Rate The Championship Format

TexasRaceLady said:
To be perfectly honest, and I mean it, how the champion is determined or who winds up as champion really does NOT matter
to me.
I like to watch the racing.
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^^^ this^^^

Us old-timers go back to when, as I recall, how a season championship was determined wasn't much of a concern to most race fans.

Before the Latford system began being used in the mid-70's there were some pretty screwing scoring systems that, when determining how many points were awarded for each race, took into account things such as the length of the race and the amount of the purse.

NASCAR POINT SYSTEMS

For the average race fan it was all about the racing.
 
jaqua19 said:
Honestly, 3.5/10. If they make it a final 3 races instead 1, I'd bump it to a 6/10.

Full season format: Was once an 8.5/10 for me. Now, about a 6.5/10 after seeing the Chase. Sorry. Season long formats don't do it for me. I find it boring. Dull, and it doesn't reward, or promote high level performance.

Original Chase format: 11/10. This is THE defining system for a champion as far as I'm concerned. It could always be tweaked, but I love it. It still rewarded regular season consistency. Carl Edwards outscored and out performed Stewart in the 05 Chase, but Stewart's starting point lead due to the "regular season" title allowed him to win the title.

It does, to a degree, reward regular season consistency. The Chase rewards 3 months of consistency that's been slightly influenced by regular season performance with absolute minimal margin for error. The result was needing consistency, full season execution packed into 3 weeks, and a 3 month stretch of performance near 90s Gordon level to win.

Screw the playoffs.

Screw the regular season format.

Chase champions are the highest, most difficult championships that define a cup champion we've ever seen. I'll take that to the grave.
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If they tied and Stewart won the tie breaker, how is it that Edwards out performed Stewart? And no, Edwards didn't out perform Edwards in the chase
 
pjmolo said:
^^^ this^^^

Us old-timers go back to when, as I recall, how a season championship was determined wasn't much of a concern to most race fans.

Before the Latford system began being used in the mid-70's there were some pretty screwing scoring systems that, when determining how many points were awarded for each race, took into account things such as the length of the race and the amount of the purse.

NASCAR POINT SYSTEMS

For the average race fan it was all about the racing.
Click to expand...
and still is for some of us.
 
I’ll say IMO the regular season points system…every race was a playoff race. I didn’t have a problem with someone like 98 Gordon obliterating the field or someone like 03 Kenseth top 10ing them to death. If the championship was locked up before the last race of the season? Boo Hoo, the best team won the championship at that time and maybe your favorite driver/team combo should have been better. I also found the other points position battles pretty enthralling. Now I have no idea who has a chance to finish 5th in points today. I remember a time where finishing top 10 in Winston Cup points was a pretty big deal. But alas it’s not the 90’s anymore. Comeon Larson finish this deal today.
 
Snappy D said:
I’ll say IMO the regular season points system…every race was a playoff race. I didn’t have a problem with someone like 98 Gordon obliterating the field or someone like 03 Kenseth top 10ing them to death. If the championship was locked up before the last race of the season? Boo Hoo, the best team won the championship at that time and maybe your favorite driver/team combo should have been better. I also found the other points position battles pretty enthralling. Now I have no idea who has a chance to finish 5th in points today. I remember a time where finishing top 10 in Winston Cup points was a pretty big deal. But alas it’s not the 90’s anymore. Comeon Larson finish this deal today.
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That's because there are around 4 maybe 5 that are racing for that spot this race...I know ya hate the chase
 
StandOnIt said:
That's because there are around 4 maybe 5 that are racing for that spot this race...I know ya hate the chase
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I actually personally prefer the OG Chase format to this current system if we have to have a “NASCAR Post Season”. Top 10 in points get in re rack them let’s go. 10 races 3 months to decide it all
 
StandOnIt said:
If they tied and Stewart won the tie breaker, how is it that Edwards out performed Stewart? And no, Edwards didn't out perform Edwards in the chase
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They didn't tie lol

Stewart won and Carl and Biffle tied for second.

I said 2005, not 2011.

I did just double check that year. Edwards finished the championship 35 points behind Stewart, and at the beginning of the Chase he started 40 back.

Okay, just double checked. He started 35 back again. So Carl and Tony scored the exact same number of points in 2005. Carl had two wins to Stewart's zero. But my point is, Carl scored just as many points as Stewart in that Chase, and won 2 races to Tony's zero. Carl was just never a factor, due to Stewart being seeded first thanks to the "regular season" title.
 
jaqua19 said:
They didn't tie lol

Stewart won and Carl and Biffle tied for second.

I said 2005, not 2011.

I did just double check that year. Edwards finished the championship 35 points behind Stewart, and at the beginning of the Chase he started 40 back.

Okay, just double checked. He started 35 back again. So Carl and Tony scored the exact same number of points in 2005. Carl had two wins to Stewart's zero. But my point is, Carl scored just as many points as Stewart in that Chase, and won 2 races to Tony's zero. Carl was just never a factor, due to Stewart being seeded first thanks to the "regular season" title.
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yeah I was thinking 2011 my bad
 
And another thought --- I remember when the champion was determined well before the end of the season.
Then why bother running those last couple of races if nothing changed but a maybe a few lower placements. No
reason to get excited about the last race --- why bother watching or attending.
Talk about anti-climax. The only real "7th game" excitement I remember, was when Kulwicki won the Cup. It was in doubt until
the checkers waved.
It really boils down to 2 things. Either you watch, or you don't.
It's kind of like the weather --- you can moan and groan and complain, but when it comes down to it, you can't change it.
 
TexasRaceLady said:
But how do you determine the "best"? By number of wins or consistent performance in high finishes?
If I were a team owner, I'd want someone who was a consistently high finisher.
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Take last year, Cup. Kevin won more races, led more laps and had a better average finish. And lost.
There’s something wrong with that.
 
TexasRaceLady said:
And another thought --- I remember when the champion was determined well before the end of the season.
Then why bother running those last couple of races if nothing changed but a maybe a few lower placements. No
reason to get excited about the last race --- why bother watching or attending.
Talk about anti-climax. The only real "7th game" excitement I remember, was when Kulwicki won the Cup. It was in doubt until
the checkers waved.
It really boils down to 2 things. Either you watch, or you don't.
It's kind of like the weather --- you can moan and groan and complain, but when it comes down to it, you can't change it.
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Winning a race and running well is still a big deal, points eliminated or not.
The stand alone importance of each race will always matter.
Alex Bowman's win last week or of the most recent race, and his fans enjoyment is plenty evidence.
 
BobbyFord said:
So if someone other than Larson wins the championship today, it’ll be legit, right?
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If Denny wins it, and Larson also has a bad day, then it still be legit from the regular season points. Check out their stats, all of them close to each other. Kyle’s wins are a lot bigger number. But everything else even avg finish is extremely close
 
A few scatterred thoughts.. .

...I am not crusading or under the impression that this thread will change anything.
It is just a discussion thread with the OP asking for RF members to rate the format. I probably will not even remember what I posted in a few weeks.

I don't expect everyone to agree but my criticism of the format has nothing to do with my enthusiasm for racing. I have invested a lot in racing and I even have some scars. So no apologies for not being in love with the current format.
I also realize that we have never had a perfect system, but that doesn't validate the current system either.

I actually like the chase elimination as a tournament or whatever people want to call it. It is prestigious thing to win and I hope it continues Nascar can also pay the winner Gozillions for all care.

I just wish the historical record would list the champion as the driver who actually performed the best for the given season.
It should not be reduced down to a set of resets, or down to a single race.
 
Blaze said:
If Denny wins it, and Larson also has a bad day, then it still be legit from the regular season points. Check out their stats, all of them close to each other. Kyle’s wins are a lot bigger number. But everything else even avg finish is extremely close
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I disagree.
 
So help me if they wreck!!!
I see how this is going to be
 
Daytripper said:
With what? Even before the chase Denny would still be in contention to win the title. You can't have your cake and eat it too.
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Bro, we aren’t going to agree that this is a legitimate format to determine a champion.
Stop trying to convince me.
 
BobbyFord said:
Bro, we aren’t going to agree that this is a legitimate format to determine a champion.
Stop trying to convince me.
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That’s about pre chase. With a full season, Denny still would have a chance. Larson is almost a lock in it… but Denny would have a chance and that’s a fact.
 
Daytripper said:
But your now saying pre chase was not legitimate.
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I’m saying it didn’t need tweaking.
There have been a lot of negative changes in the sport.
Doesn’t really matter who wins races anymore, doesn’t really matter who they crown champion.
It’s just racing. Watch the cars go in circles and be happy.
 
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