's a really good driver and his attitude/mouth is great for the sport, like him or not.
 
ted@economy said:
Always amazes me how much fans make of this stuff and how little drivers make of it . These guys attend church together , drivers meetings together ,live side by side in the motorhome lot , fly home together , hunt and fish together ,their wives are friends with each other , their kids play together , their crews are friends with each other . Sure you will find weekly disputes , but believe it or not , these guys have short memories and for the most part , they get along real well .
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With all due respect Ted, this isn't true at all. While they're all "hospitable" with one another, very few of them (drivers) socialize. I think there was one thread where I even listed all the driver "friendships." I can probably count them on one hand. The best I can say is that they "coexist." You won't see fights in the lots, dirty looks, or rubbing into each other as they walk past, etc etc. But I've been to more driver signings where the two drivers sitting next to each other didn't even exchange more than 5 words to each other than times when the two drivers actually chat it up. Joey, Kurt & Kenseth could easily get on stage together tomorrow and give a really fun Q&A. But don't confuse that with a short memory. Kurt and Kenseth legitimately dislike Joey. A lot. NONE of these guys have a short memory. They will all be able to tell you the exact lap of the exact race where they took exception with another driver, and do so dating back 15 years.

And people need to stop with the "drivers don't like Joey because he's a threat." Come on. There are about a dozen or so "threats" people respect out there. Jimmie is a 6 time champion. Kurt, Kyle, Denny, Matt, Kevin, MTJ, Jr, Carl, Smoke, Larson, Newman, Jamie, even Brad. Etc etc. There are plenty of guys who win consistently who are just as much of a "threat" week in and week out as Joey that the drivers all respect. I PROOOOOOOOMISE you...none of them feel "threatened." The drivers dislike Joey because he doesn't yet possess the skills to drive as aggressively as he does, or the resume to be as much of a reckless asshat as he is out there. He's got more excuses than most politicians.

Having said that, his aggressive/reckless driving style is great for the sport and great for the fans (I wish more people drove like him). It's just bad for Joey.
 
Allenbaba said:
With all due respect Ted, this isn't true at all. While they're all "hospitable" with one another, very few of them (drivers) socialize. I think there was one thread where I even listed all the driver "friendships." I can probably count them on one hand. The best I can say is that they "coexist." You won't see fights in the lots, dirty looks, or rubbing into each other as they walk past, etc etc. But I've been to more driver signings where the two drivers sitting next to each other didn't even exchange more than 5 words to each other than times when the two drivers actually chat it up. Joey, Kurt & Kenseth could easily get on stage together tomorrow and give a really fun Q&A. But don't confuse that with a short memory. Kurt and Kenseth legitimately dislike Joey. A lot. NONE of these guys have a short memory. They will all be able to tell you the exact lap of the exact race where they took exception with another driver, and do so dating back 15 years.

And people need to stop with the "drivers don't like Joey because he's a threat." Come on. There are about a dozen or so "threats" people respect out there. Jimmie is a 6 time champion. Kurt, Kyle, Denny, Matt, Kevin, MTJ, Jr, Carl, Smoke, Larson, Newman, Jamie, even Brad. Etc etc. There are plenty of guys who win consistently who are just as much of a "threat" week in and week out as Joey that the drivers all respect. I PROOOOOOOOMISE you...none of them feel "threatened." The drivers dislike Joey because he doesn't yet possess the skills to drive as aggressively as he does, or the resume to be as much of a reckless asshat as he is out there. He's got more excuses than most politicians.

Having said that, his aggressive/reckless driving style is great for the sport and great for the fans (I wish more people drove like him). It's just bad for Joey.
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YOu need to post more. thanks for sharing
 
Allenbaba said:
With all due respect Ted, this isn't true at all. While they're all "hospitable" with one another, very few of them (drivers) socialize. I think there was one thread where I even listed all the driver "friendships." I can probably count them on one hand. The best I can say is that they "coexist." You won't see fights in the lots, dirty looks, or rubbing into each other as they walk past, etc etc. But I've been to more driver signings where the two drivers sitting next to each other didn't even exchange more than 5 words to each other than times when the two drivers actually chat it up. Joey, Kurt & Kenseth could easily get on stage together tomorrow and give a really fun Q&A. But don't confuse that with a short memory. Kurt and Kenseth legitimately dislike Joey. A lot. NONE of these guys have a short memory. They will all be able to tell you the exact lap of the exact race where they took exception with another driver, and do so dating back 15 years.

And people need to stop with the "drivers don't like Joey because he's a threat." Come on. There are about a dozen or so "threats" people respect out there. Jimmie is a 6 time champion. Kurt, Kyle, Denny, Matt, Kevin, MTJ, Jr, Carl, Smoke, Larson, Newman, Jamie, even Brad. Etc etc. There are plenty of guys who win consistently who are just as much of a "threat" week in and week out as Joey that the drivers all respect. I PROOOOOOOOMISE you...none of them feel "threatened." The drivers dislike Joey because he doesn't yet possess the skills to drive as aggressively as he does, or the resume to be as much of a reckless asshat as he is out there. He's got more excuses than most politicians.

Having said that, his aggressive/reckless driving style is great for the sport and great for the fans (I wish more people drove like him). It's just bad for Joey.
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Point taken Allen . I do tend to run off half ****ed . Just meant to say that the drivers are more able to handle themselves off track than some fans . They are often thrown together like Clint in the booth , or Joey & Matt at a media event and have to bite their tongues .
 
Allenbaba said:
With all due respect Ted, this isn't true at all. While they're all "hospitable" with one another, very few of them (drivers) socialize. I think there was one thread where I even listed all the driver "friendships." I can probably count them on one hand. The best I can say is that they "coexist." You won't see fights in the lots, dirty looks, or rubbing into each other as they walk past, etc etc. But I've been to more driver signings where the two drivers sitting next to each other didn't even exchange more than 5 words to each other than times when the two drivers actually chat it up. Joey, Kurt & Kenseth could easily get on stage together tomorrow and give a really fun Q&A. But don't confuse that with a short memory. Kurt and Kenseth legitimately dislike Joey. A lot. NONE of these guys have a short memory. They will all be able to tell you the exact lap of the exact race where they took exception with another driver, and do so dating back 15 years.

And people need to stop with the "drivers don't like Joey because he's a threat." Come on. There are about a dozen or so "threats" people respect out there. Jimmie is a 6 time champion. Kurt, Kyle, Denny, Matt, Kevin, MTJ, Jr, Carl, Smoke, Larson, Newman, Jamie, even Brad. Etc etc. There are plenty of guys who win consistently who are just as much of a "threat" week in and week out as Joey that the drivers all respect. I PROOOOOOOOMISE you...none of them feel "threatened." The drivers dislike Joey because he doesn't yet possess the skills to drive as aggressively as he does, or the resume to be as much of a reckless asshat as he is out there. He's got more excuses than most politicians.

Having said that, his aggressive/reckless driving style is great for the sport and great for the fans (I wish more people drove like him). It's just bad for Joey.
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Lol. I've heard it all, or so I thought. At first when he came to the sport it was because he came with all the hype and his Dad had money (The typical bully clique-Hamlin, Harvick, Ky Busch), Then it was because he whines when guys wrecked him and his Dad fought his battles (Hamlin), then it was he races too hard when he didn't have to (Kenseth), then it was because he didn't apologise for trying win a race he didn't need to win (Kenseth), then he got too close. (Truex), then he's too aggressive on last lap running 5th (Ku Busch), now this? Who says that? Surely you aren't a mind reader?
As for a resume, it's as good or better than 90% out there including Hamlin and Edwards.
 
Ford 222 said:
Lol. I've heard it all, or so I thought. At first when he came to the sport it was because he came with all the hype and his Dad had money (The typical bully clique-Hamlin, Harvick, Ky Busch), Then it was because he whines when guys wrecked him and his Dad fought his battles (Hamlin), then it was he races too hard when he didn't have to (Kenseth), then it was because he didn't apologise for trying win a race he didn't need to win (Kenseth), then he got too close. (Truex), then he's too aggressive on last lap running 5th (Ku Busch), now this? Who says that? Surely you aren't a mind reader?
As for a resume, it's as good or better than 90% out there including Hamlin and Edwards.
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That pretty well sums it all up, just one excuse after another to not like a guy.
When it comes to racing I would like to see them clone another 10 Joey's to make it interesting.
 
Ford 222 said:
Lol. I've heard it all, or so I thought. At first when he came to the sport it was because he came with all the hype and his Dad had money (The typical bully clique-Hamlin, Harvick, Ky Busch), Then it was because he whines when guys wrecked him and his Dad fought his battles (Hamlin), then it was he races too hard when he didn't have to (Kenseth), then it was because he didn't apologise for trying win a race he didn't need to win (Kenseth), then he got too close. (Truex), then he's too aggressive on last lap running 5th (Ku Busch), now this? Who says that? Surely you aren't a mind reader?
As for a resume, it's as good or better than 90% out there including Hamlin and Edwards.
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Lets pump the brakes like Joey should have done at Kansas. The past two seasons he has stepped his game up considerably and it has been fun to watch, seriously. I don't have a problem with the way he drives or the reasons he drives that way because as a fan it puts on a hell of show but I could see why his competitors do no agree - there is a common denominator in all of the incidents you mentioned. His resume is built on his on-track performance the past two seasons and I hope for his sake it is a sign of things to come.
 
None of the Busch brothers have room to complain about driving styles. They should remember that they were once the evil ones, just like Gordon and even JJ were evil for their wrecking. Brad and Joey at least keep trying to advance instead of just sitting back. I've seen some the whiners like Hamlin make some risky moves that could have wiped out the people behind him also. It's the last lap, you don't let up. That is why there wrecks behind the leader that take out many cars. All are trying to advance another spot. If Hamlin would have done the same thing nobody would have said a word. I think there is one standard for Penske and another for the whiners.
 
oldgoat said:
None of the Busch brothers have room to complain about driving styles. They should remember that they were once the evil ones, just like Gordon and even JJ were evil for their wrecking. Brad and Joey at least keep trying to advance instead of just sitting back. I've seen some the whiners like Hamlin make some risky moves that could have wiped out the people behind him also. It's the last lap, you don't let up. That is why there wrecks behind the leader that take out many cars. All are trying to advance another spot. If Hamlin would have done the same thing nobody would have said a word. I think there is one standard for Penske and another for the whiners.
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All true...
 
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