Silly Season 2023

Charlie Spencer

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Have we considered that 23XI is going to just field a third car?

If not, the assumption must be that Kurt is hanging it up after 2023.

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See the discussions on where they'd get a charter from. Nobody's ruled it out.

I do think it's interesting the 23XI hasn't said anything about where they plan to put Tyler. Is it possible they don't know yet? Did they grab an available asset knowing they had 18 months to figure out what to do with it?
 

StandOnIt

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See the discussions on where they'd get a charter from. Nobody's ruled it out.

I do think it's interesting the 23XI hasn't said anything about where they plan to put Tyler. Is it possible they don't know yet? Did they grab an available asset knowing they had 18 months to figure out what to do with it?
And of course Hamlin recently tweeted that Kurt can have the job as long as he wants it. We are in the Hamlin cluster puck as far as I am concerned.
 

2 Sweet

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Sorry bud, not into conspiracies or the racial thing..wrong channel

I'm friends with a girl who works for the marketing team for one of Bubba's sponsors. In the case of this particular company, they are 100% sponsoring Bubba because he's black.

Nothing wrong with that, but some of these "conspiracies" are reality.
 

aunty dive

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Are we sure 100% its MJ? He's never really used his own money for anything, he finds investors.....the restaurants in Chicago and Chapel Hill, the Ducati Team and the Charlotte Hornets are examples. The Name and Brand of Michael Jordan as well as the Jumpman are being used sure and that is worth enough money in itself.
There are other investors in 23X1?
 

wi_racefan

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See the discussions on where they'd get a charter from. Nobody's ruled it out.

I do think it's interesting the 23XI hasn't said anything about where they plan to put Tyler. Is it possible they don't know yet? Did they grab an available asset knowing they had 18 months to figure out what to do with it?
I think that's completely possible. Sign him now and take 18 months to figure it out. I think it's a deal where you sign talent when its available, then figure out how to utilize it.
 

MRM

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Back to Kyle Busch. It's no secret drivers have been taking pay cuts over the last number of years. I really think that's been a big part of many of these early retirements. Regardless if JGR has or can get sponsorship for the 18, I'm sure they're asking Busch to take a bit of a pay cut or re-sign for the same money (which is a pay cut in today's financial environment). My guess is Busch is talking to a few other teams about getting into one of their cars and for more money. Problem is most teams aren't paying more for drivers, no matter who they are. I can see KB doing anything from being back at JGR to going to SHR to retiring.
 

StandOnIt

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I'm friends with a girl who works for the marketing team for one of Bubba's sponsors. In the case of this particular company, they are 100% sponsoring Bubba because he's black.

Nothing wrong with that, but some of these "conspiracies" are reality.
I don't call that a conspiracy bud, I call that business.
 

StandOnIt

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Back to Kyle Busch. It's no secret drivers have been taking pay cuts over the last number of years. I really think that's been a big part of many of these early retirements. Regardless if JGR has or can get sponsorship for the 18, I'm sure they're asking Busch to take a bit of a pay cut or re-sign for the same money (which is a pay cut in today's financial environment). My guess is Busch is talking to a few other teams about getting into one of their cars and for more money. Problem is most teams aren't paying more for drivers, no matter who they are. I can see KB doing anything from being back at JGR to going to SHR to retiring.
That is a whole bunch of unsubstantiated if only's and heresay. Nobody knows what these guys make, what IS known is at this level a driver needs sponsorship no matter the talent level or the team.
 

Jorge De Guzman

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There are other investors in 23X1?
I thought Denny in his recent episode on the DJR talked of having other partners besides MJ. I am trying to find it with the quick free time here. They talked about building a bigger shop and what not, and having to pause to see how things go with "NASCAR and our 23XI partners" or along those lines.
 

FLRacingFan

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I’m holding out a sliver of hope for KB to the 10, but the safe bet is still staying with JGR.
 

Jorge De Guzman

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That is a whole bunch of unsubstantiated if only's and heresay. Nobody knows what these guys make, what IS known is at this level a driver needs sponsorship no matter the talent level or the team.
Kevin Harvick said on Dale Jr's podcast that drivers arnt making what they used to make and that was cause of a beef between him and Jr because Harvick was up for a renegotiation with SHR..... and Jr said in his last year that NASCAR was rightsizing. The clip is here:
 

Jorge De Guzman

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People often refer to corporate sponsors and suppliers as “partners”.

No equity.
Are you 100% sure MJ is using 100% of his own money, I'd like to research more. The way Denny framed it in his interview, it didnt sound like sponsor partners to me, he said he had to talk over the building with them financially and see how things go with the new TV deal.
 

StandOnIt

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Kevin Harvick said on Dale Jr's podcast that drivers arnt making what they used to make and that was cause of a beef between him and Jr because Harvick was up for a renegotiation with SHR because Jr said in his last year that NASCAR was rightsizing. The clip is here:

That's Harvick he doesn't know everybodies financials.
 

aunty dive

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^^ How they spend sponsorship revenues is their business. If there were equity partners we’d be aware of them.
 

Jorge De Guzman

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^^ How they spend sponsorship revenues is their business. If there were equity partners we’d be aware of them.
so if I go on RCR, RFR or HMS.com I can find every equity partner they have?
 

FLRacingFan

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All fine options. Also Assuming with Noah thats if these drivers are available. I thought I read on here Zane is with Ford exclusively, I think Josh is tied up with JRM or so I thought I read. This is sort of a pivotal decision for RC, they have to hope whoever they choose can run well and win races because the driver of the 3 doesnt do it enough.
I think they would be a step up from Petty GMS, Erik Jones is a good option to pursue. Lots of others seem to be reaches or are affiliated with other teams/OEMs already. That would be a hell of an accomplishment, to drive both the 43 and 3.

If they can’t make that happen I think they have a good chance of becoming an extremely midfield team again.
 

aunty dive

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^^ Do corporate entities in other areas of commerce post the names of their equity investors on their websites?
 

StandOnIt

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I think they would be a step up from Petty GMS, Erik Jones is a good option to pursue. Lots of others seem to be reaches or are affiliated with other teams/OEMs already. That would be a hell of an accomplishment, to drive both the 43 and 3.

If they can’t make that happen I think they have a good chance of becoming an extremely midfield team again.
Eh, Tyler became unaffiliated with Chevy quick enough, and It's what brand is Hemric driving this week. I think a certain brand really lock drivers in but the other two don't seem to as much
 

Jorge De Guzman

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^^ Do corporate entities in other areas of commerce post the names of their equity investors on their websites?
should I google it? I have to say I really feel like this is taking a turn to you talking down to me, I mean you can just tell me flat out I am wrong.
 

Kiante

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I think they would be a step up from Petty GMS, Erik Jones is a good option to pursue. Lots of others seem to be reaches or are affiliated with other teams/OEMs already. That would be a hell of an accomplishment, to drive both the 43 and 3.

If they can’t make that happen I think they have a good chance of becoming an extremely midfield team again.
Jones would be a good fit at RCR, but here me out if Creed and Hill are not ready for that move...

I want to see Josh Berry in the 43, just sayin'. I know its early in his maturation process in NASCAR. Gosh dammit, feed it to me though.
 

aunty dive

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should I google it? I have to say I really feel like this is taking a turn to you talking down to me, I mean you can just tell me flat out I am wrong.


Your remarks about Jordan taking money from other investors for some of his business ventures did not include specifics.

Roush FENWAY KESELOWSKI. Equity investors. Marks is the ownership face of Trackhouse ... Pitbull’s involvement is a matter of public record. Jeff Gordon has an equity position in HMS ... also a matter of public record. I will guess that he didn’t bring money to the table.

Perhaps you’re suggesting that 23X1 spent sponsor dollars on their new shop and the land it sits on and are therefore “investors”. I really don’t know.
 

Jorge De Guzman

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Your remarks about Jordan taking money from other investors for some of his business ventures did not include specifics.

Roush FENWAY KESELOWSKI. Equity investors. Marks is the ownership face of Trackhouse ... Pitbull’s involvement is a matter of public record. Jeff Gordon has an equity position in HMS ... also a matter of public record. I will guess that he didn’t bring money to the table.

Perhaps you’re suggesting that 23X1 spent sponsor dollars on their new shop and the land it sits on and are therefore “investors”. I really don’t know.
When have I ever played a victim interacting with you? It doesnt take much? What? Thats some BS. You talk down to people, other people are okay with it. I dont appreciate it much.
 

28car

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Jones would be a good fit at RCR, but here me out if Creed and Hill are not ready for that move...

I want to see Josh Berry in the 43, just sayin'. I know its early in his maturation process in NASCAR. Gosh dammit, feed it to me though.
the 43 doesn't have speed, if it did Jones would be doing better

if your not driving for HMS, JGR, Penske and now Trackhouse
your lucky to have speed to keep up
 

aunty dive

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When have I ever played a victim interacting with you? It doesnt take much? What? Thats some BS. You talk down to people, other people are okay with it. I dont appreciate it much.
25 minutes ago according to the time stamp.

Nobody is ok with me or anybody else talking down to them. If I decide to actually start doing that to you, you’ll know it.
 

StandOnIt

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the 43 doesn't have speed, if it did Jones would be doing better

if your not driving for HMS, JGR, Penske and now Trackhouse
your lucky to have speed to keep up
Yeah, I thought Petty partnering with GMS would help and it has a bit. Jones has two top 5's that he didn't have last year, They are faster it looks like but they have a ways to go
 

Charlie Spencer

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I'm friends with a girl who works for the marketing team for one of Bubba's sponsors. In the case of this particular company, they are 100% sponsoring Bubba because he's black.

Nothing wrong with that, but some of these "conspiracies" are reality.
Plenty of drivers have had sponsors because they were perceived to appeal to specific demographics. In my opinion it’s better than having the family business sign the checks.
 

aunty dive

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so this is you engaging in a friendly conversation with me?
No, it isn’t. You accused me of talking down to you. I went back and re-read all of our discourse. I know what I was thinking when I made those posts. None of them were intended to impune you or your remarks.

According to yourself, “Jordan never uses his own money for anything ... he finds investors”. Obviously, your definition of investors is not the same as mine or my accountant’s. Or yours, for that matter. I’m sure your guy knows the difference between an investor, who records the investment as an asset, and a sponsor who charges it as an expense to be included with other items that reduce tax liability.
 

Jorge De Guzman

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No, it isn’t. You accused me of talking down to you. I went back and re-read all of our discourse. I know what I was thinking when I made those posts. None of them were intended to impune you or your remarks.

According to yourself, “Jordan never uses his own money for anything ... he finds investors”. Obviously, your definition of investors is not the same as mine or my accountant’s. Or yours, for that matter. I’m sure your guy knows the difference between an investor, who records the investment as an asset, and a sponsor who charges it as an expense to be included with other items that reduce tax liability.
Fair enough, I'll be honest in my time here I've never had a good read with you, I'm sure its because we are on an internet forum and not talking face to face or hearing your voice and I'll also say that has way more to do with me than you. I have had some fiery chats with you in the past up here and one or two in the podium, I always felt you came off as pretentious. I'm sure I didnt come off well either, and I really try hard to get along with everyone here. I probably should stay off of here when Iam frustrated at work, as it leads to misjudgments on my end. I was looking at MJ's involvement with 23XI through a different way in that the articles I have read about him when he invested in those restaurants, the motorcycle team and when he bought the Hornets, I had thought he had investors with him that invested in his name and brand, while yes he was the owner of those other teams he used very little of his own money. Now I cant find research now, as I dont have time but I know I have read that. I was just applying that train of thought to his involvement and ownership of his current race team. Could totally be wrong, and I just might be...but that is how I interpreted it.
 

2 Sweet

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Plenty of drivers have had sponsors because they were perceived to appeal to specific demographics. In my opinion it’s better than having the family business sign the checks.

Agreed. I have no problem with it at all.

My point is that when someone says "corporations throw money at the 23 team because of Bubba's race" it isn't untrue. It's business, not a made up conspiracy.
 

Jorge De Guzman

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Fair enough, I'll be honest in my time here I've never had a good read with you, I'm sure its because we are on an internet forum and not talking face to face or hearing your voice and I'll also say that has way more to do with me than you. I have had some fiery chats with you in the past up here and one or two in the podium, I always felt you came off as pretentious. I'm sure I didnt come off well either, and I really try hard to get along with everyone here. I probably should stay off of here when Iam frustrated at work, as it leads to misjudgments on my end. I was looking at MJ's involvement with 23XI through a different way in that the articles I have read about him when he invested in those restaurants, the motorcycle team and when he bought the Hornets, I had thought he had investors with him that invested in his name and brand, while yes he was the owner of those other teams he used very little of his own money. Now I cant find research now, as I dont have time but I know I have read that. I was just applying that train of thought to his involvement and ownership of his current race team. Could totally be wrong, and I just might be...but that is how I interpreted it.
and when I say interpret, I thought that was what Denny was talking about on Jr's Download when he referred to "Partners"
 

LewTheShoe

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Are you 100% sure MJ is using 100% of his own money, I'd like to research more. The way Denny framed it in his interview, it didnt sound like sponsor partners to me....
... If there were equity partners we’d be aware of them.
I don't see how it matters at all, but I'm pretty sure MJ and DH are *not* the only equity shareholders of 23XI. Recently I read an article somewhere that mentioned a senior executive who is involved with the Charlotte Hornets IIRC, and he was referred to as an equity owner in 23XI, alongside MJ and DH. It wouldn't surprise me if there are others as well.
 

aunty dive

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Found this.

“For the 2021 season, Michael Jordan’s team has five sponsors. Also known as the founding partners, these include Root Insurance, DoorDash, Columbia Sportswear, Dr. Pepper, and McDonald’s.”

 

jaqua19

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Well of course it's Michael Jordan but Bubba was brought in at the height of the BLM publicity and the coporations were all over it. You think its a coincidence Jordan started the team when he did and hired Bubba as the team's first driver.
Of course not.

But so ****** what?

You know what's great about what NASCAR has done with Bubba (even though he's HARDLY marketed anymore)

It's weeded out the fans that can't keep up with the world, and happily leaving them in the dust.

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jaqua19

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Ya know, it's possible to be unimpressed with Bubba's record without actively hating him. I'm waiting to see what he does with a different crew that knows which side of the wheel goes where, but I'm beginning to think 20th in points is about his max. I still like the guy. WTH, I liked Wally Dallenbach and Jimmy Spencer, and gods know they weren't burning up the record books.
Wally is the GOAT color commentator for NASCAR.

I will die on that hill. Die on it.

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