Cup RACE thread --- Bristol

RaceCritter said:
Seeing people look for a reason to clutch pearls and be outraged because a dad let his kid ride at low speed like that for a moment is sad. Considering most people over 40 somehow survived and thrived walking themselves to school by themselves and even standing in the bed of a moving pickup truck.

Now if he had done a burnout with the kid in the hood that might have been different. But by god if I were a 10-12yr old but I’d pay good money to hang of to that ride too 😜.
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Evil Knievel got a lot of us. We built some serious bike ramps in our neighborhood.
 
Charlie Spencer said:
Some still won't him escape that N-word mistake. "Never Forget, Never Forgive!" Me, I never did anything stupid in my 20s.
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Really? I have commented before that I have been surprised at how quickly this was forgotten. I never hear anything about it. I thought HMS would get more crap for signing him TBH but nothing major that I recall.
 
Chase Fan 79 said:
Really? I have commented before that I have been surprised at how quickly this was forgotten. I never hear anything about it. I thought HMS would get more crap for signing him TBH but nothing major that I recall.
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Championship in his first season was guaranteed to make people forget tbh
 
TheJester said:
Thank god thats over
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I had to agree. I actually turned it off with about 25 to go and just double checked later to make sure nothing crazy happened. Great drive by Larson obviously but terribly boring race. Barley any passing again. Track position is king. When you have that combination and a driver like Larson whose style fits the track perfectly this is what you will get. Larson running well at Bristol is nothing new. I remember him competing for wins there against KB in XFINITY in an unsponsored car. Look at MTJ - Ran up front until a speeding penalty and then went NO WHERE. I am not sure how anyone other than a Larson fan could enjoy this. NASCAR needs to fix it. The tire needs some fall off. Spring was obviously too much but there should be a happy-medium that can be found somewhere. People can say it's sour grapes or whatever because they THINK I don't like Larson but the reality is I was happy to see him earn his way into the next round without using the playoff points. It was just a boring race and I'd be saying same if Chase had led 400+ laps. I mean Chase finished 2nd and I really don't care much if this is the product we will be watching. Seeing lots of posts on X and other places were people are fed up and don't plan to go back to Bristol. I am supposed to go there for the spring race next year but now I am second guessing. I don't want to drive 16+ hours and pay hundreds of dollars to watch one car lead almost every lap and no cars be able to pass. Like I said, I know Larson fans are obviously happy and I would be if Chase had won too but I want a good on track product first and see my driver win second. This is the only problem I have with Larson too in that it's EXACTLY what I said in the spring in that he got out an complained about the tires in the spring after a really exciting race that fans loved. This time he has no complaints at all because he won one of the most boring races of the year and maybe the most boring Bristol night race ever.
 
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Not enough wrecks and cautions and restarts. They ran clean all night with long green runs while Larson stunk up the show. Fans hate that but none of them will admit it.You want proof? The spring race they were cording tires at 40 laps, plenty of wrecks, cautions and overall chaos. The fans loved it.
Goodyear said the same tire that corded at 40 laps now was able to run 140 laps. :cuckoo:
 
StandOnIt said:
Not enough wrecks and cautions and restarts. They ran clean all night with long green runs while Larson stunk up the show. Fans hate that but none of them will admit it.You want proof? The spring race they were cording tires at 40 laps, plenty of wrecks, cautions and overall chaos. The fans loved it.
Goodyear said the same tire that corded at 40 laps now was able to run 140 laps. :cuckoo:
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Maybe I don't remember the spring race well enough (I am getting old LOL) but I don't remember it for the crashes. In fact I thought the drivers did an amazing job of managing the situation and putting on a great show that was compelling and not just watching a parade. I can't speak for everyone obviously but to me it was not about the lack of crashes or cautions/restarts. It was about the inability to pass and knowing nothing was going to happen.

You can say what you want about my feelings of Larson affecting my opinion but I am all for NASCAR thriving and I know in order to do that the big names need to win races and Larson is a big name. It's like the Yankees winning is good for baseball. HMS winning is good for NASCAR in the same way. Outside of Bristol and Darlington though, where Larson dominated, HMS has been mid at best. Going into Saturday night, since Larson's win at Sonoma HMS had a fluky win from Bowman at the Chicago street race and another from Larson at Indy. Chase and Byron have been consistent but have not competed for wins since early in the season. I don't think that Larson running well at Darlington and Bristol really changes my concerns as he always runs well at those places. He will also be great at Vegas regardless.

Overall though the race was a total snoozefest and anyone who thinks otherwise is most likely sporting a number 5 hat.
 
jaqua19 said:
I've personally enjoyed the journey from a stupid, ignorant kid to a more accountable adult and father. I think these last 4 years he's shown himself to be a more mature, and decent person than he was years ago. It's why I chose to become a fan of his. I just enjoy watching people take personal accountability for their mistakes and try to change.

Larson will always be labeled as a racist by some people. And as he said in 2021, it's understandable why he would be, and he can accept that some people have the right to still judge him, because it was his **** up.
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...and oh my, oh my Katelyn Larson chugging a beer in front of the kids too!
They think this kind of behavior is normal for young adults.
The kids are doomed, don't have a chance to survive in this new world.
Before anyone gets their panties wadded up...
:sarcasm:
 
aunty dive said:
I enjoyed it. I don’t wear hats.

Larson had 26 cars 1 or more laps down. Presumably he passed cars on track as did other drivers.
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I am surprised you are not a Larson fan but notice I said "most likely." There are always exceptions and if you are one of those that's fine but the majority are speaking loud and clear that the race sucked.
 
aunty dive said:
I enjoyed it. I don’t wear hats.

Larson had 26 cars 1 or more laps down. Presumably he passed cars on track as did other drivers.
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They missed those passes. To their discredit, the gerbs talked about everything else but the racing. It was constant playoff this or that or laps of driver spotlights, or Jeff's perfect explanation of how the drivers should drive if Jeff was driving the car.
 
StandOnIt said:
They missed those passes
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I often wonder about complaints of 'no passing'. Do they mean 'no passing for the lead', or 'no passing anywhere in the field'? Timing and scoring (or being at the track) often tell a different story from what the networks choose to focus on.
 
It’s often tough to tell from a broadcast how much actual passing there is, aside from spending like the last 100 laps watching the battle for 30th place with Suarez, ignoring everything else. Often, the cameras will focus in on a side by side battle and say something along the lines of “Bell gets by Briscoe,” when in reality Bell simply held off Briscoe’s attempt at passing Bell, which obviously doesn’t actually count as a pass. There was a lot of side by side battles, but not as much actual passes. I don’t know, that’s just what I saw.
 
rd45usa said:
The other eleven cars on the lead lap also passed those lapped cars too.
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There was never a time when they were keeping track of Larson's time pulling away from the field, or intervals to second, or any of the other cars using that same info. They were focusing mainly on the playoff cars, they gave the impression that there was very little passing. I was watching on the web leader board that wasn't over half blocked off with cut line and shaded out. Their board on TV was pretty worthless for seeing the passes and progress of the field.
 
StandOnIt said:
There was never a time when they were keeping track of Larson's time pulling away from the field, or intervals to second, or any of the other cars using that same info. They were focusing mainly on the playoff cars, they gave the impression that there was very little passing. I was watching on the web leader board that wasn't over half blocked off with cut line and shaded out. Their board on TV was pretty worthless for seeing the passes and progress of the field.
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I was going to make a similar comment in the announcers thread. Based on the scoring pylon I could see positions constantly changing in the top ten that was being completely ignored. There was a lot of side by side racing lap after lap. Unfortunately the gerbs only wanted to talk about who was on the cut bubble. Sure Larson had the field covered, but there was a lot of good action.
 
The Nature Boy said:
Auto racing is really difficult to cover on TV and radio. NBC could be doing better but a lot of people’s perception of a race is determined by what happens up front because that’s what TV focuses on.
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Well when they’re showing the cut off all race from 12-16 and that “drama” is being highlighted what do you expect? From following the nascar app and listening on MRN, seems there was alot going on through the field from passing on track, to pit road mishaps to strategy. Shame that was shelved just to highlight a few guys who had no chance in hell of winning a championship to begin with.
 
antman12 said:
View attachment 80579
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There’s certainly an element of truth to this, but generally speaking, the race was missing something compared to what you normally expect out of the Bristol night race. I’m glad for the legitimate winner though. If one guy is gonna dominate all day or night, I’d rather that performance not be marred by a couple of overtimes at the end.
 
Chase Fan 79 said:
I had to agree. I actually turned it off with about 25 to go and just double checked later to make sure nothing crazy happened. Great drive by Larson obviously but terribly boring race. Barley any passing again. Track position is king. When you have that combination and a driver like Larson whose style fits the track perfectly this is what you will get. Larson running well at Bristol is nothing new. I remember him competing for wins there against KB in XFINITY in an unsponsored car. Look at MTJ - Ran up front until a speeding penalty and then went NO WHERE. I am not sure how anyone other than a Larson fan could enjoy this. NASCAR needs to fix it. The tire needs some fall off. Spring was obviously too much but there should be a happy-medium that can be found somewhere. People can say it's sour grapes or whatever because they THINK I don't like Larson but the reality is I was happy to see him earn his way into the next round without using the playoff points. It was just a boring race and I'd be saying same if Chase had led 400+ laps. I mean Chase finished 2nd and I really don't care much if this is the product we will be watching. Seeing lots of posts on X and other places were people are fed up and don't plan to go back to Bristol. I am supposed to go there for the spring race next year but now I am second guessing. I don't want to drive 16+ hours and pay hundreds of dollars to watch one car lead almost every lap and no cars be able to pass. Like I said, I know Larson fans are obviously happy and I would be if Chase had won too but I want a good on track product first and see my driver win second. This is the only problem I have with Larson too in that it's EXACTLY what I said in the spring in that he got out an complained about the tires in the spring after a really exciting race that fans loved. This time he has no complaints at all because he won one of the most boring races of the year and maybe the most boring Bristol night race ever.
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Barely any passing is nonsensically untrue.

I've referenced this. MTJ was the ONLY fast car that couldn't pass. He also clearly quit.
Chase Fan 79 said:
I had to agree. I actually turned it off with about 25 to go and just double checked later to make sure nothing crazy happened. Great drive by Larson obviously but terribly boring race. Barley any passing again. Track position is king. When you have that combination and a driver like Larson whose style fits the track perfectly this is what you will get. Larson running well at Bristol is nothing new. I remember him competing for wins there against KB in XFINITY in an unsponsored car. Look at MTJ - Ran up front until a speeding penalty and then went NO WHERE. I am not sure how anyone other than a Larson fan could enjoy this. NASCAR needs to fix it. The tire needs some fall off. Spring was obviously too much but there should be a happy-medium that can be found somewhere. People can say it's sour grapes or whatever because they THINK I don't like Larson but the reality is I was happy to see him earn his way into the next round without using the playoff points. It was just a boring race and I'd be saying same if Chase had led 400+ laps. I mean Chase finished 2nd and I really don't care much if this is the product we will be watching. Seeing lots of posts on X and other places were people are fed up and don't plan to go back to Bristol. I am supposed to go there for the spring race next year but now I am second guessing. I don't want to drive 16+ hours and pay hundreds of dollars to watch one car lead almost every lap and no cars be able to pass. Like I said, I know Larson fans are obviously happy and I would be if Chase had won too but I want a good on track product first and see my driver win second. This is the only problem I have with Larson too in that it's EXACTLY what I said in the spring in that he got out an complained about the tires in the spring after a really exciting race that fans loved. This time he has no complaints at all because he won one of the most boring races of the year and maybe the most boring Bristol night race ever.
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The no passing this is nonsensical.

One car dominating is skewing the entire perception of what happened outside of that. MTJ was the ONLY car who went no where. That was a balance thing/MTJ quitting thing.

See below.

I rewatched the broadcast last night, and the undisputable objective reality is that people are making things up, or allowing the 465 laps lead to poorly represent what happened.

The below was from the end of stage 1 ALONE.

jaqua19 said:
Rewatching it right now.

Nvm about the early stage passing.

The last 50 laps of stage 1, the broadcast flat out shows the 24, 14, 20 19 all racing each other. We see the 20 pass the 14 on boardcast too.

We see the 19 pass the 48. 20 pass the 14, 24, 19, and the 48 after they race for a bit with 50 to go. . We see Briscoe moving forward. We also see the 11 pass the 54. We see the 11 pass the 14. We see the 54 pass the 14 and then the three of them racing 3 wide as Hamlin passes the 14. We see the 9 make passes as well.

And this just to end stage 1.

This was all broadcast.

We saw this ALL race. The racing from p2 on back was fantastic.
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Bubba drove from p7 to p3 the final run of the race. Hamlin drove from p8 to p2 in stage 2. Cars passed all throughout the field. Chris Bell, arguably the loudest complainer about Bristol said the racing was fantastic.

The no passing thing isn't true.

I think this car has issues and the no passing thing is VERY real. That wasn't this race. It just happened that one car dominated..

As for tire wear. If you listened to the radio, the entire field was running at like 85%. Tire conservation happened the entire race.

The race may have been boring. But no tire wear or passing isn't true.
 
I think the perception that there was no passing is a combination of Larson's dominance and the TV coverage focused on of the cut line drivers. According to Nascar loop data at Racing-reference.info, there were 2,287 green flag passes for position in the race. The previous 3 Bristol fall races, 1,868, 2,690, 1,881.

There were also 785 Quality Passes, which are green flag passes of a car in the top 15. If Larson isn't dominating I suspect we would have seen a good battle because Elliot, Hamlin, Bubba, Bell, Blaney, Briscoe, etc, were back there racing and passing each other. Even though Gibbs got stuck behind Suarez, we saw numerous other drivers passing both of them.

That said, I agree that there is an issue with this car/package on short tracks, I'm just saying I don't think it was as bad as it appeared.
 
dgbullfrog said:
I think the perception that there was no passing is a combination of Larson's dominance and the TV coverage focused on of the cut line drivers. According to Nascar loop data at Racing-reference.info, there were 2,287 green flag passes for position in the race. The previous 3 Bristol fall races, 1,868, 2,690, 1,881.

There were also 785 Quality Passes, which are green flag passes of a car in the top 15. If Larson isn't dominating I suspect we would have seen a good battle because Elliot, Hamlin, Bubba, Bell, Blaney, Briscoe, etc, were back there racing and passing each other. Even though Gibbs got stuck behind Suarez, we saw numerous other drivers passing both of them.

That said, I agree that there is an issue with this car/package on short tracks, I'm just saying I don't think it was as bad as it appeared.
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Something being kind of overlooked is that one common thing with them not being able to pass seemed to quite often be Suarez, even Larson when lapping him Saturday.
His teammate is supposedly the hardest guy to pass now, like Newman used to be. It seems to be rubbing off on him.
 
jaqua19 said:
Barely any passing is nonsensically untrue.

I've referenced this. MTJ was the ONLY fast car that couldn't pass. He also clearly quit.

The no passing this is nonsensical.

One car dominating is skewing the entire perception of what happened outside of that. MTJ was the ONLY car who went no where. That was a balance thing/MTJ quitting thing.

See below.

I rewatched the broadcast last night, and the undisputable objective reality is that people are making things up, or allowing the 465 laps lead to poorly represent what happened.

The below was from the end of stage 1 ALONE.



Bubba drove from p7 to p3 the final run of the race. Hamlin drove from p8 to p2 in stage 2. Cars passed all throughout the field. Chris Bell, arguably the loudest complainer about Bristol said the racing was fantastic.

The no passing thing isn't true.

I think this car has issues and the no passing thing is VERY real. That wasn't this race. It just happened that one car dominated..

As for tire wear. If you listened to the radio, the entire field was running at like 85%. Tire conservation happened the entire race.

The race may have been boring. But no tire wear or passing isn't true.
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You're digging deep man. It was boring race and the majority have spoken about that. Be happy your driver won. Be happy they dominated but the race was plain and simple a boring snoozefest and not just because Larson dominated. Because nothing much really happened at all. It was a 500 lap parade with very little passing. The good cars like Hamlin and Chase and others could get a few on restarts if they had position but that was really it. The tires just did not fall off enough. You can sugar coat it however you want and try to pry facts like that out but according the Gluck poll about 75% said the race was not good and that's the worst since he started doing these polls for Bristol including the so-so at best dirt races.. I am sure many of those are Larson fans too who are capable of being happy their driver won but at the same time acknowledging a stinker when they see one. If Chase had won (and let's be real he had a great night and drove maybe his best race of the year) I'd be saying the same EXACT thing. BORING. I am in process of talking with my Nephew right now as to if we really want to sink our money in Bristol nest year. Used to be you could not get a ticket to Bristol - now do you really want one is the question. I still may go just to say I saw it once like I plan to do with Indy as well but if I go it will be with zero expectations for a good race. You enjoy it though and keep seeing what you see. :)
 
Chase Fan 79 said:
You're digging deep man. It was boring race and the majority have spoken about that. Be happy your driver won. Be happy they dominated but the race was plain and simple a boring snoozefest and not just because Larson dominated. Because nothing much really happened at all. It was a 500 lap parade with very little passing. The good cars like Hamlin and Chase and others could get a few on restarts if they had position but that was really it. The tires just did not fall off enough. You can sugar coat it however you want and try to pry facts like that out but according the Gluck poll about 75% said the race was not good and that's the worst since he started doing these polls for Bristol including the so-so at best dirt races.. I am sure many of those are Larson fans too who are capable of being happy their driver won but at the same time acknowledging a stinker when they see one. If Chase had won (and let's be real he had a great night and drove maybe his best race of the year) I'd be saying the same EXACT thing. BORING. I am in process of talking with my Nephew right now as to if we really want to sink our money in Bristol nest year. Used to be you could not get a ticket to Bristol - now do you really want one is the question. I still may go just to say I saw it once like I plan to do with Indy as well but if I go it will be with zero expectations for a good race. You enjoy it though and keep seeing what you see. :)
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Gluck was whining about the race before it was halfway done. Nothing like the guy giving the pole to be queering the deal lol. Of course the herd followed. Baaa.
 
Jorge De Guzman said:
Kyle…you can’t say THESE THINGS!!!!!
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From what I remember in my career before the Next Gen car was we had cars with some disparity that could run closer to one another in traffic and a wheel/tire combo that got hotter which in essences gave us less grip on the long run. I’ve ran with 900hp all the way down to 650hp or less potentially, high downforce, low downforce and everything in between. Bristol’s ALWAYS been tough to pass. Speed on pit road and most likely there’s a good chance you’re going a lap down on the next run. That’s the way it is and has been for a very long time.We had more natural cautions from wrecks because cars could run closer and we never quite made it a full fuel run because eventually someone’s RF tire would explode from overheating. I’m not saying I want tires to explode again but we’re trying to crutch this race car on short tracks with the tire and then blame Goodyear every week cause cars can’t pass. I don’t have the answer to fix what we currently have and neither do you but please stop blaming Goodyear. It’s not a tire problem. And also, have any of you ran around Bristol with or without PJ1? Or resin for that matter. Yeah that’s right… so
🤐
Temper your expectations. We’re driving spec race cars.
 
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